1 hour ago, Mirith said:

I 100% believe that they will splat L5R into Genesys. Anything else doesn't make fiscal sense.

We'll see. Feel free to save an 'I told you so' just for me.??

I still think it will be a stand-alone.

13 hours ago, Kuni Katsuyoshi said:

Some schools (Lions Shadow) say SPECIFICALLY that it is not. Others, however, are not so clear cut. I think that's something that needs clearer definition in the future.

From what I've heard, that honour loss negation wasn't a certain thing heading into 4e, and I have a feeling that wouldn't have been a bad thing. Honour doesn't allow for your actions to slide by without judgement, and if any particular samurai wants to behave like it can, then that's what Perceived Honour is for. Ikoma LS, Shosuro Infiltrators, et al are low honour samurai.

7 hours ago, Kinzen said:

Daimyo orders you to kill a child: Duty says obey, Compassion says spare the kid.

Compassion as a tenet of Bushido says to protect and guide the lower castes of Rokugan from what fates may befall them if you do not, not that not killing is always compassionate. The samurai are those-who-serve and those-who-make-war. Common honour would sate one's requirement to follow Compassion by protecting the clan's peasants from the armies of other clans, bandits, criminals, foreigners, shadowlands beasts, etc. Further, a samurai should be aware of what fate they're consigning the child to by leaving them alive. That could very well not be compassionate in comparison with swift passage to the next life. Even more so, if they could end up living as a ronin, bandit, or otherwise court ill karma (and rebirth into a lesser caste) through fear, desire, and regret.

I will reiterate that my problem is not with the overall moral decision making is the problem. I think the opposite and that is part of what makes the game interesting. My problem is with the mechanics attached to the moral decision making.

Do you want different mechanics, or do you want no mechanics at all?

1 minute ago, Kitsu Seinosuke said:

Do you want different mechanics, or do you want no mechanics at all?

Honestly, no generic mechanics. I could see it being good for a specific subset (Example, Matsu Honor-Bushi has some way of tracking it, but that has its own set of problems since its an extra system for an individual class), but it should have no specified mechanical benefit.

40 minutes ago, Mirith said:

Honestly, no generic mechanics. I could see it being good for a specific subset (Example, Matsu Honor-Bushi has some way of tracking it, but that has its own set of problems since its an extra system for an individual class), but it should have no specified mechanical benefit.

You'd need to add Akodo bushi, and Iron Warriors in as well.

??

Seems to me you can adapt the Duty/Obligation system of the SWRPG into an Honor system in L5R pretty easily.

3 minutes ago, RandomJC said:

Seems to me you can adapt the Duty/Obligation system of the SWRPG into an Honor system in L5R pretty easily.

I've had similar thoughts. It wouldn't surprise me if FFG does that.

3 minutes ago, Kuni Katsuyoshi said:

I've had similar thoughts. It wouldn't surprise me if FFG does that.

Even with the changing of reasons of Duty to tenants of Bushido. A tweak to the spending rules, maybe. You start with 10 points in honor, spend it for more XP or Cash. Then through acts in the game you gain honor back by representing your bushido choice.

That sounds an awful lot like a dumbing down of a system I already enjoy. I've played the FFG SW game and I really wasn't impressed. I think many people would just prefer to stick to 4e rather than jump into an entirely different environment. Just look at what happened to DnD 4e. It was too different so it died.

26 minutes ago, RandomJC said:

Even with the changing of reasons of Duty to tenants of Bushido. A tweak to the spending rules, maybe. You start with 10 points in honor, spend it for more XP or Cash. Then through acts in the game you gain honor back by representing your bushido choice.

Given the importance of the notion in Rokugani culture, an Obligation style mechanic could be pretty flavorful. Maybe as a balancer for an Honor/Duty mechanic.

7 minutes ago, player2636234 said:

That sounds an awful lot like a dumbing down of a system I already enjoy. I've played the FFG SW game and I really wasn't impressed. I think many people would just prefer to stick to 4e rather than jump into an entirely different environment. Just look at what happened to DnD 4e. It was too different so it died.

Well won't have anything official for a day or two yet (we hope ).

So your dream isn't dead yet.

I think it's lucky we 4e to fall back on if their (first) attempt is a bust.

14 minutes ago, player2636234 said:

That sounds an awful lot like a dumbing down of a system I already enjoy. I've played the FFG SW game and I really wasn't impressed. I think many people would just prefer to stick to 4e rather than jump into an entirely different environment. Just look at what happened to DnD 4e. It was too different so it died.

