Hi all,

So the Tie Special Forces is the current hotness but I have never really gotten along with it. My main issue is the dial and the difficulty in keeping the ship in the fight.

Sure it has a fairly open dial with lots of options, but most of them are red. Only at speed 2 do you get a hard turn that isn't red.

Do people load it up with equipment that opens up the dial or just rock on with stress from red turns?

Looking forward to some tips!

The TIE/sf is very much a toolbox - how you equip it, and how you fly it, is very dependent on the pilot.

The auxiliary arc is only a 2-dice popgun, so is largely not an issue except at range 1 - TIE/sf like multi-ship close-range furballs.

You can't open the dial that much, but you can make the ship surprisingly tolerant of stress. Lightweight Frame is so good it's hard to justify Twin Ion Engines MkII.

Primed Thrusters is nice but not vital - collision detector, lightweight frame, primed thrusters, wired is a nice cheap package that makes backdraft (the only one who can use his rear arc effectively) a rather squirrely dogfighter in dense debris fields.

Pattern Analyser is a good buy for Quickdraw, and Fire Control gives you target locks without needing actions.

Pattern analyzer fundamentally changes how the TIE /sf flies. Putting that on Quickdraw especially makes her a proper ace. My preferred build also has Lightweight Frame for survivability and Fire Control System for consistent damage.

To be honest, whilst there are 'budget' options, on the named pilots you might as well take them. Lightweight Frame, Pattern Analyser, Fire Control is 6 points of kit and on a 29-point ace it makes such a huge difference to her abilities that it's almost a no-brainer.

Backdraft can cope without doing red moves because his auxiliary arc is far more effective, so segnors loops are a choice, not a mandate. At the same time, there are relatively few upgrade cards as nasty point-for-point as fire control, and he still might want to do red hard turns.

More importantly, pattern analyser lets him do a red move then barrel roll - this is nice for setting up the "holy ******* shot" where you end up flying parallel to a large ship at close range and both the front and rear arcs have a shot on the same target - with Backdraft adding a critical to both.

While lacking in offense, I've found this is very defensive.

Quickdraw 29 ps9, Sensor Jammer 4, Intensity 2, Spec ops 0, Comm Relay 3, Lightweight Frame 2.

The idea here is to minimize your shield loss - you want to be able to trigger quickdraw 3 times.

Downside, you lose offense, but I have sniped soontir at range 3 through an asteroid, twice, so it has been effective for me. (Read: Lucky)

I'm planning on flying quickdraw with Decoy to help out a intensity equipped Turr Phenir.

As mentioned, the SF is very much an adaptable tool kit. It can be kitted out for offense, or support.

Intimidation can work as well, you deliberately fly into a foe, and still have your auxillary to fire (or primary of you are in front). Couple that with collision detector and you can be an effective blocker.

If you want offense, expose could work, and with quickdraw, you could get two up to 4 red attacks. Put a fire control system, and the requisite lightweight frame, but not optimal.

XX-23 skip tracers are a great choice for th SF in a support role, as they help everyone else and are cheap.

I like Backdraft over QuickDraw. The extra crit out of the rear arc causes people to make sub-optimal choices. PA and FCS are a must though, and remembering the order you need to shoot in if you have the sweet, sweet double shot is important.

Pattern analyser seems to be quite useful in opening up the dial a little. Will have to give that a go.

Edit: Do you guys generally fly the reds and deal with the stress?

As to flying with Stress, I find it depends on your opponent. Many seem to expect you to clear the stress, and if they anticipate you will do that, you can throw them off by keeping the stress to get a better shot.

It very much is a case by case situation, like much of the game, what will benefit you in the long run?

Of note, Primed Thrusters, as opposed to Pattern Analyzer is an option, especially with Intensity equipped.

4 minutes ago, william1134 said:

Pattern analyser seems to be quite useful in opening up the dial a little. Will have to give that a go.

Edit: Do you guys generally fly the reds and deal with the stress?

I've found the reds not to be an issue; I almost never need to use them. The TIE/sf is one of the best slow rollers on the imperial lineup which means I can rock with 1 forward/bank for quite a while.

