There has been discussion over the role cards and their effect on the mega game. With any actual statistics or much play testing from the community, it is hard to determine how these role cards will effect the game. The goal of the thread is to explore these cards to get a better idea of what to expect. It can double up as a way to find the "best" and "worst" roles for each clan.

As a disclaimer - I have played no actual games.

Crab Clan

Best Role - Seeker of Earth

Why it will turn the meta in the Crab's favor: With two Earth provinces, the Crab can now pick both Entrenched Position and Defend the Wall - pairing it with Pilgrimage. These high defense value locations, combined with the Crab's defensive theme and holdings will make it overly difficult to break them.

Why it won't matter: Defend the Wall is not the only province with 4 strength. There are other neutral provinces that are that tough, it can be expected that all Clans can break multiple 4-strength provinces. Everyone has access to Pilgrimage, and it is just a point of strength more. With cards like "Charge" and "Banzai", provinces will fall. Entrenched Position is a strong card militarily, but the Crab are vulnerable politically. The clan's reliance on Kisada could be their undoing, especially if he can be "Out Witted" at critical moments in the game. No role card will address this weakness.

Worst Role: Seeker of Fire

Why it will turn the meta out of the Crab's favor: I'm not aware of a 2nd fire province. Is there one? If not, this pick is totally useless. You don't even get influence for splashing!

Why it won't matter: For the same reasons as why having Seeker of Earth won't matter. Either your opponent has the power to break multiple 4-strength provinces, or they do not. Getting two 5-strength is not going to make a huge difference. Yes, missing out on influence will suck - but it is only 3 and the Crab have strong enough cards that they don't need a lot of splashing.



Honorable mentions for good Roles:

Keeper of Earth - With low starting honor the Crab will have to watch their bids. By keeping the Earth ring they can increase their card draw while forcing their opponents to bid higher to make up for lost cards.

Keeper of Air - For much the same reason for taking Earth, the Air Ring will help with the lower starting honor of the Crab. It will also act as a deterrent for the Lion and Crane who may be targeting the ring to keep high honor and possibly threaten a Honor Victory.

Keeper of Void - Anything that will take fate away from your characters is bad. Controlling this ring will help with board control.

Spoiler alert: Seeker of Fire will be the worst role for every clan.

2 minutes ago, Joe From Cincinnati said:

Spoiler alert: Seeker of Fire will be the worst role for every clan.

I'm waiting for a.....hot......new Fire Province card (s) to be released after the roles have been picked. To either troll us or make up for a possible ill-advised decision.

I'm also not entirely convinced Seeker of Earth will be best for Crab. I really like the provinces that have an action associated with them. Seeker of Air could be an under the radar choice if the other air province is similar to the current one. Instead of gain 1 fate, maybe gain 1 honor? Draw 1 card? I wouldn't be surprised if Air Provinces become the resource giving provinces.

I do think that a keeper role will be great for Crab, since they have a lot of great interactions with winning on defense. And if their keeper initiate has anything to do with winning on defense, that could be really strong for them as well.

There will be another Fire province: there are 10 neutral provinces.

I think pretty much all the Keeper roles are worth wild. Getting extra influence and a bonus for claiming any of the ring is just fine. Seeker right now it's less interested. I think once we get more province cards Seeker will start to really feel like a better choice. That said I'm fairly certain we haven't seen all the provinces yet so maybe it will be more interesting right now that I think. At the moment Seeker of Earth is the best pick just because of the increase in defense so I suspect it will be hotly contested. I guess Seeker of Air is good for Crane.

idk if this is appropriate. Without playing with the role cards I can't comment... Moreso we're not sure what the plans are for the unclaimed roles.

