Here is an example of the type of play Miranda can still have even if the Adv Slam nerf is true. For context, this is the Final Table at a 44 person Store Championship with Connor Richards as the Miranda Pilot he was 9-0 in Swiss at Kashyyyk with Miranda/Corran.

Anyways, he uses Miranda to block Dengar in both moves and then hops over him next turn and bombs him, still can fire and still can regen. Bombs just will take more skill and won't be autokill to Aces after the nerf, but still very potent with no Sabine nerf in the works.

Time of plays for first video begins: 28:29 & 58:39, feel free to fast forward while dials are being planned. I suggest watching this entire game. It's very much a perfect example how even if something goes wrong early, the game isn't over.

@balindamood also linked another video of PS2 Wardens doing the exact same tactic on their opening exchange! Play starts at 5:30.

Yeah, Miranda doesn't lose more than a build. Wardens lose their signature list and their purpose beyond one ship. FFG really should have learned that high PS repositioning is problematic after the Phantom debacle. Instead they combined it with both regen and TLT...

If all else fails, you can still take experimental interface.

What nerf? There is no nerf. There is a leaked "draft FAQ" on Reddit. I know it's the internet and all, but seriously, can we just calm the **** down a little. So many chicken littles!

1 hour ago, Admiral Deathrain said:

Yeah, Miranda doesn't lose more than a build. Wardens lose their signature list and their purpose beyond one ship.

I've seen you post variants of this all over the place since the FAQ leak, and you are so far off base. I'm willing to grant that 3 Advance SLAM wardens might have been the Warden's "signature list" in a lot of people's mind, but the idea that that's the only configuration that matters, that the K Wing has lost its "purpose beyond one ship" is just utterly ridiculous. I've spent moat of the last year playing Wardens (including top 8 at a regional) without Advanced SLAM, and I'm hardly the only one.

Warden Squadron Pilot (23)
Autoblaster Turret (2)
Extra Munitions (2)
Homing Missiles (5)
"Chopper" (0)
Cluster Mines (4)
Long-Range Scanners (0)

Warden Squadron Pilot (23)
Autoblaster Turret (2)
Extra Munitions (2)
Homing Missiles (5)
Sabine Wren (2)
Cluster Mines (4)
Long-Range Scanners (0)

Biggs Darklighter (25)
R4-D6 (1)
Integrated Astromech (0)

Total: 100

It was built to kill pre nerf X7 defenders and while it's not totally optimised in the post wave 11 meta (Black One Poe and higher PS alpha strikers are tricky, but by no means insurmountable, Dash Miranda needs very good blocking play), it's still completely playable.

Whether or not Advanced SLAM continues to be a thing, the K Wing remains enormously powerful.

2 hours ago, MacchuWA said:

I've seen you post variants of this all over the place since the FAQ leak, and you are so far off base. I'm willing to grant that 3 Advance SLAM wardens might have been the Warden's "signature list" in a lot of people's mind, but the idea that that's the only configuration that matters, that the K Wing has lost its "purpose beyond one ship" is just utterly ridiculous. I've spent moat of the last year playing Wardens (including top 8 at a regional) without Advanced SLAM, and I'm hardly the only one.

Warden Squadron Pilot (23)
Autoblaster Turret (2)
Extra Munitions (2)
Homing Missiles (5)
"Chopper" (0)
Cluster Mines (4)
Long-Range Scanners (0)

Warden Squadron Pilot (23)
Autoblaster Turret (2)
Extra Munitions (2)
Homing Missiles (5)
Sabine Wren (2)
Cluster Mines (4)
Long-Range Scanners (0)

Biggs Darklighter (25)
R4-D6 (1)
Integrated Astromech (0)

Total: 100

It was built to kill pre nerf X7 defenders and while it's not totally optimised in the post wave 11 meta (Black One Poe and higher PS alpha strikers are tricky, but by no means insurmountable, Dash Miranda needs very good blocking play), it's still completely playable.

Whether or not Advanced SLAM continues to be a thing, the K Wing remains enormously powerful.

