You know whats great against Nym and Miranda? An Ion Cannon.
Can't drop bombs (or advanced sensors) if your Ioned.

Otherwise I agree with the OP, Quickdraw is a great response to Nym.

@Biophysical is correct I'd wager from my experiences thus far, but I have another inquiry that is somewhat related but may be a bunny-trail: why is FG still creating/manufacturing Ace counters anyway? It seems the Age of graceful, expensive, fragile so hard to hit Aces are a bygone era, why all the pile on? And why in the h*** would a bomber pilot be so **** good at flying in that brick of a ship?

Anyway, VI Vessery with a tractor makes Nym fly like the brick that he should have been.

2 minutes ago, Kdubb said:

Ok I'm seriously not on either side of this discussion but if there is one thing that has been debunked time and time again it is that you can simply "fly better" to not get an ace melted by Nym. This is not an argument unless you are flying against an incompetent player.

Of course it's an argument. Most High PS Aces have a better dial than Nym, a faster dial than Nym, more repositioning options (Boost AND Barrel Roll) and better action economy.

OK, Nym moves after you and can barrel roll to adjust. Great. That doesn't mean you can't control engagement with your squishy ace and prevent yourself from ending up in range one. If you're flying Soontir, the Inquistor or Fenn Rau and Nym's on the other side of the board, assume your ace is the priority target and make it difficult for your opponent. Block him or engage him with other aspects of your list. Use the asteroids to prevent a direct approach. Take shots from range 3 where you can, then reposition to prevent him getting too close.

Maybe some players are so used to bum-rushing opponents at range one with Fenn Rau they've forgotten how to control range, but this isn't exactly groundbreaking stuff @Kdubb.

2 minutes ago, AngryAlbatross said:

Can't drop bombs (or advanced sensors) if your Ioned.

Unless you've got Genius, of course. But if you get hit by a Genius bomblet from Nym when you've ioned him the previous turn, then you deserve everything you get.

7 minutes ago, clanofwolves said:

@Biophysical is correct I'd wager from my experiences thus far, but I have another inquiry that is somewhat related but may be a bunny-trail: why is FG still creating/manufacturing Ace counters anyway? It seems the Age of graceful, expensive, fragile so hard to hit Aces are a bygone era, why all the pile on? And why in the h*** would a bomber pilot be so **** good at flying in that brick of a ship?

Anyway, VI Vessery with a tractor makes Nym fly like the brick that he should have been.

Nym isn't really just an ace counter. He can combat quite a few more threats than that in exchange for his squishiness. Countering aces is just an ancillary feature that people have fixated on

Bombs are great v fair ships and dengar cause it doesn't trigger him, and ps 10 helps avoid his arc anyway

4 minutes ago, FTS Gecko said:

Of course it's an argument. Most High PS Aces have a better dial than Nym, a faster dial than Nym, more repositioning options (Boost AND Barrel Roll) and better action economy.

OK, Nym moves after you and can barrel roll to adjust. Great. That doesn't mean you can't control engagement with your squishy ace and prevent yourself from ending up in range one. If you're flying Soontir, the Inquistor or Fenn Rau and Nym's on the other side of the board, assume your ace is the priority target and make it difficult for your opponent. Block him or engage him with other aspects of your list. Use the asteroids to prevent a direct approach. Take shots from range 3 where you can, then reposition to prevent him getting too close.

Maybe some players are so used to bum-rushing opponents at range one with Fenn Rau they've forgotten how to control range, but this isn't exactly groundbreaking stuff @Kdubb.

It's literally impossible to take pot shots on an advanced sensor nym without opening yourself up to bombs. There's no "outplaying" involved. Nym can dial a 3 bank and either bomb you or not get shot, depending on the angle. Of course both are possible.

Yeah @Biophysical you're right, QD does totally destroy nym, I think the main problem is that it's a very hard Rock paper scissors. Kylo also destroys nym, does it in a manner some would consider... Unnatural

9 minutes ago, Boom Owl said:

PS11 or PS10 bid helps sure.

I think the better question though is how many really fun ships across all factions does Nym out right table with pre-movement bomb dropping. If you fly anything in the PS 7-9 range your in trouble. Its still winnable. Everythings winnable. Its just sorta rough.

What I'm trying to say, and apparently failing at, is that even if ships have horrible matchups, lists can mitigate that bad matchup by having a variety of capabilities in a list. A PS11 Quickdraw is very strong against a lot of traditional ace predators, so she helps make those aces viable.

12 minutes ago, FTS Gecko said:

Unless you've got Genius, of course. But if you get hit by a Genius bomblet from Nym when you've ioned him the previous turn, then you deserve everything you get.

But, you know exactly where that bomb is going to be (right where Nym sits at the start of the activation phase) and can plan to be away from it.

edit: sorry, misunderstood what you were saying.

10 minutes ago, Brunas said:

Yeah @Biophysical you're right, QD does totally destroy nym, I think the main problem is that it's a very hard Rock paper scissors. Kylo also destroys nym, does it in a manner some would consider... Unnatural

Individual ship high polarity matchups do not mean high polarity list matchups.