Up front - my reaction (as stated in the other thread) is that it isn't that great of an advantage to have 2x province of the same element. It obviously makes the game a bit better for that clan, but it also makes sense to me that they would have that advantage and I feel this is already taken into consideration in the balance of the game. Crab with 2x Earth Provinces? Of course. Phoenix with 2x Void Provinces? I was actually a bit disappointed when I learned about the province limitation and how it effected the Phoenix for choosing to use their Void one and losing the (obviously) best of the others for them, Shameful Display...

imo - I think this finally makes the elemental province locking make sense. The advantage of being able to double up on 2 provinces of the same element needs to be earned, and protected - and is NOT guaranteed. The meta will have a more frequent shift with this, which is exactly what I wanted when we were discussing about the roles of the Emerald Champion in ol5r. This gives us a clan Hatamoto as well as a Shogun, and a fluctuating meta that is immediately impacted by player decisions - for better or worse - quicker than rotations normally would. This is what L5R has always wanted to be.

10 minutes ago, Tonbo Karasu said:

There will be another Fire province: there are 10 neutral provinces.

It's Meditations on the Tao. We believe, based on the half spoiler, that it, as an action, removes a fate from an attacking character.

Hasn't been that great in testing.

Does anyone else get confused over "Seeker" and "Keeper?

In my mind, "Keeper" is keeping an extra province element. "Seeker" is seeking out alliances and getting the extra fate from those out there rings. My brain....

Any ways, anyone else feel like drawing up an outline for the other clans?

Looking at the Seeker Initiate, it's the only 'tutor'ing effect we have seen so far. Although perhaps we should now call it a seeking effect?

If I was a betting man, I'd suggest that, to mirror Night Raid, Meditations on the Tao now says that you remove 1 fate from an attacking character for each card in the attacker's hand, when revealed.

25 minutes ago, Tonbo Karasu said:

There will be another Fire province: there are 10 neutral provinces.

Hey, you're a Dragonfly; you must know not to trust the so-called law of averages as a guarantee. We could get five neutral Water provinces; who knows?

2 minutes ago, Ide Yoshiya said:

Hey, you're a Dragonfly; you must know not to trust the so-called law of averages as a guarantee. We could get five neutral Water provinces; who knows?

Alternatively a bunch of provinces aligned with the Minor Clans

Fortress of the Dragonfly: Water Province: When this province is revealed the defender may look at the attacker's conflict card hand.

59 minutes ago, Tonbo Karasu said:

Alternatively a bunch of provinces aligned with the Minor Clans

Fortress of the Dragonfly: Water Province: When this province is revealed the defender may look at the attacker's conflict card hand.

Fortress of the Dragonfly

When this province is revealed, if the attacker is Lion ? break province, burn card, swallow ashes.?

1 hour ago, Shu2jack said:

Does anyone else get confused over "Seeker" and "Keeper?

In my mind, "Keeper" is keeping an extra province element. "Seeker" is seeking out alliances and getting the extra fate from those out there rings. My brain....

Any ways, anyone else feel like drawing up an outline for the other clans?

Seeker has the monk that seeks through your deck. Then it's easy to remember because I know we don't know the monk for the keeper role yet :).

Or, a keeper is very protective of their element, gaining fate for defending it successfully.

1 hour ago, Shu2jack said:

Does anyone else get confused over "Seeker" and "Keeper?

In my mind, "Keeper" is keeping an extra province element. "Seeker" is seeking out alliances and getting the extra fate from those out there rings. My brain....

Any ways, anyone else feel like drawing up an outline for the other clans?

Think of it like this: seekers are going out and immersing themselves in that element, whereas keepers have mastered the element and have gained the adoration of their peers.

2 hours ago, Tonbo Karasu said:

Looking at the Seeker Initiate, it's the only 'tutor'ing effect we have seen so far. Although perhaps we should now call it a seeking effect?

If I was a betting man, I'd suggest that, to mirror Night Raid, Meditations on the Tao now says that you remove 1 fate from an attacking character for each card in the attacker's hand, when revealed.

other tutor effects are Agasha Swordsmith, and A Perfect Gift. As far as I can recall.

And I've got a gut feeling right now that Keeper is taking a card from the discard.

I feel like the Role cards are well designed to give small advantages to begin with, and some incremental advantages as the metagame for every area takes shape. They are designed to be used by any clan so I don't think the cards offer any significant boost for any specific clan right off the bat.

