So, I had this thought at work today. My current campaign started under the Saga rules, and we've switched to FFG (and are loving it), but the rules (or more accurately, lack thereof) for languages bothers me somewhat.

For background: the game is set in a homebrew setting, ignoring all post-NJO Legends continuity and set a thousand years after the NJO (called the "Vong Wars" in-universe), where the GFFA collapsed a hundred or so years after the Vong Wars, and the Jedi Order and Imperial Remnant both stepped in to try and protect people from the chaos, and a Second Galactic Empire rose from the ashes. Within the last few years, the Ubese had mysteriously pulled back into their home system, making a lot of people nervous, before exploding out with a warfleet and generally carrying on cranky. The PCs are a Jedi Apprentice, a Force-Sensitive non-Jedi, and a combat medic droid, who all picked up Ubese language pretty early on in the campaign (since being able to understand their enemies would be somewhat important).

So, I had the thought of creating a "Language" skill, functioning as a Knowledge skill (tied to Intellect).

Language works a bit differently from regular skills, in that it provides a certain number of known languages based on attribute and ranks:

1 Intellect: 1 language.

2 Int: 2 languages.

3 Int: 4 languages.

4 Int: 8 languages.

5 Int: 16 languages.

So 1 Intellect basically grants you the ability to speak at all (in your native tongue, presumably), while two makes you fluent in two languages (since just about everyone in Star Wars knows more than one language). Actually buying ranks adds languages equal to what the base characteristic gives at that level, so having one Intellect and 1 rank in Language lets you know two languages, 2 Int and 2 ranks lets you know 4, 2 Int and 1 rank would be 3.

Language would normally be rolled very rarely, typically when speaking a language you are technically fluent in but still don't have a complete grasp of, and you might need to grope for a specific word or remember how to phrase a particular idiom (think Thrawn consulting Eli Vanto for certain Basic words in the Thrawn novel). Droids whose primary function is translation, or droids/characters equipped with a "translator matrix" implant, can roll Language to determine if a previously-unknown language is "close enough" to a language they already know to communicate with some effectiveness, Advantage and/or Triumph can be spent on such a roll to permanently add that language to their list of known languages without investing any ranks in the Language skill or increasing their Intellect.

Thoughts?

I prefer RAW here where if the players need to understand they do, if the plot requires them not to, then they don't.

We do it this way: per RAW, characters can speak any language that works in their background. Once play begins, as they encounter languages in-game, they make a Knowledge: Xenology check. The difficulty is based on the obscurity of the language: Easy for common tongues like Huttese, Average for well-traveled species languages and trade languages, more difficult for less well traveled species, even more for obscure or dead languages. We add boost or setback based on the location: same slice of the galaxy gets a boost, where a character from the Core rolling for familiarity with a Wild-Space trade tongue might easily have to deal with three setback.

It's worked well for us so far, and allows for some surprises due to the variance in the dice. It's nice when your brute has to translate for your face, if only for comedic value.

I'd say that if you really need to have a "Language" skill in the game, just use Knowledge: Xenology.

JRRP's post has some very solid suggestions on how to determine the difficulty, and the GM can freely add setback or boost dice based on a PC's background.

I echo JRRP and Donovan. We do it roughly similarly to what JRRP described. One of my players has specialized in Xenology, and when we encounter non-Humans, she often asks to roll Xenology to see if she knows the language and culture of the person. On a success (and especially with Advantages) I give her a boost die or two to her interactions with the non-Human NPC to account for her knowledge of linguistic and cultural nuance.

Sounds like you're having trouble letting go of this unnecessarily rigid portion of more traditional gaming, OP.

I would encourage you to continue to work toward embracing the narrative-focused elements of this system.

We handle it similar to ithers above, which could be summarized as:

" Don't let the fact that there are 6,000,000 forms of communication get in the way of a good story. "

5 hours ago, emsquared said:

Sounds like you're having trouble letting go of this unnecessarily rigid portion of more traditional gaming, OP.

I would encourage you to continue to work toward embracing the narrative-focused elements of this system.

We handle it similar to ithers above, which could be summarized as:

" Don't let the fact that there are 6,000,000 forms of communication get in the way of a good story. "

Or do let the fact that it does get in the way, to make a good story (if that makes sense to you, then you are better than me, but I hope you understand what Im getting at.

36 minutes ago, syrath said:

Or do let the fact that it does get in the way, to make a good story (if that makes sense to you, then you are better than me, but I hope you understand what Im getting at.