Quickdraw is not is 60ish point Decimator that has lots of bad matchups, she's a a modestly priced, widely effective ship with a couple great matchups, a lot of solid matchups and, and very few terrible matchups. She lets you have a real list, with ships you like.

I guess the way I'm reading it is a lot of people are looking at the rock/paper/scissor comparison for match ups through the lens of a 1v1 (such as Nym vs Fel/QD) but the reality is while Nym costs roughly half a list to put on the table, most of the things he counters only cost 1/3rd of a list, leaving more room to fit in counters within that list. People worry about the 1v1 but in truth if you have a good mix of damage types/ship archetypes in your squad you should (in theory) be able to handle multiple types of match ups, primarily by keeping (or baiting) your weak link (Fel) away from its hard counter in your opponents list (Nym) and focusing on presenting that problem piece with your own problem for your opponent to have to solve (QD). Am I interpreting that right @Biophysical?

2 minutes ago, Not_A_Shoe said:

I guess the way I'm reading it is a lot of people are looking at the rock/paper/scissor comparison for match ups through the lens of a 1v1 (such as Nym vs Fel/QD) but the reality is while Nym costs roughly half a list to put on the table, most of the things he counters only cost 1/3rd of a list, leaving more room to fit in counters within that list. People worry about the 1v1 but in truth if you have a good mix of damage types/ship archetypes in your squad you should (in theory) be able to handle multiple types of match ups, primarily by keeping (or baiting) your weak link (Fel) away from its hard counter in your opponents list (Nym) and focusing on presenting that problem piece with your own problem for your opponent to have to solve (QD). Am I interpreting that right @Biophysical?

Absolutely right.

I think the main issue is Nym is SO good against aces it becomes very polarizing to play. I like X-Wing more when it's not 100-0 stompfests, and that's what Nym is- a way to table an opponent on turn 3 because they had the audacity to bring an ace list. It's also rough because it's not like he takes aces apart over many turns- it's fast. I've seen quite a few games where Nym instantly obliterates a 35 point ace, in the first couple of turns. Honestly, playing vs. Nym reminds me a lot of pre-nerf Phantom.

24 minutes ago, Biophysical said:

It has been correctly observed that PS 10 Nym makes life very hard for PS9 Imperial Aces. The Bomblet Generator and Autoblaster Turret and extreme maneuverability of Advanced Sensors Nym counter all of, say, Soontir Fel's strengths.

There's a funny thing about this game, though, it's not even that unjust. Fel is 34-35 points. The squirreliest Nym build is 43 points. That's a big difference. Nym should have a big advantage. The extreme one-sidedness of this matchup is not ideal, but look at Fel vs Rey or a Brobot or two TLTs, where Fel can punch way above his weight class.

Even better, Imperials have their own ship that causes Nym problems. Quickdraw, VI, FCS, and LWF costs 34 points, and is extraordinarily good against Nym. None of Nym's mobility tricks are that good agaisnt PS11, because he's flying blind. He can't even predict that well against Quickdraw because The rear arc gives Quickdraw too many good moves. Nym's lousy AGI1 means even Quickdraw's rear arc is doing damage. On top of all this, Quickdraw's 6 hit points aren't all that afraid of Bomblet Generator, and she sometimes can use it as a tool when she flies into Range 1 and gets two Range 1 shots before Nym will even get to fire at PS10.

This is a ship which has real and substantial advantages against Nym, and is very strong against almost everything else, and costs a good 9 points less than Nym. If Nym is unfair to PS9 aces, and costs more, and that is considered unjust, then what do you call it when Quickdraw is less than Nym and has an advantageous matchup?

And yet which pilot is top meta...? Quickdraw is good but not enough to compete with most of the current top builds: http://meta-wing.com/ship_combos?

Quickdraw vs Nym is nowhere near as unfair as Nym vs Aces. Nym can still survive at least 3 Quickdraw shots (more likely 4-5, his defense is NOT bad). He can 1 shot many aces if he ever gets to range 1 just once (easy for him with no need fro focus/TL). 4 undefendable hits/turn is just too much. Aces were already struggling, now they just cant compete. Even Fenn took a major drop in ranking.

The bad design decisions just keep comming. It wont matter now if they nerf Jumps, mindlink and slam. They have already been replaced by more OP stuff. Both Lowrisk and Nym already rank higher than triple jumps or Miranda. And FFG said they did not intend to design power creeps? Please...

Just now, Thormind said:

And FFG said they did not intend to design power creeps? Please...

It's either intent or incompetence.

@Biophysical

I think you make a great point actually and its a great topic. PS11 & PS10 goes a long way against Nym and its not all doom and gloom.

Staying above Nym's PS, staying away, and hopefully....being able to also hold up against other stuff its a plan at least.

That other big ship flying next to Nym though ( Dengar ) sorta complicates things though.

