I'm wondering if a swarm deck with 4 characters can be successful or is it too slow? I'd heard about 4x FO Stormtrooper being decent during Awakenings time, but despite getting some more 8-point villains to bring the points right to 30 I haven't seen anything of it since SoR hit. Is it still viable? Cards like Squad Tactics and maybe Wingman seem like they would be perfect for such a deck, but is it just too slow?

I remember in Awakenings my friends hated my 3Trooper/Tusken deck, because of all the yellow cards (dice control, jetpacks, etc.)

Trooper/Trooper/Pilot/Pilot is still really good, in my opinion! I see that deck a lot. Endless Ranks is still very potent, the characters generate a ton of resources and can play lots of upgrades and dice control, and don't suffer as much from enemy dice control. It's also one of the only places you see supports being used really well.

The only reason we didn't see these decks for a while was Poe/Maz. The threat of a Thermal Detonator was too much for four character decks, and so they took to hiding. Now that Poe/Maz isn't what it was competitively (thankfully!) and it's getting beaten up by Emokids and all sorts of Rey decks, the three and four character decks can crawl out of the shadows.

Try 2xFOST/2xTie Pilot. Make it work! Could also swap a tie for a nightsister or Bala. You have a few different combinations to mess with. I haven't seen a 4 char deck in a long time.

I was thinking of Guavian to add Yellow and get access to the likes of Jetpack, Electroshock and He Doesn't Like You.

4 character deck is viable in my local area. It's fun and can win a tournament.

Nightsister + Bala/Guavian + 2 FO is a pretty good list. Gets access to all colors. I ran it with every cheap upgrade possible and just spammed dice. I've also ran it with all the best control + Underworld Contacts and Drudge Work for resource gain. Both versions can hang with most of the two character builds, but Poe/Maz made them unplayable. It's really the Thermal that makes it not work, so if Sabine is any good, then it's even more unplayable.

I have a different take on Poe/Maz and the "swarm". The counter to this deck (and others like it) is to punish it for being so fast. Build decks that weather the storm, wait for your opponent to claim the battlefield, then hammer home your own combos unopposed. Supports with heavy hitting dice can be used to replace lost characters. Think LONG term. Both Heroes and Villains now have the cards to build a round 3 or 4 Juggernaut.

The Villains got a slew of great non-unique cards with good cost to health ratio. Heck, I'd love to try an all red 3x Death Trooper deck with AT-ST, E-Web, and TIEs ready to bring the late round pain. 30 health is nothing to laugh at and red has all the tools to give speed decks problems.

On the Hero side, Supports like the Falcon, Black One, Launch Bay, and U-Wing are all game winners on their own. Heroes also have several cheap characters that excel at disrupting and slowing down an opponent. Snap, Padme, and Mon Mothma being three great examples. The Rebel Commando and Trooper also are cheap and provide a round or two of disruption.

I've played two games where Poe/Maz did 30 damage across four characters by the end of round two. I'll never play a four character deck again while Poe/Maz is running around able to fix a Thermal die. The group gets wiped before they make mid-game. Two characters with 10+ health survive Poe/Maz far better.

Would Rebel Commando x4 be any good? I just got one the other day and noticed they're 10 points a piece so the the thought occurred to me.

x4 would be great. Unfortunately, it's 30 point squads, so x4 would also be cheating.

32 minutes ago, RogueLieutenant said:

Would Rebel Commando x4 be any good? I just got one the other day and noticed they're 10 points a piece so the the thought occurred to me.

You meant Rebel Commando x3, correct? Throw in "Training" and it could be fun.

I've seen Rebel Commando x3 played, and it does decently well, because the Rebel Commando has high health. Sadly her dice isn't as good as the Death Trooper's, and she can't benefit from Endless Ranks like the Death Trooper can. Red hero events are still really good though, so the deck has potential, it's just not as tournament-competitive as the Death Trooper deck.

Side note: I'm not a fan of Training. There's a number of 2-cost weapons better than any non-unique dice except perhaps Hired Gun, who sadly can't use Training. Plus, Isolation is a really common card, so I'd rather have less character dice out there and more upgrade dice. There's a few beneficial events that affect character dice only, but I really just don't think they make Training worth it.

50 minutes ago, somesamurai said:

You meant Rebel Commando x3, correct? Throw in "Training" and it could be fun.

Oops. Yep. Had the number 40 stuck in my head from Imperial Assault.

eSnap/Rebel Trooper/Rebel Commando is good.

Death Trooper x3 is just annoying.

Unkar/Death Trooper x2 is better.

~D

5 hours ago, Kieransi said:

Side note: I'm not a fan of Training. There's a number of 2-cost weapons better than any non-unique dice except perhaps Hired Gun, who sadly can't use Training. Plus, Isolation is a really common card, so I'd rather have less character dice out there and more upgrade dice. There's a few beneficial events that affect character dice only, but I really just don't think they make Training worth it.

I'd mostly agree, I'd make exceptions for death trooper and tie pilot. The former has a really good die and the latter needs a second die to prevent its dice from getting removed (since the pilot's ability is protecting other dice, having two out showing damage will protect each other). However I'd say any upgrade without redeploy has no place in a swarm deck, and that alone is a reason to not include training

9 minutes ago, SwagonBallZ said:

I'd mostly agree, I'd make exceptions for death trooper and tie pilot. ... However I'd say any upgrade without redeploy has no place in a swarm deck, and that alone is a reason to not include training

That's a (VERY) short list. But I agree that training gets the most out of the Death Trooper and the TIE Pilot.

26 minutes ago, Stone37 said:

That's a (VERY) short list.