I favor Expertise + FCS + Sensor Cluster + LWF on Quickdraw. Sensor Cluster is seriously underrated: gives you the option of using your focus, which you don't need for offense if Expertise is working, like an evade token (assuming you rolled a blank). So when you roll blank focus focus on defense vs 2 hits and want to trigger your QD shot, sensor cluster gives you the ability to only take 1 shield here.

No one likes shooting at Quickdraw. This is good, because Quickdraw is one of the best ships 1-on-1. As long as you present a slightly more appealing target, QD will last for a long time.

2 hours ago, Sparklelord said:

I've found the reds not to be an issue; I almost never need to use them. The TIE/sf is one of the best slow rollers on the imperial lineup which means I can rock with 1 forward/bank for quite a while.

I favor Expertise + FCS + Sensor Cluster + LWF on Quickdraw. Sensor Cluster is seriously underrated: gives you the option of using your focus, which you don't need for offense if Expertise is working, like an evade token (assuming you rolled a blank). So when you roll blank focus focus on defense vs 2 hits and want to trigger your QD shot, sensor cluster gives you the ability to only take 1 shield here.

No one likes shooting at Quickdraw. This is good, because Quickdraw is one of the best ships 1-on-1. As long as you present a slightly more appealing target, QD will last for a long time.

I'm also in the school of going all out on Quickdraw, though will swap Sensor Cluster for Pattern Analyzer depending on who I'm flying with. If you feel QD is going to get targeted first, I think Sensor Cluster is great. Otherwise, PA lets her stay on top of the fight much better, especially when she's being ignored, and is never NOT useful. SC doesn't do too much if you're not being shot/use an action other than focus.

3 hours ago, That Blasted Samophlange said:

Quickdraw 29 ps9, Sensor Jammer 4, Intensity 2, Spec ops 0, Comm Relay 3, Lightweight Frame 2.

Quickdraw wants FCS. There really isn't a better option. If you really wanted to try and mitigate shield loss, Sensor Cluster would be better over in the tech slot. Also, Comm Relay only works if you have some way of giving Quickdraw and Evade... So maybe once per match, via Hyperwave Comm Scanner? If you're not trying for Juke, this is really an inefficient use of the slot.

EDIT: I completely missed Intensity in the build, my bad! I still have issues with that, though, which I mention a couple posts down.

personally on backdraft i get more work out of Mk2 than i do LWF. The way he wants to fly hes usually obstructed or R3 to a lot of people that can hit him, so LWF is pointless in that regard. Plus, getting a 2/3 bank after a stress can be vital on him. He does NOT want to stare people down, so he needs to be able to move.

Quickdraw on the other hand is the opposite, she wants to be in a stare-down so LWF is important. The aux arc for her might as well just be a failsafe, dont aim for it but if you get a shot take it. I've rarely ever gotten a splitshot with her that was actually worth it, but with Backdraft it happens quite a few times since the aux arc is the painful arc and its unaffected by the splitfire anyway (usually the front shot misses since its a long shot and no mods but hey dice are dice)

Both of them really, really want FCS. Neither can support PTL very well and FCS lets them focus down people so much better. Putting another sensor on there is wasting time and points.
In Backdraft's case: its unusually likely he will be able to zap the same person twice if not 3 times before losing arc on them (front or aux), so FCS makes total sense there to prevent burning actions on the TL and getting your focus or re-positioning with broll.
In Quickdraw's case: its the Dengar mentality. If shes not range1 and has no mods, there isnt as big of a risk letting her get her revenge shot if you damage her. FCS means she always has a mod, so it makes her much more deadly. On one hand you want people to shoot her for her ability, but on the other hand you want her to stick around until the 1v1 scenario since odds are she WILL win that, especially with FCS revenge shots going out. Technically if you have the points shes a valid Expertise user, but typically that puts her too high on points to bring with most lists.

Pattern Analyzer is almost a must on both since they have so many reds. backdraft typically wont be slooping except to re-engage (thus not getting shots or shot at this round) but he will commonly do a 1 or 3 turn to completely sidestep someone. The amount of times ive had my 2turn be a bad idea but a 1turn be a good idea is kinda ridiculous.