4e Also had a concerted effort by people who didn't want a new system and purposefully overblew it's flaws to bring the game down. the fact that 5th ed is just as different from 3.5 as 4e yet is embraced is kind of proof of that.

As far as SW it's a different system that works to a different kind of player, it's a very good system if you like that kind of play. It isn't a dumbed down version of anything, it's just a different system with different priorities.

1 hour ago, RandomJC said:

It isn't a dumbed down version of anything

In my opinion, the special dice system actually has more mechanical complexity (not necessarily depth, mind you) and greater bookkeeping requirements than R&K. Like, there is friggin' weapon degradation and enough random table calls that you can roll more d100 than special dice in a combat.

31 minutes ago, AtoMaki said:

In my opinion, the special dice system actually has more mechanical complexity (not necessarily depth, mind you) and greater bookkeeping requirements than R&K. Like, there is friggin' weapon degradation and enough random table calls that you can roll more d100 than special dice in a combat.

Suppose it does. I've always been a fast and loose with the rules kind of GM.

9 hours ago, BitRunr said:

Compassion as a tenet of Bushido says to protect and guide the lower castes of Rokugan from what fates may befall them if you do not, not that not killing is always compassionate.

I'm aware, but the posited scenario was one in which killing the child was the wrong thing to do even under Rokugan's rather specialized idea of how samurai should interact with peasants, such that striking the kid down would cause you to lose Honor even if it was your duty. So we're talking about a hypothetical situation where Compassion does in fact say that you should spare the child's life.

19 hours ago, Tonbo Karasu said:

I have a half-way complete version of honour using the Pendragon system. I'll look out the link to it tomorrow.

Here it is, with very little detail in it

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1RrDbHT-K8YbRtUjPB1xW8vvb8KUnMr7rJSz5c4046gU/edit?usp=sharing

16 hours ago, Mirith said:

I 100% believe that they will splat L5R into Genesys. Anything else doesn't make fiscal sense.

I bet you are right, unfortunately...

3 hours ago, RandomJC said:

4e Also had a concerted effort by people who didn't want a new system and purposefully overblew it's flaws to bring the game down. the fact that 5th ed is just as different from 3.5 as 4e yet is embraced is kind of proof of that.

That's not exactly correct. The 5th edition of D&D is as different from 3.5 as 4th was in scale. But it is different in another way. Take it from me, I dislike both 4e and 5e for different reasons altogether...

6 minutes ago, Mirumoto Saito said:

That's not exactly correct. The 5th edition of D&D is as different from 3.5 as 4th was in scale. But it is different in another way. Take it from me, I dislike both 4e and 5e for different reasons altogether...

That is what I meant with that. But 5th ed didn't receive the same kind of lashing for being different that 4th did.

2 minutes ago, RandomJC said:

That is what I meant with that. But 5th ed didn't receive the same kind of lashing for being different that 4th did.

In my case, 5th feels a bit like 2nd and that's what I started on. So, I like it. 4th felt like they were trying to attract WoW players.

4 minutes ago, RandomJC said:

That is what I meant with that. But 5th ed didn't receive the same kind of lashing for being different that 4th did.

That's because 4th edition tried to be a very specific different thing from the editions before, but 5th edition tried to steal the best bits of all previous editions, and add a little new.

Just now, Tonbo Karasu said:

That's because 4th edition tried to be a very specific different thing from the editions before, but 5th edition tried to steal the best bits of all previous editions, and add a little new.

:cough: 13th Age

1 minute ago, Coyote Walks said:

:cough: 13th Age

New to D&D, I should have said.

2 minutes ago, Coyote Walks said:

:cough: 13th Age

You should have that checked out. It could be contagious ?

9 minutes ago, Kuni Katsuyoshi said:

In my case, 5th feels a bit like 2nd and that's what I started on. So, I like it. 4th felt like they were trying to attract WoW players.

8 minutes ago, Tonbo Karasu said:

That's because 4th edition tried to be a very specific different thing from the editions before, but 5th edition tried to steal the best bits of all previous editions, and add a little new.

I wouldn't call either of these things bad things about 4th ed. The fact that it was different was the only reason it was called a bad game. (Whether that's what you wanted from D&D is a different story.)

But take that with a grain of salt, I don't really like D&D. I find it overly complicated with too many niche things that can be a major pain in the *** if you aren't well versed in whatever random side book it was drawn from.