It occurred to me today something that I've noticed players do during timed tournaments is actually wrong, and I've perused the Rules Reference book to verify.

If time is called when players are planning or placing dials for the next round, the players have technically started a new round.

When the TO states "Finish your current round", the players finish the round they have just started, even if they are planning dials only and none have been placed.

I bring this up because Ive seen players in the Planning Phase drop their dials and shake hands when time is called. Sometimes with dials placed, sometimes with dials in hand only. This is technically not correct following of rules. The next round is in process.

A round is:

1) Planning Phase

2) Activation Phase

3) Combat Phase

4) End Phase

(See pages 16 or 24 of core 2 Rules Reference).

When time is called, players finish the current round (see page 21 of core 2 Rules Reference).

Also, per page 6 of Tournament Regulations:

" Time : At the end of a game round, the round time limit has been reached. (If time is called during a game round, players must finish that game round.) The player with the greater score receives a win, and his opponent receives a loss. If both players have the same score, they follow the rules for “Final Salvo” on page 7 to determine the winner. "

Id embed images of the pages if I knew how from my phone!

Do they really drop dials? I've only seen matches end after the combat phase, regardless when time was called.

I've seen it 3 or 4 times over the years. And I've had opponents give me a funny look when I insist we have to finish this round.

I just wanted to remind players what the technical rules are so no one (intentionally or unintentially) forces the match end at the incorrect time.

The game's experience is overall improved if we all play the same way, (i.e. by following the rule book) which may or may not be as engrained in every player's brain as well as we assume, lol.

I believe this is also how FFG has ruled it in person, @phild0 feel free to chime in. You actually go to Nationals and stuff.

One problem I've run into is that there's ambiguity as to when exactly the end of one round and the start of another actually is if no one actually said the words "end of round' or "new round". If time runs out after the last shot of combat but before anyone has set a dial down, that does't feel like a new round has started. But if dials are down, that's substantially less ambiguous feeling.

Also, some players and TOs may not want to play out another full round because that eats into time before the next match can start.

I/We've always played it that way - even if dials are in hand (even just one) the next round has started and you finish it out.

We've always played it that at least one dial needs to be physically on the table.

Dropping dials is weird unless it's a forgone conclusion. I usually go with the "set any dial on the table asap, then adjust it as necessary after all my other dials are set, and before I declare my planning phase over" technique.

Considering that you can't start the first "round" without it having a planning phase counting that phase as the start of the round is logical from that point of view.

The reality is that nothing SOLID ever happens DURING the planning stage. Combat ends with a quick skip through the End Phase then you throw a dial on the table to "start" the planning phase and apparently that's all it takes to start the next round. Never mind it may take you many more minutes to set any other dials or to check/adjust that dial you "set" with no thought what so ever except to make sure the round started even if nothing is going to happen for another 5 minutes.

As far as I'm concerned the Planning Phase should be an in between phase that is neither part of the last or next round. It's "end" signals the true start of the new round but upt to that point nothing has really changed since the End phase happened.

1 hour ago, StevenO said:

Considering that you can't start the first "round" without it having a planning phase counting that phase as the start of the round is logical from that point of view.

The reality is that nothing SOLID ever happens DURING the planning stage. Combat ends with a quick skip through the End Phase then you throw a dial on the table to "start" the planning phase and apparently that's all it takes to start the next round. Never mind it may take you many more minutes to set any other dials or to check/adjust that dial you "set" with no thought what so ever except to make sure the round started even if nothing is going to happen for another 5 minutes.

As far as I'm concerned the Planning Phase should be an in between phase that is neither part of the last or next round. It's "end" signals the true start of the new round but upt to that point nothing has really changed since the End phase happened.

I believe that FFG has ruled the other way.

Once you're in a new round and thinking about dials, you're in that round regardless if you have physically set a dial. I am pretty sure that they have ruled this way to extend games before.

1 minute ago, MajorJuggler said:

I believe that FFG has ruled the other way.

Once you're in a new round and thinking about dials, you're in that round regardless if you have physically set a dial. I am pretty sure that they have ruled this way to extend games before.

I'm just boggled that it could possibly be seen otherwise. I mean, "Complete the current round" is pretty unambiguous, I would think. "Do what the order of play says, not what it doesn't say."

I mean, if nothing can change, score-wise, my opponent and I will often knock off, but otherwise, the current round is the current round.

(I do want to point out that in the story I related that led to this PSA, ignoring the Planning Phase wasn't the only offense. Deliberately -- even ostentatiously -- running out the clock was much worse.)

Never seen it done any other way.

Most TO will let you finish the turn if one dial is set or the planning phase was announced verbally.

If you want to get really technical:

What if one player puts down a dial before the other player has removed unused tokens (therefore still in the prior End Phase) and the clock finishes?

I feel like I'm still I'm the planning phase of a game I had three days ago.

2 hours ago, ABXY said:

If you want to get really technical:

What if one player puts down a dial before the other player has removed unused tokens (therefore still in the prior End Phase) and the clock finishes?

CHEATER!!!!

Makes me think I may want to figure out what I want to with my dials before I actually finish the End Phase by taking off those tokens.

The rules may consider the planning phase to actually be the start of a round and because it has to happen before round 1 can take place it isn't easy to argue otherwise but that doesn't mean it should be the actual start of a new round. I guess I'm the only one who will basically consider the "planning phase" to run continually during the entire game as I'm figuring out my responses and counters as a round progresses instead of believing that all "planning" must occur during the phase specifically for it.

If you get to the "s" in "back to dials", a new round has started.

If you want to be technical, if you are winning by points and you both have dials in hand, if you spot a focus token by a ship you could say you haven't finished the end step and call game.