For me, lightweight frame and Fire-Control Systems (and the title of course) are automatic upgrades I slap on any /sf. From there, it depends on the pilot. For anyone aside from Backdraft, my first instinct is to throw Pattern Analyzer on it for reasons others have gone into. PA is still a good idea on Backdraft, though the need to s-loop isn't a major concern. I haven't gotten much use out of Sensor Cluster, but that might be due to forgetting about it. That kind of defensive upgrade is good on Backdraft as, in my experience, he tends to get focused down first as the easy target (based on his wingmen being QuickDraw and Omega Leader). For EPTs, my go to for Backdraft is Vet Instincts to get him up to PS 9, and A Score To Settle on QuickDraw for some added die modding and mind games.

Both named /sf pilots are a lot of fun and I love using them together. They've got a lot of interesting options, including a possibility for some alpha strike builds.

36 minutes ago, ArbitraryNerd said:

Also, Comm Relay only works if you have some way of giving Quickdraw and Evade... So maybe once per match, via Hyperwave Comm Scanner? If you're not trying for Juke, this is really an inefficient use of the slot.

Intensity can give an evade token.

37 minutes ago, kayarn said:

Intensity can give an evade token.

Oops! I was looking at the Expertise build I also quoted, completed missed that Intensity was on there, thank you for pointing that out.

That's a whole different complaint then -- you're paying FIVE points and two slots for a shield upgrade you're not likely to use more than once, because SFs are likely to spend their Focus tokens every round -- they have no way of hoarding them (and using the Evade token to flip Intensity negates the value of Comm Relay).

i am going to try the "Intense Relay" on QD and just see what i can do with it.

The biggest reason i see it being useful is damage control. You WANT her to take damage, but only a single shield. Often when i lose a shield on her i lose 2 of them, or i lose one when i have no shot.

I prefer Quickdraw with adaptability and primed thrusters, just to give yourself better odds of always having arc on a ship. When you dont have arc, thats when they fire at her.

Cruise Missiles are great complements to the SFs. FCS will setup their TL, and a 3 sloop later in the game, allows you to fire a 4 dice missile. It's a cheap 3pts to add that range 2-3 threat your opponent always has to worry about.

Flying backdraft is completely different than the other SFs because you don't care about turning around. Get behind, or on the side, then just do a couple 1 maneuvers, then sloop around for another pass. I like to approach rocks with BD, and then my opponent only has a 50/50 chance of guessing which way I am going. And the 3 bank + b-roll is a powerful maneuver in the SF's arsenal. Backdraft can end up in a million different positions and be just as deadly from either.

Backdraft endgame 1v1 is quite powerful as well. Recently found myself 1v1 vs Asajj.

I could literally spin my dial and have a nice shot with backdraft. Opponent did not know where to go or where to point arc. In this situation, just go where you know you wont get blocked. A 4 straight lands you where Asajj was and doesnt matter what move she dials in as a b-roll gets you out of arc or in range 1 for the final kill shot.

3 hours ago, Vineheart01 said:

i am going to try the "Intense Relay" on QD and just see what i can do with it.

The biggest reason i see it being useful is damage control. You WANT her to take damage, but only a single shield. Often when i lose a shield on her i lose 2 of them, or i lose one when i have no shot.

Sensor Cluster can give the same effect over a more reliable spread of time, AND keep your spot open for a better EPT, including the free Adaptability (though pairs much better with the Expertise version... Other than being double damned by stress).

Sensor Cluster also has an overlap of effects

You have 1 focus. Say you roll Focus Focus and LWF a blank. What good does Sensor Cluster do for you? Jack diddly squat, focus normally for 2 evades.
I stopped using that the instant PA was available because i rarely ever used it. I always either rolled all evades (yay!) or had a focus result anyway when i actually had a focus to spend to mod a blank. Its almost as bad as Weapons Guidance.
Furthermore, QD usually spends her focus on offense so Sensor Cluster is disabled anyway as you have no focus to burn.

The Intense Relay trick banks an evade. QD typically has Debt to Pay for an EPT since she usually gets a lot of yield out of it due to people not wanting to shoot her and get revenge shot'd. IF it proves to be worth while (which i cant deem on paper i need to actually try it) i would gladly trade a little bit of offense to help me get a third revenge shot, or not lose a revenge shot when i get hit and cant fire.