Indeed! You really do not need many upgrades in a deck that's not running either fn or Rey, but unfortunately you'll need to pepper in a few non-redeploy weapons until the card pool is bigger just to make sure you're not completely upgrade-dry

1 hour ago, SwagonBallZ said:

I'd mostly agree, I'd make exceptions for death trooper and tie pilot. The former has a really good die and the latter needs a second die to prevent its dice from getting removed (since the pilot's ability is protecting other dice, having two out showing damage will protect each other). However I'd say any upgrade without redeploy has no place in a swarm deck, and that alone is a reason to not include training

Thing is, unless you're going to play Cargo Hold, there are only five characters in the game that can use Training, and you mentioned two. So in reality it currently has a very limited number of uses right now. I think it's usefulness is limited, but I would be more than happy to run Training in a eKrennic/Deathtrooper or eIG-88/Deathtrooper deck. That's a powerful dice to have a second of.

11 hours ago, gokubb said:

I've played two games where Poe/Maz did 30 damage across four characters by the end of round two. I'll never play a four character deck again while Poe/Maz is running around able to fix a Thermal die. The group gets wiped before they make mid-game. Two characters with 10+ health survive Poe/Maz far better.

Exacly this. While Poe/Maz is still a thing - 4 char decks are a big no go. Its too easy to kill them with Poe.

13 hours ago, SwagonBallZ said:

Indeed! You really do not need many upgrades in a deck that's not running either fn or Rey, but unfortunately you'll need to pepper in a few non-redeploy weapons until the card pool is bigger just to make sure you're not completely upgrade-dry

Thing is, we have to build decks in the here and now. In the future, a "swarm" deck with 8 to 12 redeploy upgrades sounds great. Right now, you could only reach 8 if you were running a yellow and red villain deck (2xF-11D, 2xZ9 Riot, 2xGaffi Stick, and 2xHoldout Blaster) and 10 if you added Blue to that mix (2xLightsaber).

Red and yellow might not be too bad, but cramming Blue in there too would make for a weak starting die pool.

I still think people are too hung up on speed decks. This is not the only way to win. Red is REALLY good at controlling the battlefield. Yellow can also help in the destruction of supports and upgrades. If you're starting die hit hard enough, you can build a deck around control. Long term, if you know your opponent is spending their resources on upgrades, then keep them poor and have a way to negate or remove said upgrades. When up against an agro deck, you're better off spending your two resources per round negating dice than bringing out new ones for yourself.

So here is my first deck idea:

Character: (30/30)
1x TIE Pilot (Spirit of Rebellion)
2x First Order Stormtrooper (Awakenings)
1x Guavian Enforcer (Spirit of Rebellion)

Battlefield:
1x Ewok Village (Spirit of Rebellion)

Event: (30)
2x Confiscation (Awakenings)
2x Disarm (Awakenings)
2x Electroshock (Awakenings)
2x Endless Ranks (Awakenings)
2x Friends in Low Places (Spirit of Rebellion)
2x He Doesn’t Like You (Awakenings)
2x Go for the Kill (Awakenings)
2x Probe (Awakenings)
2x Reversal (Awakenings)
2x Sabotage (Spirit of Rebellion)
2x Squad Tactics (Awakenings)
2x Suppression (Spirit of Rebellion)
2x Sustained Fire (Spirit of Rebellion)
2x Tactical Mastery (Awakenings)
2x The Best Defense... (Awakenings)

Support: (0)

Upgrade: (0)

Yup... NO UPGRADES. This deck is designed to frustrate and slow your opponent. This deck starts with 4 dice and 12 total damage sides (all ranged) and 5 resource sides. Ewok Village has been chosen because the assumption is this deck will rarely claim the battlefield. Cards like Confiscation and Disarm will keep those big upgrades off he board, and there is plenty of die removal here to further lesson the impact of those upgrades. Cards like Probe are important too. The best way to negate a cheap upgrade is to never let it be played!

IF I were to remove some of these cards, I'd look at SUPPORTS before upgrades. (Attrition, Local Garrison, and Salvage Stand) I'm theory crafting here and look forward to trying this out soon against a few agro decks.

Impressive Stone37.

i'm a big fan of 4 char deck. This one looks awesome!

Btw, i'm currently testing a 4 char deck to counter Poe/Maz... i'm pretty confident i can go above 60% win ratio that way. (Actually not 60%, but with a few tweak...)

Chak

9 hours ago, Chakan99939 said:

Btw, i'm currently testing a 4 char deck to counter Poe/Maz

Im geuinely wondering how you intend to do that considering Poe/Maz is kind of the hardest counter to 4 char decks Mind sharing?

On 7/17/2017 at 2:37 PM, RogueLieutenant said:

Would Rebel Commando x4 be any good? I just got one the other day and noticed they're 10 points a piece so the the thought occurred to me.

I've had fun working my triple Commando decks, although I've yet to take them out of the house. C-3PO makes them work very well, and they are flexible enough to do anything you need them to be doing at the time. Red Hero has access to a lot of good events, and while their character dice isn't great, having 3PO out compensates for that a lot.

2 hours ago, kingbobb said:

I've had fun working my triple Commando decks, although I've yet to take them out of the house. C-3PO makes them work very well, and they are flexible enough to do anything you need them to be doing at the time. Red Hero has access to a lot of good events, and while their character dice isn't great, having 3PO out compensates for that a lot.

C-3PO would be a 1st round must for this deck. I would mulligan all 5 cards if I didn't have him in my starting hand.

On 7/17/2017 at 0:37 PM, RogueLieutenant said:

Would Rebel Commando x4 be any good? I just got one the other day and noticed they're 10 points a piece so the the thought occurred to me.

You can run two of them with Ackbar and Commando Raid. You won't be winning by mill, but you can get Ackbar to proc just enough to get him primaried while building up the commandos.