I'm sure this has been discussed before, but how does Rey do when running her like you would a Fat Han?

Using the evade title, C3PO and Finn (instead of Gunner).

I like the availability to take that evade and get C3PO, then still get some rerolls. With good flying and the Falcon's dial it shouldn't be too hard to keep ships in arc. Obviously this build will be a little harder to keep ships in arc without the s-loop, but with a 3 and 4 k-turn is can still be done. Inertial Dampeners can also help.

I'm currently running (Expertise) Rey with Poetency, and for me it's done well very. My best performing list to date (I don't run meta lists) beaten both Cloud City hosts with it. Did decently in an SC and won a club night event with Tuesday just gone.

The sloop enables her ability to go off alot. The falcon, or any large ship for that matter, tends to have issues keeping people in arc for multiple rounds. its the PWT that makes them so ridiculous, but Rey is vastly weaker out of arc so you need to treat her like she has no PWT.

The Evade/3PO build worked on Han because he had no arc benefits so he could care less about the sloop.

It's actually harder then you'd think to keep people in arc. They can zoom past you, meaning it will take several turns to get the back in arc without k-turning, but then you are actionless and heaven help you if Rey's blocked. Finn isn't going to be used as often, meaning you probably aren't getting five point of use out of him.

Honestly, Fat Han's strength is as a kite. He runs away while taking pot shots at people. Rey (especially with Finn) is as a mega jouster. Get in, smash face, do a sloop and go at it again. Yeah, C-3po and the old title will make her tankier, but also at the expense of the usual way she stays tanky and her mobility.

^ this.

Rey's ability really means she wants to play as a jouster more than a traditional turret - keeping her opponent in arc and getting those rerolls and Finn's extra dice. The loop title (and Kanan) help to maximise that ability.

Taking the Evade title would go in the opposite direction; you wouldn't be maximising your invesment in her pilot ability (and Finn, for that matter), you'd actually be reducing the number of times they come into play.

Yeah, Rey is probably one of the hardest ships to build outside of her primary build path. The sloop title and Finn are basically stapled to her.

It's interesting to see why people disagree. I was finding the the sloop (due to all the turrets) wasnt preventing all that much damage, she was getting burned down quite quickly. C3-Evade has been stopping a lot of damage. You still have the K's to flip her round if you need to and the loss of Expertise for turn hasn't been that impactful.

Not it to mention that if your running Sloop, your opponent is looking to block it.

14 minutes ago, Shockwave said:

It's interesting to see why people disagree. I was finding the the sloop (due to all the turrets) wasnt preventing all that much damage, she was getting burned down quite quickly. C3-Evade has been stopping a lot of damage. You still have the K's to flip her round if you need to and the loss of Expertise for turn hasn't been that impactful.

Not it to mention that if your running Sloop, your opponent is looking to block it.

With Rey, especially Expertise Rey, I have found that stress is death. Even with the sloping version, ships can still get around you. With no actions and no Expertise, Rey is basicly dead in the water. And 3P0 is only so much help there.

Blocking a sloop is harder than it sounds as there are two directions to go. And just like with Defenders, the mark of a good Slooping Falcon pilot is knowing when a one bank is the better move.

If you don't mind me asking, have you tried your current build on Han? For one point more, you get higher PS and a useful ability that isn't arc locked.

2 minutes ago, SabineKey said:

With Rey, especially Expertise Rey, I have found that stress is death. Even with the sloping version, ships can still get around you. With no actions and no Expertise, Rey is basicly dead in the water. And 3P0 is only so much help there.

Blocking a sloop is harder than it sounds as there are two directions to go. And just like with Defenders, the mark of a good Slooping Falcon pilot is knowing when a one bank is the better move.

If you don't mind me asking, have you tried your current build on Han? For one point more, you get higher PS and a useful ability that isn't arc locked.

Despite being in the game since wave 4 (ish) the only Falcon I've ever flown is Rey so no. So far, I haven't any issue with selfinflicted Stress. Also, id say that 50% of my K-turns have been on the Burnout slam so I'm on the edges of the fight pointing back at it, with no issues to clear the Stress on the next move.

As I said previously, my experience has been one of the Sloop not saving much on the damage due to the amount of turrets, and she was getting taken down very quickly. C3-Evade she been surviving. (Baring the odd talon roll off of the board)

22 minutes ago, Shockwave said:

Despite being in the game since wave 4 (ish) the only Falcon I've ever flown is Rey so no. So far, I haven't any issue with selfinflicted Stress. Also, id say that 50% of my K-turns have been on the Burnout slam so I'm on the edges of the fight pointing back at it, with no issues to clear the Stress on the next move.

As I said previously, my experience has been one of the Sloop not saving much on the damage due to the amount of turrets, and she was getting taken down very quickly. C3-Evade she been surviving. (Baring the odd talon roll off of the board)

Try it with Han and see how things change and stay the same. From my experience and that of others in my area, if you aren't kitting Rey to be the slopping jouster, you are pretty much better off with Han anyway.