Only main issue is +3pts on the usual QD build. Typically shes 35pts for me, this puts her at 38 and if i want a cruise missile 41pts. While that doesnt sound like much, it pushes other ship combos out. Im not expecting it to be gamebreaking but i like to be surprised lol

33 minutes ago, Vineheart01 said:

Sensor Cluster also has an overlap of effects

You have 1 focus. Say you roll Focus Focus and LWF a blank. What good does Sensor Cluster do for you? Jack diddly squat, focus normally for 2 evades.

You're being unimaginative.

Imagine the roll you described is one where you're defending vs Norra, and have a range 1 shot to Biggs, who burned his astromech on your regular attack.

Now you have to decide whether killing Biggs before he shoots is worth 2 shields. It's definitely worth one, but 2 is costly! Yet if you spend the focus, you're naked for a 4 dice shot. Sensor Cluster gives you the clear best option, in the situation you described.

Sensor Cluster also means that every defense roll you make will produce SOMETHING when you have a focus token to spend. Being assured of not whiffing completely on defense is huge in my book; it's why autothrusters all but demand a focus token, too.

There have admittedly been games where it's never been used. Much in the same way that I've gone entire games not needing to use Adv. SLAM, due to not SLAMming. Paying 2 points for an upgrade that gives you flexibility as opposed to guaranteed use is still fine.

1 hour ago, wurms said:

I prefer Quickdraw with adaptability and primed thrusters, just to give yourself better odds of always having arc on a ship. When you dont have arc, thats when they fire at her.

Cruise Missiles are great complements to the SFs. FCS will setup their TL, and a 3 sloop later in the game, allows you to fire a 4 dice missile. It's a cheap 3pts to add that range 2-3 threat your opponent always has to worry about.

Flying backdraft is completely different than the other SFs because you don't care about turning around. Get behind, or on the side, then just do a couple 1 maneuvers, then sloop around for another pass. I like to approach rocks with BD, and then my opponent only has a 50/50 chance of guessing which way I am going. And the 3 bank + b-roll is a powerful maneuver in the SF's arsenal. Backdraft can end up in a million different positions and be just as deadly from either.

Backdraft endgame 1v1 is quite powerful as well. Recently found myself 1v1 vs Asajj.

I could literally spin my dial and have a nice shot with backdraft. Opponent did not know where to go or where to point arc. In this situation, just go where you know you wont get blocked. A 4 straight lands you where Asajj was and doesnt matter what move she dials in as a b-roll gets you out of arc or in range 1 for the final kill shot.

This is basically the soul of SFs. You can attack from so many directions that they just can't predict where you'll be.

I can recall far, far more times where i rolled a focus w/ cluster than i can wanting to take a damage and actually evading it all instead. Ironically, LWF has cursed me on that one more than anything else (get hit with 3, naturally dodge 2, LWF gives no option so i must roll the third and its another evade FFS lol)

I can only remember 1 time cluster actually helped. Thats it, and i used to be ecstatic about it when it came out since it was the first tech that wasnt trash and wasnt basically unique to a single ship. Except it never worked, i never completely evaded an attack because of it or even got more evades in general, let alone precisely mitigate my damage to only take 1 shield.

Either way the absolute biggest reason why i think the Intense Relay combo is worth checking out is purely because the FOCUS IS NOT USED so i can either use it normally on the same FFB result earlier for 3 evades and not lose a shield at all when i cant get a shot out or use it on offense while also reducing my damage. Plus, its completely action independent once you get the evade banked and only a couple of pilots can actually take that away from you, while your focus can be denied because the positioning forced you to either bump or do a red move (and if were talking sensor cluster then you have no PA to get the focus on red move either)

Again, i dont think its a gamebreaking tactic, just one that might prove to be a min/max slight benefit.

I think I like the idea of the Intense Relay on Backdraft more than Quickdraw. BD has a lower reliance on red moves and tends to be much more about hit-and-run tactics. You fly in, take your shot, take some crit-enhanced aft shots on the way out, and then figure out how you're going to turn around. Plus, QD is already the more expensive ship, so I usually try to keep her lean.