I feel that Seeker of Earth is really good, but for different reasons than the ones listed above.

With Seeker of Earth, you can have both Ancestral Lands and Entrenched Position in the same deck. Then, when your opponent reveals their stronghold, you can put one or the other of them under it depending on whether they're a military or political clan. Unless they've built a balanced enough deck to be able to win the final battle with their weaker conflict type, they're going to find it frustratingly difficult to take that stronghold. This may give you enough time to win.

43 minutes ago, Kitsu Seinosuke said:

I feel that Seeker of Earth is really good, but for different reasons than the ones listed above.

With Seeker of Earth, you can have both Ancestral Lands and Entrenched Position in the same deck. Then, when your opponent reveals their stronghold, you can put one or the other of them under it depending on whether they're a military or political clan. Unless they've built a balanced enough deck to be able to win the final battle with their weaker conflict type, they're going to find it frustratingly difficult to take that stronghold. This may give you enough time to win.

In theory I agree, but if you're weak conflict is the same as their weak conflict, you could have a problem. Even then, if they're really good in military (and you're not) they could just keep swinging at your strong hold for ring effects, and making you have to defend to prevent them from reaching 12/13 mil power.

6 minutes ago, RandomJC said:

In theory I agree, but if you're weak conflict is the same as their weak conflict, you could have a problem. Even then, if they're really good in military (and you're not) they could just keep swinging at your strong hold for ring effects, and making you have to defend to prevent them from reaching 12/13 mil power.

I made the same experience. Being able to attack into provinces/the stronghold without getting punished for it is more of a disadvantage than I initially thought.

4 minutes ago, Ignithas said:

I made the same experience. Being able to attack into provinces/the stronghold without getting punished for it is more of a disadvantage than I initially thought.

I like earth provinces, but having two isn't as good as some people think, unless you're crab.

Crane Clan

Best Role - Keeper of Air

Why it will turn the meta in the Crane's favor: The Lion will already hate this match-up. Either the Crane will gain higher honor from claiming the ring, causing a problem for many of their cards, or they will possibly be giving the Crane extra fate throughout the game. With their honor focus and command over the air ring the Crane will constantly be threatening honor victories and forcing low card bids for other clans. Combine this with a focus on board control and it will be difficult to beat a Crane.

Why it won't matter: The Crane still have to win the conflicts to get any benefit of the Air ring - offensively or defensively. Smart play will minimize the benefits the Crane have over this ring. Because that is what it will come down to - if the Crane can win their conflicts they will get full benefits on the road to winning the match. If they can not, well, game over anyway.

Worst Role: Seeker of Fire

See Crab.



Honorable mentions for good Roles:

Keeper of Fire - The Fire Ring is another strong choice. Honoring your characters will fit into the clan theme as well as helping the Crane defensively by dishonoring their opponent's characters. Honor gains from your characters leaving play will help with staying ahead on honor.

Seeker of Air - This will enable the Crane to have access to an Air province as well as their Clan province. While I don't feel the Crane province is super strong, future expansions in the tournament year may provide for stronger options.

Keeper of Void - Anything that will take fate away from your characters is bad. Controlling this ring will help with board control.

I think it's premature to make objective statements. We can't possibly know just how strong 3 influence actually is, nor can we know just how strong two strongholds of the same faction are. Even if one side is stronger in Core, it's only a few months until the first cycle starts, and there's absolutely no telling how each role will shift.

3 minutes ago, player2636234 said:

I think it's premature to make objective statements. We can't possibly know just how strong 3 influence actually is, nor can we know just how strong two strongholds of the same faction are. Even if one side is stronger in Core, it's only a few months until the first cycle starts, and there's absolutely no telling how each role will shift.

I disagree. We already have a fun thread on how the Role Cards are a bad, unbalancing effect on the game. We might as well examine them.

Nothing wrong with theory crafting, now that we have the rules and over 75% of the card pool, we have a decent idea of how the roles could fit into clans that have been spoiled.