24 minutes ago, SabineKey said:

Try it with Han and see how things change and stay the same. From my experience and that of others in my area, if you aren't kitting Rey to be the slopping jouster, you are pretty much better off with Han anyway.

Exactly. The point of the S-loop title isn't specifically to avoid damage, though it can help, it's so you can ideally, with Kanan, keep pumping out heavily modified 4-5 die attacks. If you're not trying to maximize Rey + Finn + Expertise through a combination of self-stressing or not trying to keep things in arc, Han + Gunner is almost definitely going to perform better than Rey + Finn in an otherwise MF-Evade + C-3PO + Expertise Falcon.

10 minutes ago, Otacon said:

If you're not trying to maximize Rey + Finn + Expertise through a combination of self-stressing or not trying to keep things in arc,

What makes you I'm not keeping targets in Arc often enough?

1/2 K-turns a game isn't impacting the out put all that much. More so when it's a 3 bank with Slam K so I have no out put at all, have turn round for defensive re-rolls and still get C3-Ev.

Ultimately, I was losing Rey a lot before and now the C3-Ev is only netting my opponents half points rather than all, if they are getting any points at all.

6 minutes ago, Shockwave said:

What makes you I'm not keeping targets in Arc often enough?

1/2 K-turns a game isn't impacting the out put all that much. More so when it's a 3 bank with Slam K so I have no out put at all, have turn round for defensive re-rolls and still get C3-Ev.

Ultimately, I was losing Rey a lot before and now the C3-Ev is only netting my opponents half points rather than all, if they are getting any points at all.

How are you getting the evade in the situation you described above? You have already taken your action and are stressed.

23 minutes ago, SabineKey said:

How are you getting the evade in the situation you described above? You have already taken your action and are stressed.

That was more referencing the build than the Evade action itself.

Anyway, I'm now in the pub so more important things to be done.

I think this is one of those few questions where some calculations can really help.
The builds I used were Rey with Predator+Finn, Rey with Expertise+Finn, Rey with Predator+Focus+Finn, or Han with Predator+Gunner. The rest is for all C-3PO, MF(old) and Engine Upgrade, for 61 or 62pt total.

The graph shows range as X (so +1 red on range 1, +1 green on range 3) and expected damage as Y
To explain the legend: ReyP is Rey with Predator, ReyP+F is predator and focus, ReyE is with Expertise. ReyPOoA is for out of arc, meaning no Rey or Finn ability used, but with predator!
vs3 means against a 3 green dice ship. 3f means they have focus, 3fe means they have focus and evade.

We see 4 groups: Rey with Predator+Focus or just +Expertise is much better than the rest. So this suggests that FatRey is really much better than FatHan, as long as she can focus or if she has expertise (which puts her at the same 62pt as FatHan)
The next group shows us that the defending focus makes as much difference as not using expertise/predator+focus. So Rey with only predator is as good as Han - if she can keep the opponent in arc!
The third group shows that Expertise vs focus+evade is as good as predator vs a focus, or if Rey shoots someone without tokens out of arc. And so on, I won't go through everything because there is something more interesting:

Let's say you have any number of shots during a match, half of them have your opponent in arc and you focus, half don't and you evaded. That's still slightly better than FatHan alone (1.71 vs 1.47),or if you have expertise (1.66 vs 1.47), and it's slightly worse if you don't focus but also evaded (1.29 vs 1.47). That was Range2, but the same is true for all ranges.

And as expected, Han gets better in a meta where there are defensive tokens. Rey is still slightly better if she focuses or with expertise and her opponent has a focus too, but at Range 3 there's only a 0.003 difference, so that's basically 0. Also keep in mind that Han could focus, too! Interestingly, the difference to Expertise or Predator+Focus is almost 0 when the defender has both tokens.

So the point I take away from this is that Rey can miss half her shots and be as good or better as FatHan if she uses focus or if she has Expertise. I did not expect that, to be honest. She's of course better if she gets more in-arc shots, and of course gets worse if she has less than half. This means that EU could be well worth the cost if it allows in-arc shots.

Also I now wish I had done VIRey, too. Predator makes her a bit better, so it's not quite the same.

EDIT: Based on that I would build e.g. this list

She is actually really good. I prefer her with Expertise, C3P0, Finn, Title and Engine. Paired with Miranda with a TLT, Bomblet and LRS.

In arc she hits super hard and can tank quite a bit of damage with C3P0, Evade and 2 Agility with rerolls. Out of arc she plays more like Fat Han (minus the Gunner effect). I feel like engine is a must. Try to avoid incoming fire or turtle up if you can't avoid it. PS8 is the downside to the squad with so many ships at PS9 and PS10.

I had a lot of experience with Fat Han but I never liked using the standard Slooping Rey. She seemed to die too easily. Never had trouble playing against her either. I do like the Fat Han version a lot though.

On 10/08/2017 at 7:09 PM, GreenDragoon said:

EDIT: Based on that I would build e.g. this list

Lol, Put Poe at PS8 and that is my list.