highly doubt you'll see any bombs apart from manaroo because the base package of ML + k4 is far too good on scouts, and Dengar/Tel is packing k4s as well

and honestly yeah, the JM5k is pretty stupid. It's a very good benchmark to demonstrate how the SCURGG does not merit all the panic going on around it.

2 minutes ago, ficklegreendice said:

highly doubt you'll see any bombs apart from manaroo because the base package of ML + k4 is far too good on scouts, and Dengar/Tel is packing k4s as well

and honestly yeah, the JM5k is pretty stupid. It's a very good benchmark to demonstrate how the SCURGG does not merit all the panic going on around it.

I think the Scout bomber is pretty good anti-ace tech for Rau-boats, especially because of that white sloop.

6 minutes ago, Admiral Deathrain said:

I think the Scout bomber is pretty good anti-ace tech for Rau-boats, especially because of that white sloop.

you have to get through the other jm5ks first, though

large base fatness + obstacles are going to make it difficult to thread that particular needle

it's a right pain up the *** perhaps for double fang attani, but without k4 and ordnance it won't challenge other jm5ks

plus, while the white sloop is stupid, you can totally see it coming because it's a single maneuver. ADV. SLAM it is not

NOTE: I don't intend to defend the state of jm5ks, only claim that they're far too dumb as is to care about the new things in the SCURGG

nor to claim that the SCURGG sucks, because I think the named pilots have potential and that's a good thing (why release a *** ship?). But it's nowhere near the monster some folks are making it out to be because it is incredibly easy to burn down relative to its cost and it gets pretty expensive pretty quickly. It has strengths and it has weaknesses

18 minutes ago, ficklegreendice said:

In a closer parallel, you don't see many wardens sporting TLTs because they're focused on A-SLAMING ACTION: bombs that leverage their low ps to overlap bombs (or liter them right in front of the movement pegs) before the enemy even activates

Exactly. And you don't see TLT Y-Wings sporting Bomb Loadout and Seismic Charges because the more expensive they get, the less efficient they become.

TLT Y-Wings are superior to the Scurrg build posgted above because you can take four of them, but you can only take 3 Scurrgs. Now, the 33 point Scurrg might potentially be a useful third ship in a 3-ship Scum build, but probably not considering it's competition at that price point. i.e. Fenn, Teroch, Palob, any number of JM5K builds, possibly even fixed Guri.

Seriously Thormind, that Scurgg really isn't up to much. It's expensive for what it offers, has a limited dial and essentially prices you out of a 4 ship build. There are much more effective ways to spend your points.

not to claim to see the future or anything, but I'ma go out on a limb and say you will basically never see the generics while the jm5k exists in its current capacity

the named pilots, the ones that actually make this bomber a bomber , have potential imo

2 minutes ago, ficklegreendice said:

not to claim to see the future or anything, but I'ma go out on a limb and say you will basically never see the generics while the jm5k exists in its current capacity

the named pilots, the ones that actually make this bomber a bomber , have potential imo

So much so that we won't even get a Rebel generic...

Just now, Rinzler in a Tie said:

So much so that we won't even get a Rebel generic...

like the ARC

turned out alright, honestly, even if FFG really didn't have to be so conservative with Braylen/Thane (remove die roll for Braylen, remove "another friendly" from Thane) and really screw over poor Shara

but that's just me whinging

On ‎6‎/‎17‎/‎2017 at 9:29 AM, clanofwolves said:

Ah the smooth sounds of calm non-reactionary retorts.

Yes FFG deserves all the sh** storm we can muster about the Jumpmaster Expansion, that I think we all can agree wholeheartedly on.

They MUST be planning an actual nerf, must be, for they are not stupid; they want to continue the money making game. It's happening soon, btw.

However, the new "Guns for Hire" Aces Expansion and this Bomber are fine by me, for they'll be fun and they're not Jumps and Attani. Yay!!

I was talking to my playgroup about the Jumpmaster. With its impressive move dial, I think the easiest way to balance it would be to take away the 360 potential. The ship is designed for excellent movement, so getting people back in your firing arc should be how that ship flies. 360 primary weapon was just too much.

