Sorry if this has already been asked:answered. Didn't have time to scroll through 9 pages. Will Minefield maps work with extra munitions? You don't actually get two bomb upgrades. You get one with an ordinance token.
So it seems you will have to discard your upgrade to add one bomb, but you can't add two if you have extra munitions.
Just now, jwilliamson12 said:Sorry if this has already been asked:answered. Didn't have time to scroll through 9 pages. Will Minefield maps work with extra munitions? You don't actually get two bomb upgrades. You get one with an ordinance token.
So it seems you will have to discard your upgrade to add one bomb, but you can't add two if you have extra munitions.
There's a debate on that. I agree with the "1 per bomb, not 1 per bomb use." position.
1 hour ago, Rakaydos said:There's a debate on that. I agree with the "1 per bomb, not 1 per bomb use." position.
That's how I read it too. Coorispinding means one token (or set for cluster mines) per one upgrade card. It means if you want to litter the battlefield with bombs, it'll cost you.
*edit: now that I'm thinking about how the cards are worded, I guess it makes sense that you use the ordinance tokens to play the bombs durning setup, but keep the upgrades to use during combat.
Edited by jwilliamson128 hours ago, Budgernaut said:RE: Mine Mapper + Extra Munitions interaction
It's pointless to argue about it now because in a year, they're justgoing to rewrite the card, anyway.
(I sure hope they don't pull this garbage in Runewars, because the card-editing has really turned me off from X-Wing.)
If Runewars has grown big enough, with increasing complexity creep, they might be forced to do it. Especially if they let slip though OP things through playtesting.
(Cannot really say though, have not tested Runewars. Neither will do, not enough time, money or space for another system.)
7 hours ago, Rakaydos said:There's a debate on that. I agree with the "1 per bomb, not 1 per bomb use." position.
Minefield Mapper:
"you may discard any number of your equipped Bomb upgrade cards ."
Extra Munitions:
"When you are instructed to discard an Upgrade card , you may discard 1 ordnance token on that card instead . "
Underlined for emphasis. Seems very cut and dried to me: Extra Munitions tokens can be discarded instead of the upgrade card. Minefield Mapper instructs you to discard the upgrade card for its effect. Therefore, Extra Munitions tokens can be spent for Minefield Mapper because it has exactly the same wording .
Not sure where you're coming from that sees things the other way.
Edited by iamfanboy36 minutes ago, iamfanboy said:
Minefield Mapper:"you may discard any number of your equipped Bomb upgrade cards ."
Extra Munitions:
"When you are instructed to discard an Upgrade card , you may discard 1 ordnance token on that card instead . "
Underlined for emphasis. Seems very cut and dried to me: Extra Munitions tokens can be discarded instead of the upgrade card. Minefield Mapper instructs you to discard the upgrade card for its effect. Therefore, Extra Munitions tokens can be spent for Minefield Mapper because it has exactly the same wording .
Not sure where you're coming from that sees things the other way.
Nobody is arguing over that. The argument is if you can discard the card AND the token to place both.
I'm leaning no, myself.
1 minute ago, Polaritie said:Nobody is arguing over that. The argument is if you can discard the card AND the token to place both.
I'm leaning no, myself.
I know that. But Mapping Minefield also has "May" and "any number of" in its phrase, giving it quite possibly the most clear-cut walkthrough of any Upgrade interaction:
1) Choose an equipped Bomb card with an Extra Munitions token on it.
2) Discard the token on it instead of the Upgrade card itself (as allowed by the Extra Munitions Upgrade).
3) Place the corresponding Mine token at past R3 of an enemy ship.
4) if you wish, go back to 1) and repeat, this time discarding the Upgrade Card.
It's... it's crystal clear. I think that people could only argue this because the idea of having four to six Cluster mines dropped on the table before the game starts is FREAKING INSANE and I'm not sure ANYONE WANTS THAT.
But just because someone doesn't want it to be doesn't change change how it is. It's quite possible they'll FAQ the interaction to be that way, but for right now RAW it's just obvious.
" the Scurrg H-6 Bomber Expansion Pack is bringing infinite bombs to your favorite starfighter dogfights."
Who the hell wants more bombs in their dogfighting game?!
The more I think about this expansion the more need ragey I feel about how this might really be the end of XWM.
Sabine crew is more broken than ever. Bomblet generator on Miranda with Sabine is totally ridiculous. 2 dice plus Sabine's auto hit.
Now this Minefield mapper bs with cluster mines and extra munitions is a total joke.
Do the designers even play the game?
Just now, BlodVargarna said:" the Scurrg H-6 Bomber Expansion Pack is bringing infinite bombs to your favorite starfighter dogfights."
Who the hell wants more bombs in their dogfighting game?!
The more I think about this expansion the more need ragey I feel about how this might really be the end of XWM.
Sabine crew is more broken than ever. Bomblet generator on Miranda with Sabine is totally ridiculous. 2 dice plus Sabine's auto hit.
Now this Minefield mapper bs with cluster mines and extra munitions is a total joke.
Do the designers even play the game?
They did say over a year ago that a bomb archetype would develop... Alongside jousters, turrets, and arc dodgers with the release of the K-Wing.
So, yeah, now we're really going to have a bomb archetype fleshed out for two factions. Imperials are next.
Also consider these waves are designed far in advance.