It's almost certainly more like the TIE/D compared to the TIE/x7, though: a niche ship, powerful, but with serious weaknesses, mostly used by devotees. Which means much fewer on the tables, for good or ill, because people are lazy.

7 minutes ago, Biophysical said:

because people are lazy.

truer words have never been spoken

4 hours ago, Dr Zoidberg said:

What nerf? There is no nerf. There is a leaked "draft FAQ" on Reddit. I know it's the internet and all, but seriously, can we just calm the **** down a little. So many chicken littles!

Who's freaking out? The thread is literally saying the ship will still be viable and all is fine.

5 hours ago, Admiral Deathrain said:

Yeah, Miranda doesn't lose more than a build. Wardens lose their signature list and their purpose beyond one ship. FFG really should have learned that high PS repositioning is problematic after the Phantom debacle. Instead they combined it with both regen and TLT...

The most annoying thing about Miranda is the regen and TLT. Other regen ships aren't firing at you AND running away AND dropping bombs.

At least with Nym you can kill it. You can put some damage in and disengage, chip away at him. With Miranda you can't do that.

I'd be more willing to accept the Advanced SLAM nerf and the loss of Wardens from the meta as collateral damage if Bomblet Generator didn't exist.

Krayts are right yet again. If you nerf something in the meta, nerf everything at that same power level, don't just nerf a single thing or else nothing will happen to the meta except shrink. A ship like 48 point Miranda has multiple things wrong with it, and fixing only one of its problems does little except knock Wardens out of the meta.

As far as I'm concerned, PS 2 Wardens with bombs and Advanced SLAM are fine. It's PS 8 regen TLT ships with bombs and Advanced SLAM that are the issue.

But **** it, infinite bombs, sure, why not. Hey, I know how we fix bombs. Dropping a Bomblet gives you a weapons disabled token, SLAM gives you a second, and now you can only clear one a turn.

With wave 11, the nerfs to stuff in the previous meta are almost meaningless now. Why is there a second Biggs in the game? Why does Scum have Deadeye Scouts back? Why is there a bomb upgrade that doesn't get discarded without some sort of dual card recharge mechanic or weapons disabled token?

I'm getting tired of FFG's, "Let's wait to see if it's broken first" approach. It most often turns into, "We'll wait until it fails and then show up late to fix the problem."

How many metas as have been dominated by stupid bull that never gets fixed? Seemingly all of them besides for waves 1-3.

I've been running 2 Advanced Slam Wardens for a while now. It's beatable, even by aces, and takes a lot of practice to fly well. I can understand Miranda-hate, **** I hate her. But Wardens? Not the meta-dominator.

EI Kanan Miranda is already quite good for the tricks it adds in the current meta...

This thread should be called k-wings are not viable anymore, but at least we can still run Miranda. K-wings were the only good generic bombers in the game, now the only two pilots left that use bombs are Miranda and Nym. K-wing with autoblasters is cute but utter garbage cuz they are so slow and expensive, if you really wanna autoblaster spam run y-wings. This nerf completely removes k-wings from the meta except Miranda. Yes you can still run y-wing as an inefficient missile carrier in friendly games but thats the most you will get out of them

1 minute ago, garciaj113 said:

This thread should be called k-wings are not viable anymore, but at least we can still run Miranda. K-wings were the only good generic bombers in the game, now the only two pilots left that use bombs are Miranda and Nym. K-wing with autoblasters is cute but utter garbage cuz they are so slow and expensive, if you really wanna autoblaster spam run y-wings. This nerf completely removes k-wings from the meta except Miranda. Yes you can still run y-wing as an inefficient missile carrier in friendly games but thats the most you will get out of them

You can still do the exact same tactic that connor uses in the final with Wardens... it's even easier at PS2.

How to fly K-wings:

1 hour ago, RayCidivist said:

I've been running 2 Advanced Slam Wardens for a while now. It's beatable, even by aces, and takes a lot of practice to fly well. I can understand Miranda-hate, **** I hate her. But Wardens? Not the meta-dominator.