23 minutes ago, ficklegreendice said:

not to claim to see the future or anything, but I'ma go out on a limb and say you will basically never see the generics while the jm5k exists in its current capacity

the named pilots, the ones that actually make this bomber a bomber , have potential imo

The generic we know of has no EPT. Most EPT-less generics haven't really been viable for other than blocking for at least 2 years AFAIK.

2 minutes ago, LordBlades said:

The generic we know of has no EPT. Most EPT-less generics haven't really been viable for other than blocking for at least 2 years AFAIK.

the 3 has an ept in the spoiler, peeking out from behind the ps 1's card

6 minutes ago, LordBlades said:

The generic we know of has no EPT. Most EPT-less generics haven't really been viable for other than blocking for at least 2 years AFAIK.

Except for Wardens, who are incredible because of the unique mechanics of the K-Wing.

47 minutes ago, ficklegreendice said:

you have to get through the other jm5ks first, though

large base fatness + obstacles are going to make it difficult to thread that particular needle

it's a right pain up the *** perhaps for double fang attani, but without k4 and ordnance it won't challenge other jm5ks

plus, while the white sloop is stupid, you can totally see it coming because it's a single maneuver. ADV. SLAM it is not

Against other large bases it at least is equivalent to getting an undefendable combat phase 6 dice with TL attack, not too shabby either.

Contracted Scout (25)
Attanni Mindlink (1)
Extra Munitions (2)
Cad Bane (2)
Cluster Mines (4)

Contracted Scout (25)
Attanni Mindlink (1)
Extra Munitions (2)
Plasma Torpedoes (3)
K4 Security Droid (3)
Guidance Chips (0)

Fenn Rau (28)
Attanni Mindlink (1)
Autothrusters (2)
Concord Dawn Protector (1)

Total: 100

View in Yet Another Squad Builder

Looks like a strong sidegrade that targets low HP ships without scarificing too much power to other lists.

5 hours ago, Rinzler in a Tie said:

I only take issue with your claim that bombs (continue?) to take skill.

You can now drop all of your bombs during setup OR drop a bomb every turn. OR both.
Sabine and Cad make the damage automatic.

Not trying to pick a fight with everyone who thinks this game is beyond reproach and there's little to worry abouti, just saying... You're wrong.

Bombs still take some skill. Minefield mapper doesn't remove that. It makes it easy to drop bombs, but they'll be far less useful that way than if you hold onto them and drop them more strategically. If anything removes the skill, it's advanced slam.

And cad doesn't make the damage automatic, just more likely. It's entirely possible to reeroll blanks and eyeballs into more blanks and eyeballs. He also doesn't let you do any more dmage than the bomb can on its own like sabine does.

3 hours ago, Thormind said:

It can still chose Corner or Cluster you know. But thats much more expansive. Look at this:

Karthakk Pirate — Scurrg H-6 Bomber	24
Twin Laser Turret	6
Bomblet Generator	3
Ship Total: 33

Thats a hell of a ship for 33pts! I would say it's going to be the best ordnance ship per point invested in the entire game... and it's scum again. With that you still have place for 2-3 good partners.

Of course Miranda is going to be better if you gear her for 40+ pts...

Bomblet Generator...isn't that good on a PS1.

The sky is falling... again?

RoV

On 6/18/2017 at 0:24 PM, ScummyRebel said:

They have the best epic toys right now.

Also, Soontir Fel says hello. He was how good for how long again?

I would ban soontir in a heartbeat if it meant we could fly the ship with any other pilot. Same with Corran and the Ewing's I'm sure. Same with Biggs and the xwing. One super pilot a ship hasn't ever been a good thing for the game as a whole.

3 hours ago, Superstrength79 said:

I was talking to my playgroup about the Jumpmaster. With its impressive move dial, I think the easiest way to balance it would be to take away the 360 potential. The ship is designed for excellent movement, so getting people back in your firing arc should be how that ship flies. 360 primary weapon was just too much.

360 arc with 3 attack dice. Limit the dice to 2. Or as you suggest the front arc.

21 minutes ago, BlodVargarna said:

360 arc with 3 attack dice. Limit the dice to 2.

