13 minutes ago, DR4CO said:

And I still find the argument that people should feel bad for winning off the back of an opponent's mistake to be utterly ridiculous.

You probably find it ridiculous because even though you've said you understand the difference between a Turn 10 Maybe-Tactical Mistake and this one, you aren't getting that people saying they wouldn't want to win off a mistake ARE talking about this one.

There's a difference.

Why does it matter.

Telling people to go off the map cuz they angled at 10 degrees off at the start.

Telling people to not fix what is obviously a crap dial

Playing fenn jumpasters in the first place (haha)

Losing with fenn jumpmasters (hahaha)

Paying to play with your own toys in a bunker with smelly old men to win copies of fancy cardboard and plastic you already functionally own (pricelesss!!)

6 hours ago, SaltMaster 5000 said:

There is a right answer, it is not subjective at all. The ship performs its maneuver as dialed. There is nothing in the rules that allows for a 'take backsies' on a maneuver.

What rules justification can you make for allowing your opponent to change their dial?

I think you misunderstood the point I was trying to make. Are the rules subjective? No. But whether somebody thinks you should feel bad about doing it is subjective.

Some players are happy to let a mistake like that slide, for the sake of their opponent's enjoyment of the match and their own, which is completely understandable. Some other players prefer to be strict about it in order to preserve the integrity of the match, which is also understandable.

Should a player feel pressured to be in either camp? No, but neither view is right for everyone either; it's subjective.

24 minutes ago, jesper_h said:

I think you misunderstood the point I was trying to make. Are the rules subjective? No. But whether somebody thinks you should feel bad about doing it is subjective.

Some players are happy to let a mistake like that slide, for the sake of their opponent's enjoyment of the match and their own, which is completely understandable. Some other players prefer to be strict about it in order to preserve the integrity of the match, which is also understandable.

Should a player feel pressured to be in either camp? No, but neither view is right for everyone either; it's subjective.

First you say that the rules are not subjective but feeling bad about applying certain ones can be. Sure.

But then you go on to say that some players prefer to let things like this slide, and others prefer to be strict. Letting it slide is a violation of the rules.

A player should be pressured to follow the rules of the game.

39 minutes ago, SaltMaster 5000 said:

Letting it slide is a violation of the rules.

A player should be pressured to follow the rules of the game.

It's game with no prizes of real importance (i.e. cash), and the first purpose of a game is for the players to have fun. For me, letting this dial issue slide takes precedence over the rules because not letting it slide would defeat the purpose of the game.

1 hour ago, SaltMaster 5000 said:

First you say that the rules are not subjective but feeling bad about applying certain ones can be. Sure.

But then you go on to say that some players prefer to let things like this slide, and others prefer to be strict. Letting it slide is a violation of the rules.

A player should be pressured to follow the rules of the game.

I'm not sure what the issue is here? I'm not calling anybody out or saying anybody is wrong. There's no reason to try and pick holes in my statements or turn this into an argument. Just offering a point of view here, mate.

If you made a mistake in a game, and your opponent offered to let it slide, would you what call a judge over and report them for cheating and violating the rules? Come on, man.

Not read all posts, sorry....

Was he a jerk about it? Did he cry like a little baby? Did you take succour from his tears?

22 minutes ago, FlipmodeSH said:

Not read all posts, sorry....

Was he a jerk about it? Did he cry like a little baby? Did you take succour from his tears?

He only cried until the OP beat him to death with the offending ship. It was a little OTT but rules are rules.

Well it was wise move from you SIR!

I played a SC recently. My opponent set a wrong maneuver off the board (right) not left. I said sorry bub. That sucks. Setting dials is one of the most important things in the game. I ALWAYS triple check before I say I'm ready.

7 hours ago, SaltMaster 5000 said:

A player should follow the rules of the game.

FTFY

3 minutes ago, Fuzzywookie said:

I played a SC recently. My opponent set a wrong maneuver off the board (right) not left. I said sorry bub. That sucks. Setting dials is one of the most important things in the game. I ALWAYS triple check before I say I'm ready.

I think I spend more time checking my dials then actually choosing a manoeuvre, mostly turning the dial so the arrow is pointing the same direction as my ship is facing so I know the turn is the correct direction.

For me, it would depend on the opponent. If I know he's a newer player, then go ahead change the dial. If he's a regular player then I'd call the judge like you did and let him be the bad guy and decide his fate. You didn't make him fly off the board. He did it himself and the judge ruled it that way. You really had no say either way. Setting dials is the most important thing.