That said this lil guy is a tough sob.

Probably the only thing QD is bad against is swarms or a super reliably 5die attack. Typically even if she dies the first round, long as it took all enemy ships to do it and she got decent attacks off that round, she still did work.

sorry, but a topic about "Nym beats Soontir Fel" makes me feel like reading something as: "Rock beats Scissors. Nerf Rock please".

6 minutes ago, Scumwing Apologist said:

I think the main issue is Nym is SO good against aces it becomes very polarizing to play. I like X-Wing more when it's not 100-0 stompfests, and that's what Nym is- a way to table an opponent on turn 3 because they had the audacity to bring an ace list. It's also rough because it's not like he takes aces apart over many turns- it's fast. I've seen quite a few games where Nym instantly obliterates a 35 point ace, in the first couple of turns. Honestly, playing vs. Nym reminds me a lot of pre-nerf Phantom.

I mean, you DID have the audcity to bring an ace list

If you bring a skew, you WILL run into bad matchups. That is true across literally every game

If you bring soonts and the name SF with VI, you will better be able to deal with them

This isn't a difficult concept. Guaranteed damage ALWAYS ****** over low hp aces and if you're not prepared to adapt to that fact then you have to accept the consequences plain and simple

1 hour ago, ficklegreendice said:

Doesn't even seem you need ps 11 for nym

Smart use of aux arc, flying away to avoid bombletts, and his god awful defenses prove to be a big threat regardless

Yea, but ps11-with BG is just a free win.

Lol at the people that say fly better...

Lets say you are facing the standard VI, Adv Sensor, Bomblet Nym. Only place he doesn't bomb you is Range 3 BEHIND him. Now let's say you are Soontir/Jax/Inquisitor, you move into Range 3 behind him because you flew good and didn't want to get bombed. Nym now moves and he's out of range because you were Range 3 behind him...

Nym isn't unbeatable. I haven't lost to him yet. But I've been bringing 6 hit point SF's and a 5 hit point OL, oh and Palp to Palp a blank on the bombs. However, there's no way I'd win any of those games without a built in way to counter him. You can't just "fly better" versus him. You have to LIST better.

8 minutes ago, Thormind said:

Quickdraw vs Nym is nowhere near as unfair as Nym vs Aces. Nym can still survive at least 3 Quickdraw shots (more likely 4-5, his defense is NOT bad). He can 1 shot many aces if he ever gets to range 1 just once (easy for him with no need fro focus/TL). 4 undefendable hits/turn is just too much. Aces were already struggling, now they just cant compete. Even Fenn took a major drop in ranking.

Nym is about 10 points more than the aces he dumps on. He outpoints them and has a good matchup, it will be one sided. Quickdraw us almost 10 points less than Nym. If it's not an absolute hard counter, that's 100% okay.

2 minutes ago, Thormind said:

Quickdraw vs Nym is nowhere near as unfair as Nym vs Aces. Nym can still survive at least 3 Quickdraw shots (more likely 4-5, his defense is NOT bad). He can 1 shot many aces if he ever gets to range 1 just once (easy for him with no need fro focus/TL). 4 undefendable hits/turn is just too much. Aces were already struggling, now they just cant compete. Even Fenn took a major drop in ranking.

This is a good point. Nothing counters Nym even close to how Nym counters aces. It's like playing Rock-Paper-Scissors, and paper takes 3 tries to kill rock- yet rock can 1v3 multiple scissors.

It is also worth noting how Fenn fares with Nym around- IE not well at all. I think we can all agree that Fenn is the most powerful ace by a wide margin- and even he can't compete in a meta with Nyms all over. I think they made a huge mistake giving Nym such a high PS- I personally would have made him 6 or 7- then at least with VI you'd have to bid to out PS a 9 ace- as it is now VI is just stapled on and makes all PS9 aces instantly obsolete. Just IMO but I think dropping him to PS 6 or 7 would be a perfect fix.

@Scumwing Apologist

If he topped out at PS9 I imagine things would be a bit different. Other PS9 aces across factions would still have a chance with enough bid. Nym would still be able to bring the pain when "guessing" or doing the same thing he does now against lower PS. Would probably see more TLT on the Scrugg as the cost comes down with a lower PS....so maybe on net it would land somewhere similar.

Nothing counters anything as hard as guaranteed damage counters aces

****, sometimes you couldn't even run without bids because then you get ****** by OTHER aces arc dodging you

4 minutes ago, Tbetts94 said:

Lets say you are facing the standard VI, Adv Sensor, Bomblet Nym. Only place he doesn't bomb you is Range 3 BEHIND him. Now let's say you are Soontir/Jax/Inquisitor, you move into Range 3 behind him because you flew good and didn't want to get bombed. Nym now moves and he's out of range because you were Range 3 behind him...

Where did you start? Where did Nym start? Where is the terrain? Where is the rest of your list? Where is the rest of Nym's list?

It's a decent counter-argument in a total vacuum though, I'll give you that.