I don't think the problem was that Adv Slam Wardens were dominating the meta, as much as the problem was that Adv Slam Wardens drove low health high agility Aces to complete extinction.

Adv Slam bombing was just too precise to bring them to the table anymore. Its all now more tanky types, bombs and alpha strikes.

7 hours ago, CRCL said:

If all else fails, you can still take experimental interface.

Instead of Advanced SLAM, you mean? And just drop mines after your normal move?

11 minutes ago, balindamood said:

How to fly K-wings:

Great video!! Another example of this same strategy being used and even on the PS2 guys!

My opinion:

Adv SLAM mines have pushed aces out, and there is no way for them to really come back with a WSP on the table, with or without Sabine. EI will still let you do it, but at a cost (stress and 1 point) and it is unique. I believe that the proposed nerf will bring mines back as intended, area control, not assassin's tool.

I also believe they do need to go back to the ability to drop dial bombs before they slam as shown in the original release article. This would give them something unique, would be consistent with the rest of the SLAM action rulings, and it does not seem OP to me.

Miranda with a TLT is a problem, but I do not know How to fix that.

37 minutes ago, FTS Gecko said:

Instead of Advanced SLAM, you mean? And just drop mines after your normal move?

Yeah. You do your manoeuvre, use your regular action to SLAM, then use experimental Interface to drop a mine. It's not as good a AdvSLAM, since it costs +1pt, a stress, and is unique. Still, if you're running a single K-wing (eg: Miranda) it's decent.

It does give you one advantage over AdvSLAM. You can bump with your SLAM move, and still get your action to drop a mine. Situational, but occasionally useful.

I was thinking they would alter the Advanced Slam text to read: "Your ship looses the (turret upgrade icon). After performing a Slam action, if you did not overlap an obstacle or another ship, you may perform a Free Action."

That way you much choose to A) indiscriminately drop a bomb on almost any ship within range 3 without your TLT or Autoblaster, or B) you use Slam to position or quickly retreat only, not bomb, but you get your turret. That seemed fair to me.....but I'm no expert K-Wing pilot.

4 hours ago, Tbetts94 said:

Who's freaking out? The thread is literally saying the ship will still be viable and all is fine.

I'm going to assume you haven't actually scrolled through the original "leak" forum. It's Mad Max Beyond thunderdome over there.

5 minutes ago, FlyingAnchors said:

I'm going to assume you haven't actually scrolled through the original "leak" forum. It's Mad Max Beyond thunderdome over there.

Oh I know, but this thread's goal is to calm their nerves about Adv Slam nerf

39 minutes ago, Tbetts94 said:

Oh I know, but this thread's goal is to calm their nerves about Adv Slam nerf

I'm not sure how. K-wings (well, Miranda) aren't dead if this nerf is real (IMO, it is, though I'm still praying it's not final), but AdvSLAM is definitely dead as an upgrade. (It could be revived by a future card or change, but as it stands, it simply won't be used in competition.)

It's a genuinely terrible, unnecessarily heavy-handed, change.

17 minutes ago, Jeff Wilder said:

I'm not sure how. K-wings (well, Miranda) aren't dead if this nerf is real (IMO, it is, though I'm still praying it's not final), but AdvSLAM is definitely dead as an upgrade. (It could be revived by a future card or change, but as it stands, it simply won't be used in competition.)

It's a genuinely terrible, unnecessarily heavy-handed, change.

Adv Slam should had never been a thing. It is dead, but it's not required to do good quality bombing runs that take strategy. What's not dead like what you stated, the K-Wings themselves, which is what many people are claiming like a few posts above and in that thread.

2 minutes ago, Tbetts94 said:

Adv Slam should had never been a thing. It is dead, but it's not required to do good quality bombing runs that take strategy. What's not dead like what you stated, the K-Wings themselves, which is what many people are claiming like a few posts above and in that thread.

It should, but not in its current form. Bombing gimmicks like Deathfire/rain are a lot of fun. Giving the K-Wing something similar is a good idea. The problem was too high flexibility, which should have been solved by applying restrictions rather than just killing the upgrade.