The Jumpmaster is a 360 degree arc with 2 attack dice.

The Punishing One Title costs you 12 points for that one attack dice bump.

Just now, E Chu Ta said:

The Jumpmaster is a 360 degree arc with 2 attack dice.

The Punishing One Title costs you 12 points for that one attack dice bump.

Ah-ha.

On 6/17/2017 at 6:11 AM, Sekac said:

This paragraph took me on such a sweet journey! Only 24 words, but probably the most confusing/philosophical 24 words I've ever read.

"The only faction that gets generics with EPT"

I'm already locked in. Ready to retort with "except for the other two factions" or something similar. But I could already tell it wasn't worth it, and so read on...

"Undercosted ships, under costed EPT, and under costed crew"

Not true; fair enough, but comparing faction specific EPTs is kinda pointless given how few there are; not true at all.

And then:

"Enough with the bad tasting jokes hey."

That "oh this guy is scissor drunk" moment. This isn't internet belligerence. This is drunk internet belligerence. Where do I sign and how much is your popcorn?

*Edit* totally meant to say " actually drunk" not "scissor drunk" but scissor drunk is, will be, and always should have been a thing. So I'm keeping it. You win this round, autocorrect.

"scissor drunk" - when you have had so much you should not be operating scissors.

1 hour ago, VanderLegion said:

Bombs still take some skill. Minefield mapper doesn't remove that. It makes it easy to drop bombs, but they'll be far less useful that way than if you hold onto them and drop them more strategically. If anything removes the skill, it's advanced slam.

I'd even argue that successful use of Minefield Mapper is akin to asteroid placement mastery, which is something that most players barely scratch (I should know that only being really confident in my placement for one list) as it requires the ability to plan for several posibilities at the same time, for several turns (heck, even the entire game!) ahead. It is easier than asteroids because you have more information and aren't disrupted by your opponents actions, but the investment also is a lot higher when you basicaly fly your list at a handicap equal to the worth of mines you put out, which makes your descisions more important.

Mechanicaly it is of course infinitely easier to place your mines where you want them instead of having to manouver there, no discussion here.

4 hours ago, Thormind said:

Cost to defense??

Karthakk Pirate — Scurrg H-6 Bomber	24
Twin Laser Turret	6
Bomblet Generator	3
Ship Total: 33

You are looking at a 33 pts small ship with a defense thats close to a large ship and really good offense. The bomblet protect the ship against the one weakness of TLTs: range 1 attacks. You can add Bane or Bombardier as a crew and still have many points left for partners.

You're gonna bring up the generic to try and weasel out of an ignorant comment, seriously? It's the worse option we've seen so far. As Fickle pointed out it's low PS meaning that the opponent will see where you drop the bomb. This makes the bombs almost useless against anything with movement shenanigans(BR/Boost), that's only about 90% of the meta at any given time. This means you'll have a ship taking up a third of your list that's only doing 1-2 damage a turn and still dies rather easily due to not having any real damage mitigation. If high health for the points was enough on it's own to keep a ship relevant and competitive we'd still be seeing B-wings, but we don't do we?

I'd also like to point out that any ship costing a third of your list SHOULD be able to hold it's own. Just compare it to the other options available for 33 points for any given faction. I mean hell for 2 more points you could run Miranda with just a TLT and accomplish much in the same but a hell of a lot better due to regaining a shield every turn and being able to get the hell out of dodge with SLAM.

Admit it, the only reason you're whining is because it's Scum, not because it's actually broken or a NPE. They could give S&V uglies with 1 red & green die and 2 health for 30 points and you'd still probably whine about it.

15 minutes ago, BomberGob said:

Admit it, the only reason you're whining is because it's Scum, not because it's actually broken or a NPE. They could give S&V uglies with 1 red & green die and 2 health for 30 points and you'd still probably whine about it.

I know I would! Scum sucks!

