As the title says, if the mission involves a monster group that is not placed during setup (like the finales for LoR), can you and how do you use an agent.

I see a couple options:

1.) You cannot use that group for deploying the Agent (I doubt it, as that would greatly limit Agent usage)

2.) You remove the correlating masters/minions, but do not place the Agent until the mission allows you to place a figure from the Monster group.

3.) You remove the correlating masters/minions, and place the Agent during setup (I doubt it, because WHERE to place him is then a completely different issue).

I pick 2. Any official ruling? Any other opinions?

The Overlord cannot summon an agent during an Interlude or the Finale.

The following is an excerpt from the Lieutenant Rules. The part in bold is my emphasis.

********************************************

Agents

Some Plot cards allow the overlord to use a lieutenant figure as an agent in an open monster group. The Agent card corresponding to the current act lists the agent’s characteristics, abilities, and attack dice. An agent is treated as a master monster within its open monster group with the following exceptions:

• Regardless of quest rules, an agent cannot be placed as a reinforcement.
• When an agent is defeated, the overlord must return the Plot card that summoned the agent back to his Plot deck. The card may be purchased again.
• As described on the Plot card, the overlord cannot use an agent in any quest that features the lieutenant version of that agent. Additionally, the overlord cannot use some agents in specific campaigns. For example, the overlord cannot use Baron Zachareth as an agent while playing “The Shadow Rune” campaign because it features Baron Zachareth as an important lieutenant in that campaign.

Plot cards that allow the overlord to summon an agent often require him to replace master and minion monsters of an open group after setup of an encounter. If the overlord cannot meet the replacement requirements, he replaces the entire open group.

When an agent is placed in a monster group, that agent and the monsters in that group are treated as if they are part of the same monster group. While the agent is on the map, the overlord cannot use the monster
figures it replaced as reinforcements, regardless of quest rules.

The overlord cannot summon an agent during an Interlude or a Finale.

Unlike lieutenants, an agent cannot wield a relic.

1 hour ago, tomkat364 said:

As the title says, if the mission involves a monster group that is not placed during setup (like the finales for LoR), can you and how do you use an agent.

Also, if it is not an interlude or finale, if the placement of a monster group that is not placed at the beginning of the encounter is listed under "Reinforcements", the agent cannot be deployed either because, as any2cards quoted: Regardless of quest rules, an agent cannot be placed as a reinforcement .

1 minute ago, Ispher said:

Also, if it is not an interlude or finale, if the placement of a monster group that is not placed at the beginning of the encounter is listed under "Reinforcements", the agent cannot be deployed either because, as any2cards quoted: Regardless of quest rules, an agent cannot be placed as a reinforcement .

But how about those quests where open groups are placed based on other conditions in the quest text? There are quite a lot of those in the Mists + Chains quests. There is another thread here with the official answer on whether you can place enchanting class-cards on these kinds of groups. The answer was yes. Therefore, shouldn't placing an agent using one of these groups follow the same principle?

1 hour ago, Sidious78 said:

But how about those quests where open groups are placed based on other conditions in the quest text? There are quite a lot of those in the Mists + Chains quests. There is another thread here with the official answer on whether you can place enchanting class-cards on these kinds of groups. The answer was yes. Therefore, shouldn't placing an agent using one of these groups follow the same principle?

Yes, you can add an agent to an open monster group that is placed on the map at some point mid-quest so long as its not placed as part of the "Reinforcement" section of the quest rules. Example: The quest "Without Mercy" in Shadows of Nerekhall places the open group on the Altar after revealing the unique search token.

Such a group could have an agent. However, the agent must have been assigned to the group at the start of the encounter.

2 hours ago, any2cards said:

The Overlord cannot summon an agent during an Interlude or the Finale.

The following is an excerpt from the Lieutenant Rules. The part in bold is my emphasis.

********************************************

Agents

Some Plot cards allow the overlord to use a lieutenant figure as an agent in an open monster group. The Agent card corresponding to the current act lists the agent’s characteristics, abilities, and attack dice. An agent is treated as a master monster within its open monster group with the following exceptions:

• Regardless of quest rules, an agent cannot be placed as a reinforcement.
• When an agent is defeated, the overlord must return the Plot card that summoned the agent back to his Plot deck. The card may be purchased again.
• As described on the Plot card, the overlord cannot use an agent in any quest that features the lieutenant version of that agent. Additionally, the overlord cannot use some agents in specific campaigns. For example, the overlord cannot use Baron Zachareth as an agent while playing “The Shadow Rune” campaign because it features Baron Zachareth as an important lieutenant in that campaign.

Plot cards that allow the overlord to summon an agent often require him to replace master and minion monsters of an open group after setup of an encounter. If the overlord cannot meet the replacement requirements, he replaces the entire open group.

When an agent is placed in a monster group, that agent and the monsters in that group are treated as if they are part of the same monster group. While the agent is on the map, the overlord cannot use the monster
figures it replaced as reinforcements, regardless of quest rules.

The overlord cannot summon an agent during an Interlude or a Finale.

Unlike lieutenants, an agent cannot wield a relic.

Okay, so I chose a bad example for the encounter. But the question stands. There are several quests we have come across in which there are groups that are not placed at setup, but trickle in at other times. For instance, I believe Web of Power was one. The cave spiders drop in when the webs are activated. Can you just NOT use the cave spiders as the group to include the agent, or does the agent just act like any old cave spider that gets spawned. (I don't have the campaign book in front of me, so if perchance the spiders are listed as reinforcements, then I guess it would be covered in the previous rules. But I feel certain there are other circumstances in which monster groups are placed AFTER setup but not listed specifically as reinforcements. If not, then Agents seem to be rarely worthwhile, as you would often be forced to replace both Arachyura or both Ettins rather than replacing relatively worthless figures.)

11 minutes ago, tomkat364 said:

Okay, so I chose a bad example for the encounter. But the question stands. There are several quests we have come across in which there are groups that are not placed at setup, but trickle in at other times. For instance, I believe Web of Power was one. The cave spiders drop in when the webs are activated. Can you just NOT use the cave spiders as the group to include the agent, or does the agent just act like any old cave spider that gets spawned. (I don't have the campaign book in front of me, so if perchance the spiders are listed as reinforcements, then I guess it would be covered in the previous rules. But I feel certain there are other circumstances in which monster groups are placed AFTER setup but not listed specifically as reinforcements. If not, then Agents seem to be rarely worthwhile, as you would often be forced to replace both Arachyura or both Ettins rather than replacing relatively worthless figures.)

You would not be able to replace the said cave spiders with the agent, because they are not an open group. However, as stated earlier, you can use agents in open groups that are placed after setup provided its not under the Reinforcement rules.

Some agents just aren't worth using most of the time because you give up too many figures for them - however Kobolds are a great open group for many such cases because you still get a decent number of additional figures after most replacements.