13 hours ago, Taki said:

What would you do with Naga? Would you give them something like old ranged attacks? Would you go with swarming?

They would be a lot like the Dragon, so all about a few very powerful characters ruining your opponent's day, but instead of having their characters growing strong via attachments, the Naga would start powerful right out of the gate. The special tricks would be also defensive and counter-conflict (like the Phoenix) in nature rather than Fate manipulation like the Dragon. As Naga, you would require to pour your resources into a few very strong characters and make the most out of them before their Fate eventually runs out. You could keep your enemy in bay with your special abilities until you have one of your big guys ready to smash some face (or between losing a guy and recruiting a new one).

15 minutes ago, JJ48 said:

I could almost see Ratlings as Military-only Crab allies.

Or even just the thematic subject for a few conflict card events.

I think, Naga, Mantis and Spider as own clans will do no trouble att all to FFG as new 3 clans later to do and balance.

In my own opinion these clans ( minor clans, minor factions, what ever) belongs to L5R, its not L5R whitout these.

Naga and Spider and also ratlings give the L5R that unique touch.

-I like to see ratlings atleast as neutral characters.

- Nagas maby as their own clan or neutral kind acharacters

-Spider clan i definately like to see as an own clan, also Mantis.

Feel free to comment, but make it so as an enlightened.

Nope. As much as I'd like to see Mantis as a playable faction, I think the game will be a lot better without additional faction for the time being.

24 minutes ago, Ser Nakata said:

Nope. As much as I'd like to see Mantis as a playable faction, I think the game will be a lot better without additional faction for the time being.

For the time being yes, but later.....i like to see them.

See, that's the thing, I like the Mantis and would have been very happy to see them so I could play them again (or even the Naga), but if FFG keeps the game at 7 playable factions, I think it'll be better.


But should the Naga or Mantis come back, sign me up for green.

5 minutes ago, Ser Nakata said:

See, that's the thing, I like the Mantis and would have been very happy to see them so I could play them again (or even the Naga), but if FFG keeps the game at 7 playable factions, I think it'll be better.


But should the Naga or Mantis come back, sign me up for green.

The only thing is, Dragon already stole our green! >:-(

Still, I'd be perfectly fine with Mantis being mercenaries/bounty hunters/etc. and being Neutrals that could play out of other clans' decks.

EDIT: (And by "Mantis", I of course mean "Wasp"!)

15 hours ago, Terppa57 said:

I think, Naga, Mantis and Spider as own clans will do no trouble att all to FFG as new 3 clans later to do and balance.

In my own opinion these clans ( minor clans, minor factions, what ever) belongs to L5R, its not L5R whitout these.

Naga and Spider and also ratlings give the L5R that unique touch.

-I like to see ratlings atleast as neutral characters.

- Nagas maby as their own clan or neutral kind acharacters

-Spider clan i definately like to see as an own clan, also Mantis.

Feel free to comment, but make it so as an enlightened.

So, in the rules there's reference to alternate win conditions being available through future cards. I wonder if this means that we'll see non human factions with an alternate win condition and an inability to win or lose through honor

12 hours ago, Taki said:

So, in the rules there's reference to alternate win conditions being available through future cards. I wonder if this means that we'll see non human factions with an alternate win condition and an inability to win or lose through honor

I think that warps the game too much. This was one of the issues with the Shadowlands in ol5r. They were too monodimensional because they played only the military game. They couldn't gain or lose honor, so they were never able to play the honor game. This also meant clans which focused more on playing the honor game had awkward playing experiences against the clan that basically ignored if anyone was dishonored or if they lost honor.

To include Naga, Shadowlands, or other factions - we need to find some way to make them completely relevant to the honor game.

10 minutes ago, shosuko said:

I think that warps the game too much. This was one of the issues with the Shadowlands in ol5r. They were too monodimensional because they played only the military game. They couldn't gain or lose honor, so they were never able to play the honor game. This also meant clans which focused more on playing the honor game had awkward playing experiences against the clan that basically ignored if anyone was dishonored or if they lost honor.

To include Naga, Shadowlands, or other factions - we need to find some way to make them completely relevant to the honor game.

I agree 100%. It seems playing switch is a lot more likely (for now anyway) but even then, if I run a deck that tries to dishonor but can military I'll probably have a rough time against a deck that only does military.

Maybe Shadowlands only loses at -x honor? Not sure what x would be, but could represent the dishonor of the Shadowlands has grown so strong and widespread all of Rokugan unites against them? No? That's fine, I'm done stretching.

10 minutes ago, SHARKOSAURUS said:

Maybe Shadowlands only loses at -x honor? Not sure what x would be, but could represent the dishonor of the Shadowlands has grown so strong and widespread all of Rokugan unites against them? No? That's fine, I'm done stretching.

Thing is, then you need a means of tracking negative honor, since our current system really only works for tracking positive honor. Using the same tokens would, I think, just get confusing (oh, you have -10 honor and gained 5 honor, so now you...lose...5 tokens?)

I need to get out of the mindset of honor dials tracking, that's my mistake.

36 minutes ago, shosuko said:

I think that warps the game too much. This was one of the issues with the Shadowlands in ol5r. They were too monodimensional because they played only the military game. They couldn't gain or lose honor, so they were never able to play the honor game. This also meant clans which focused more on playing the honor game had awkward playing experiences against the clan that basically ignored if anyone was dishonored or if they lost honor.

To include Naga, Shadowlands, or other factions - we need to find some way to make them completely relevant to the honor game.

Not necessarily. If for example you still card bid but if you play non human, you get something other than honor gain it could work. You could give them a higher starting honor and not let them gain it or win by it.

13 minutes ago, SHARKOSAURUS said:

I need to get out of the mindset of honor dials tracking, that's my mistake.

Nah, it's just a sign of your previous experience and wisdom regarding Rokugan, which some of us new players sadly lack.

3 minutes ago, Zesu Shadaban said:

Nah, it's just a sign of your previous experience and wisdom regarding Rokugan, which some of us new players sadly lack.

It's a new and exciting game for all of us.

But I think at this point we're most likely to see a Siege 1vMany format for Shadowlands. Also with the game focusing on the struggles of clan versus clan I don't know if we'll see nonhuman factions for quite some time.

On 8/4/2017 at 1:37 PM, Taki said:

Not necessarily. If for example you still card bid but if you play non human, you get something other than honor gain it could work. You could give them a higher starting honor and not let them gain it or win by it.

Suppose my problem with that would be flavor. If winning by honor isn't a thing, why would that clan care about being dishonored? Would they all be printed 0 glory? It feels like a lot of small little pieces would be knocked out of whack if you remove honor as a thing for a clan. And that it would either really require a patchwork to be able to even work with the rest of the clans, or work outside of it in a way that comes close to playing a different game.

at least, that's my read on it.

2 hours ago, RandomJC said:

Suppose my problem with that would be flavor. If winning by honor isn't a thing, why would that clan care about being dishonored? Would they all be printed 0 glory? It feels like a lot of small little pieces would be knocked out of whack if you remove honor as a thing for a clan. And that it would either really require a patchwork to be able to even work with the rest of the clans, or work outside of it in a way that comes close to playing a different game.

at least, that's my read on it.

Because honor matters to a clan even if it doesn't to their enemies. Also glory isn't honor, Naga and shadow lands do have prestige. They care about reputation, at least the living ones do.

And it doesn't have to be super patchwork. Say for instance the Naga box said, you may not gain honor from the honor bid, instead every time you would gain honor adds a fate to a friendly character in play. This means you can still be dishonored out, you care about the bid, and so does your opponent