What would Yoda do?

26 minutes ago, Tbetts94 said:

If I know he's a newer player, then go ahead change the dial. If he's a regular player then I'd call the judge like you did and let him be the bad guy and decide his fate.

Exactly. Because if it's a newer player, you know it's a mistake that has nothing to do with tactics. But if it's an experienced player, obviously he meant to set his dial to an off-the-board maneuver.

I mean, it just makes sense.

New player you might just turn them off to the game for good.

Experienced player may have just taught them a lesson in a way that they are unlikely to forget.

No single right answer.

Treat others the way you would want to be treated works in most instances though.

6 hours ago, Vampiro_X said:

He only cried until the OP beat him to death with the offending ship. It was a little OTT but rules are rules.

These FAQ updates are getting to be a little much...

12 minutes ago, Jeff Wilder said:

Exactly. Because if it's a newer player, you know it's a mistake that has nothing to do with tactics. But if it's an experienced player, obviously he meant to set his dial to an off-the-board maneuver.

I mean, it just makes sense.

If it's an experienced player, then they know the importance of the dial and should be held to their mistake.

So for example, we have a local player, I love playing against her, great friend, however at regionals her squad sheet was wrong and the TO didn't care. Not big of a deal and it was an obvious mistake. At a tournament she flew off the board for same reason, but an opponent let it slide and let her dial in the correct maneuver, now at store champs she was running a Tie Fighter with a Tie FO dial multiple rounds before I noticed it, obvious mistake and we know it wasn't intended to be cheating, but then there was no consequences.

Things happen by accident, but until the player faces the consequences they are never going to learn.

I check my dials numerous times because I know if I dialed in the wrong maneuver I am not going to put my opponent in a position like that. It's not fair to him. If I did a mistake like that, then I would call the judge over myself to make that decision.

11 minutes ago, Tbetts94 said:

If it's an experienced player, then they know the importance of the dial and should be held to their mistake.

Right. Because no newer player knows the dial is important in the game.

Quote

Things happen by accident, but until the player faces the consequences they are never going to learn.

Not only is this simply a self-serving justification, any behavioral psychologist will tell you that negative reinforcement is not even close to the best way to learn.

Quote

I check my dials numerous times because I know if I dialed in the wrong maneuver I am not going to put my opponent in a position like that. It's not fair to him. If I did a mistake like that, then I would call the judge over myself to make that decision.

That's fantastic for you.

If you were playing me, however, and set an off-the-board maneuver as an obvious non-tactical mistake, you wouldn't have to do that.

Because actually playing the game is more important to me than teaching somebody a vital, life-changing lesson in how brutal things can be in the real world when you get distracted (or are dyslexic) and set a dial wrong.

I know, I know ... I'm just a latte-swilling libtard cuck.

8 minutes ago, Jeff Wilder said:

Right. Because no newer player knows the dial is important in the game.

Not only is this simply a self-serving justification, any behavioral psychologist will tell you that negative reinforcement is not even close to the best way to learn.

That's fantastic for you.

If you were playing me, however, and set an off-the-board maneuver as an obvious non-tactical mistake, you wouldn't have to do that.

Because actually playing the game is more important to me than teaching somebody a vital, life-changing lesson in how brutal things can be in the real world when you get distracted (or are dyslexic) and set a dial wrong.

I know, I know ... I'm just a latte-swilling libtard cuck.

Exaggeration. I'm not saying it's a life changing lesson.

I had the hardest time remembering Rebel Captive. Even though it's a MUST mechanic I treated it as a MAY and repeatedly put the missed triggers on myself until I learned them, because each time my opponent let me do it when I was first using it I still kept forgetting.

I'm not saying to be a **** about it. I'm saying let the TO rule on it and let it be whatever he decides. A player shouldn't be put in a position like that in the first place.

I would have let him change it in this example, but on the flip side at a tournament I also would not have gotten upset over someone not letting me do the same thing. Then again, I wouldn't immediately drop either. So whatever. I'd have rather just played the game either way. I am not the most competitive of players though, so....

I'm struggling to think of a more hollow victory in this game.

Just now, mfairhu1 said:

I'm struggling to think of a more hollow victory in this game.

Flying jumpmasters?

2 minutes ago, kris40k said:

Flying jumpmasters?

**** someone beat me to it.