Watched a game recently and the person used ACM's and they seemed reasonably effective. I've always been on the APT boat(ha, A PT boat) but i was curious what the forums thoughts were. Go go collective wisdom of the masses.

Depends on the rest of your fleet. If you are drilling one hull zone (XI7) go APT, if you are blowing away shields with coordinated firepower ACM can get you more damage.

also depends on your prey. Vs smaller ships APT all day as one critical can take 1/4 of their hull before shields are even down

1 hour ago, dominosfleet said:

Watched a game recently and the person used ACM's and they seemed reasonably effective. I've always been on the APT boat(ha, A PT boat) but i was curious what the forums thoughts were. Go go collective wisdom of the masses.

There's a lot of good reasons to choose one over the other , but it really depends on what job you have in mind for your APT/ACM-equipped ship. Both upgrades are good, though. To oversimplify, APTs are better against lower-hull ships and ACMs are better against higher-hull ships (particularly those counting on redirects later on). If you're not really sure which to take, APTs usually win out because of their lower cost, but the ACMs can do a ton of damage in the right situations too.

With External Racks getting very popular, I can see ACMs becoming more popular on dedicated torpedo boats (Gladiators, MC30s) as the other ordnance ships will generally have External Racks, which make their owner quite capable at swatting down small ships and therefore having something around to put some extra hurt on a larger ship is more welcome.

I used to exclusively ACM, I like cutting a ships shields by 3 for one crit, but if I'm playing competitively I lately have gone with apt for more reliable hull damage.

ACM with screed. Old skool, but lethal.

For me, ACM are more expensive, but more reliable. You know what they're going to do.

APT, on the other hand, still feel more effective for smaller cost. I mean, in some ways, ACM adds 2 damage, while APT 'only' adds one. But there are certainly circumstances where APT will add just as much (Structural Damage) or potentially more (Projector Misaligned, Shield Failure) damage than ACM.

Also, the whole 'ACM vs. big ships, APT vs. small', doesn't quite work for me. For me it's closer to ACM vs. big ships because, generally speaking, they aren't all that effective vs. small. And APT vs. everything. Sure APT is great agains small ships. But they don't really lose any of that effectiveness against large ships. It just matters in a different way.

By this I mean that against a small ship the damage card itself, irrespective of which one it is, is quite painful to a small ship.

Whereas against a large ship there are more face up damage card effects that can have a large impact on the target's life expectancy and effectiveness.

This doesn't make APT better at killing large ships than ACM (though with luck they can be), but does mean they often aren't that far behind.

@Snipafist codified the general logic best, but the way I remember it is that you use ACMs when you plan to just hammer away, shoveling damage on, and APTs when you plan to nuke a target. A small note that is often forgotten in these discussions, if you have an ACM ship, remember to accuracy brace tokens before redirects. It seems simple on paper, but I know I've forgotten that and benefited from others forgetting that on several occasions.

Dodonna loves the APT.

ACM's are nice, but I've gravitated to apt's myself of late.

For the cost APT is generally better, you can fit more things into your list. Shield damage is nice, but crits can lead to more problems.

Depends on your target. ACMs are good for two types of ships: things that have lots of hull but few shields (Nebulons, Hammerheads, Quasar Fire, Interdictors) and ships that are entirely or mostly dependant on redirects for damage mitigation (CR90s, MC30s, Arquitens, even some MC80 builds).

APTs works really well vs ships with thick shields, large armaments, and more balanced defense tokens. They also work better vs ships that cam be rammed to death. APTs also really work well vs ships where a change of armament or attack capability could radically decrease the value of that ship. Dodonna also loves the ability to pick from a range of optional critical results, as it improves the ability to remove shields or defenses before three other damage is applied or the target can retaliate.

External Racks

To be honest, I've found ACMs particularly useful with bomber fleets. I take Norra and 3 Ys as well as a jumble of other fighters in my sato fleets. Bombers go first Crit/hit for essentially 3 damage each until the shields are gone. Then my Mc30's throw black crits from long range. sure, they typically brace down the standard damage from 5 to 3 but with the shields shredded ACMs is basically 2 free damage a shot. A good double arc and a couple of 30s will put an ISD in it's place.

I definitely agree with everything stated above too.

29 minutes ago, Darth Sanguis said:

A good double arc and a couple of 30s will put an ISD in it's place.

Seems like a Rebel wouldn't want to put an ISD in it's place. We all know an ISDs proper place is plowing through the scattered remains of blasted rebel ships.

The choice is between 3 now:

External racks: For "disposable" ships like raiders and hammerheads that need one turn of punching up

APT: Use basically anywhere. In particular, in fleets with Dodonna or X17s

ACM: Think about if you have a redirect- or repair-heavy meta. Without being able to quantify additional damage from crits, ACMs kill MC80s, ISDs, etc faster. Once you bust shields, 2 damage to hull is harder to repair than 1.

I think APTs are probably the better deal, but a ACMs have a decent home.

When I first started playing the game in Wave 2, I was a ACM user, but as I have progressed in the game I value face up crits much more. The right crit can be a game changer and you save 2pts. on top of it. It was a no brainer for me.

1 hour ago, Megatronrex said:

Seems like a Rebel wouldn't want to put an ISD in it's place. We all know an ISDs proper place is plowing through the scattered remains of blasted rebel ships. the sands of a backwater desert planet after receiving rebel butt-whoopin'.

FIXED*

I only use APTs on raiders. Anything bigger gets ACMs, anything smaller, (for now only the Hammerheads,) gets external racks.

I went back and forth for a year before I settled on this setup. ACMs just gave me fragged enemy ships, so many times, just when I needed it. APTs, can end up a bust and almost a waste of points if they draw a card that provides an effect that does very little in the given situation.

There is a very good reason ACM is more expensive, it has a better effect.

I have never taken ACMs and wished at any point in the game that I had APTs instead...

The reverse has not been my experience. That may just be my luck, but in that case, I would be a fool to go against my own luck.