3 hours ago, BomberGob said:

You're gonna bring up the generic to try and weasel out of an ignorant comment, seriously? It's the worse option we've seen so far. As Fickle pointed out it's low PS meaning that the opponent will see where you drop the bomb. This makes the bombs almost useless against anything with movement shenanigans(BR/Boost), that's only about 90% of the meta at any given time. This means you'll have a ship taking up a third of your list that's only doing 1-2 damage a turn and still dies rather easily due to not having any real damage mitigation. If high health for the points was enough on it's own to keep a ship relevant and competitive we'd still be seeing B-wings, but we don't do we?

I'd also like to point out that any ship costing a third of your list SHOULD be able to hold it's own. Just compare it to the other options available for 33 points for any given faction. I mean hell for 2 more points you could run Miranda with just a TLT and accomplish much in the same but a hell of a lot better due to regaining a shield every turn and being able to get the hell out of dodge with SLAM.

Admit it, the only reason you're whining is because it's Scum, not because it's actually broken or a NPE. They could give S&V uglies with 1 red & green die and 2 health for 30 points and you'd still probably whine about it.

My issue is not whether or not the SCURRG is broken or not (but probably closer to being broken than useless), my issue is that it is really hard to imagine that the SCURRG and the K-wing are supposed to be at the level of the Punisher.

That the 3 points difference between the SCURRG's and Lambda's cost can account for the massive boost it gets in upgrade slots, actions, and dial.

As of now, I can only imagine 3 possible scenarios that answers these.

- FFG designers are incompetent
- FFG favors 1 faction over the others
- FFG is planning a *massive* nerf to Jumpmaster, and they are trying to give alternative options before the FAQ hits.

One of these, (at least to my mind) has to be true. I cannot see why else would FFG do this.

3 hours ago, BomberGob said:

You're gonna bring up the generic to try and weasel out of an ignorant comment, seriously?

?? You can disagree with me but what i said is not ignorant at all. First of all that ship has a potential for doing up to 4 points of dmg/turn. 2 of those are quite reliable (TLT). The goal of the bomb here is to protect the range 1 bubble of the TLT and control the battlefield more than doing it's dmg. Look at it has a dissuasive tool. It creates a big zone where your opponent ships wont want to go, thus reducing the number of available good maneuver options.

3 hours ago, BomberGob said:

This makes the bombs almost useless against anything with movement shenanigans(BR/Boost), that's only about 90% of the meta at any given time. This means you'll have a ship taking up a third of your list that's only doing 1-2 damage a turn and still dies rather easily due to not having any real damage mitigation. If high health for the points was enough on it's own to keep a ship relevant and competitive we'd still be seeing B-wings, but we don't do we?

What??? A ship has to waste an action to get out of the bomb range and you think it's bad?? Most good player will tell you that action economy is a big part of the game. Using a bomb that cost no action to make your opponent waste one is a pretty good move, wouldnt you agree? If at the same time it puts said ship outside of your range 1 then thats a double ++ for you.

There are also situations where youll move by 1 after droping that bomb. As a ps1 ship you might have some chance to block a ship before it can do it's movement shenanigans. Guess what that ship is going to eat?

You are also forgetting that a lot of scums pilot/ship rely on some range and or positioning to do their things: Shadowcaster, Fenn, Old Teroch, Dengar, TalonBane and Guri (after their boost), etc. Having a partner that can help control your opponent position is a significant addition to the faction.

Think what you want but like i said, this ship is IMO the best of the 3 spoiled so far for wave 11. And yes, the fact that it's scum upset many people because it's already the dominating faction by a HUGE margin. It's not just a little better, it's already way ahead of the other 2 factions.

Also i dont know what kind of game you are playing but a ship with 5 hull, 5 shield and 1 agi doesnt have bad defense in my book.

Generally when my Bombers dump a seismic im deterring him from following me so closely so i can turn around, not trying to do damage. If i do damage, cool, if not, hes far enough away where im safe a turn or two.

Not everything has to do damage to be viable. Wasting turns/actions is just as good if you have a reason for doing so.

Just now, Vineheart01 said:

Generally when my Bombers dump a seismic im deterring him from following me so closely so i can turn around, not trying to do damage. If i do damage, cool, if not, hes far enough away where im safe a turn or two.

Not everything has to do damage to be viable. Wasting turns/actions is just as good if you have a reason for doing so.

Thank you!