Kind of exactly what I was going with. Firstly, to make protocol droids like C-3PO have a point (even if the players decided they hated the one I gave them in the very first session, and he hasn't returned since) but also because the Ubese speaking only their own language was their first step in operational security. So the players immediately circumvented it by all learning that language as quickly as the feat/Int progression in Saga would let them. Which is fine, makes sense in the story and all, but I want to tangibly reward that work somehow. And, perhaps, have it be that they know Ubese at the expense of other languages that may come in handy sometime down the line. . .

Though, some of the characters were starting to run out of "commonly useful" languages to know, so this may be less of an issue. Oh, and one of the players is a Ryn, who specifically took Binary so he could do the "Ryn-whistle" trick to talk to astromech droids. Which hasn't come up yet, but could.

I do it narratively, it's what ever the story calls for sure you can speak to that guy but that one over there may speak a different dilec or some garbled up language. It all depends on ware I want the story to go. It's up to the players how they want to overcome the challenge.

And, if you do wish to have languages be a "thing," you can also always adopt the old WEG rule for Wookiees:

If at least one PC in the group does not understand Shyriiwook, the Wookiee player cannot speak normally when speaking dialogue...s/he must approximate Wookiee sounds.

How I run things: The PC knows their species language and Galactic Basic (unless you're a species that can't speak Basic, like wookiees). For every point of Intellect beyond 1, the PC gains an additional Language known. This rarely comes up in play per the game rules so it's really only story related or for fun to keep players suspense on things.

For wookiees and species that can't speak basic, one can either use a comlink as a translator, get a droid (both can be destroyed) or someone in the party can learn their language so they can understand the group walking carpet.

I've also considered allowing for an additional languages for each level of Force Rating, to represent the fact that Force Users have an easier time understanding other species through their connection to the great and powerful mystical energy field.

Personally I use the plot device style. When it's trivial, PCs understand all languages, but when story requires it, they don't. Players actually suggested this. Currently they have a protocol droid, so this is not so much of a problem anyway.

In our next campaign, this will be more of an issue, if my plans are fulfilled, because it's local campaign, with xenophobia as one theme. One reason for PCs not to abandon their home planet is because they don't understand languages spoken elsewhere. (Leaving requires them to learn languages (more roleplay thing than XP spending.)

I may end up making languages as universal talents. By using 5 xp to talent PC learns common language(s?) of the area/planet.

I've yet to encounter a situation where someone would speak a different language.

The knowledge xenology check makes sense to me. I look forward to testing it.

I remember a suggestion I think one of the devs made, but it might've been one of the O66 hosts.

For the person to make a Knowledge: *relevant portion of space* check to know the language.

If it's a language from out on the rim. Knowledge Outer Rim

If it's some ancient, dead language Knowledge: Lore

If it's a language of one of the criminally inclined species Knowledge Underworld.

Etc etc.

Seemed reasonable to me, if one simply MUST require a roll for this. I prefer not though, as it's doesn't really help the plot. If I REALLY need the PC's to know this stuff, but they fail the check, then I have to improvise a new plot hook for them to bite into. If it's something I want to remain a mystery, and they figure it out, then I have to deal with them knowing the Big Twist of my plot long before I wanted it revealed.

Much prefer the "You know it if I need you to know it" rule.

6 minutes ago, KungFuFerret said:

I remember a suggestion I think one of the devs made, but it might've been one of the O66 hosts.

For the person to make a Knowledge: *relevant portion of space* check to know the language.

If it's a language from out on the rim. Knowledge Outer Rim

If it's some ancient, dead language Knowledge: Lore

If it's a language of one of the criminally inclined species Knowledge Underworld.

Etc etc.

Seemed reasonable to me, if one simply MUST require a roll for this. I prefer not though, as it's doesn't really help the plot. If I REALLY need the PC's to know this stuff, but they fail the check, then I have to improvise a new plot hook for them to bite into. If it's something I want to remain a mystery, and they figure it out, then I have to deal with them knowing the Big Twist of my plot long before I wanted it revealed.

Much prefer the "You know it if I need you to know it" rule.

I completely get your sensibility here. But since my rp is free flowing and significantly less structured I like when the pcs have to find another way around.

We had a situation where we were in a tomb and couldn't figure out how to open the next door we did have the chance to study the language but had prioritised other things and so we were stumped. After a brief discussion we opted to desecrate it by using explosives to simply blow down the door.

However... In structured play I can see how missing a bit of information that was integral it'd be highly problematic and may leave the pcs too far off the intended path.