11 minutes ago, BlodVargarna said:Who the hell wants more bombs in their dogfighting game?!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ME5jhsgmB4
And people who played Star Wars: Starfighter where the Havoc is from. And maybe people who play flight simulators with strike/attack missions.
Bomblet is actually pretty good for dogfighting - a reusable bomb which can kind of do damage like a primary attack, but with much narrower positioning. You have to think about what you're doing to make it work. Or let fly and hold it with Rebel Nym.
19 minutes ago, MegaSilver said:Also consider these waves are poorly designed far in advance.
Is that what you meant?
40 minutes ago, BlodVargarna said:" the Scurrg H-6 Bomber Expansion Pack is bringing infinite bombs to your favorite starfighter dogfights."
Who the hell wants more bombs in their dogfighting game?!
The more I think about this expansion the more need ragey I feel about how this might really be the end of XWM.
Sabine crew is more broken than ever. Bomblet generator on Miranda with Sabine is totally ridiculous. 2 dice plus Sabine's auto hit.
Now this Minefield mapper bs with cluster mines and extra munitions is a total joke.
Do the designers even play the game?
Bomblet Generator on Miranda will be way worse than the standard Conner Net. That beacuse the stronger point of the K is the double move+slam drop the bomb in front/on you.
When Bomblet Gen. drop the bomb BEFORE moving...
FFG done it great, and people should wait and think a bit before get scared (:
Edited by CerveLooking forward to this ship and these upgrades. Just wish the empire wasn't the least bomby faction. Seems like it would be squarely in their MO.
51 minutes ago, KommanderKeldoth said:Looking forward to this ship and these upgrades. Just wish the empire wasn't the least bomby faction. Seems like it would be squarely in their MO.
On the other hand, isn't the Empire the only faction we don't see bombing on screen?
We see Scum (Boba Fett) launching Seismic Charges at Obi Wan in Attack of the Clones, we see Rebels (Y-wings) bombing the Scariff gate in Rogue One, but is there an instance of Empire bombing somebody in the movies?
We saw them bombing Han's asteroid in TESB. Unfortunately for them, Han was hidden deep enough that the bombs were harmless to him.
Just now, Ironlord said:We saw them bombing Han's asteroid in TESB. Unfortunately for them, Han was hidden deep enough that the bombs were harmless to him.
Thanks, I had forgotten about that
46 minutes ago, LordBlades said:On the other hand, isn't the Empire the only faction we don't see bombing on screen?
We see Scum (Boba Fett) launching Seismic Charges at Obi Wan in Attack of the Clones, we see Rebels (Y-wings) bombing the Scariff gate in Rogue One, but is there an instance of Empire bombing somebody in the movies?
33 minutes ago, Ironlord said:We saw them bombing Han's asteroid in TESB. Unfortunately for them, Han was hidden deep enough that the bombs were harmless to him.
If we go off the original trilogy; the Empire is the only side we see bombing anything.
... Man, rebel Nym is way cooler than Scum Nym.
Not sure how I feel about that, when scums got the dirty tricks and rebels have the K-wing...
8 minutes ago, Reiver said:... Man, rebel Nym is way cooler than Scum Nym.
Not sure how I feel about that, when scums got the dirty tricks and rebels have the K-wing...
I view Scum Nym as way cooler, if you combine him with Genius.
5 hours ago, UnitOmega said:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ME5jhsgmB4
And people who played Star Wars: Starfighter where the Havoc is from. And maybe people who play flight simulators with strike/attack missions.
Bomblet is actually pretty good for dogfighting - a reusable bomb which can kind of do damage like a primary attack, but with much narrower positioning. You have to think about what you're doing to make it work. Or let fly and hold it with Rebel Nym.
What thinking is involved? You just use it every turn with Miranda. Dash will be far away...
1 hour ago, LordBlades said:I view Scum Nym as way cooler, if you combine him with Genius.
... okay, I admit I hadn't thought of that one. With... Stay on Target for repositioning, perhaps? Or Adv Sensors to pull off repositional barrel rolls before the move? Hm.
Still not quite as dramatic as letting bombs sit around as an existential threat, though.
4 minutes ago, Reiver said:... okay, I admit I hadn't thought of that one. With... Stay on Target for repositioning, perhaps? Or Adv Sensors to pull off repositional barrel rolls before the move? Hm.
Still not quite as dramatic as letting bombs sit around as an existential threat, though.
My thought was Genius+Adv. Sensors. This gives you 4 potential positions where you could drop a bomblet in a given turn.
I'm having doubts about rebel Nym TBH. When would it really be beneficial to have a bomb linger as opposed to dropping a mine into the first place?
16 minutes ago, LordBlades said:I'm having doubts about rebel Nym TBH. When would it really be beneficial to have a bomb linger as opposed to dropping a mine into the first place?
One big advantage of this ability is when used with on-reveal-dial bombs that normally detonate at the end of the activation phase. The range one footprint of those tokens is really big compared to the action bombs like Conner Net or Cluster Mines. Reb Nym can turn a Proton Bomb, Ion Bomb, Bomblette or Thermal Detonator into the biggest footprint persistent bomb there is. And if it's a Bomblette, who cares if it's not in the perfect location? You're dropping one every turn and can decide which of the two stays and which one detonates, or you can allow both to detonate.
23 minutes ago, LordBlades said:My thought was Genius+Adv. Sensors. This gives you 4 potential positions where you could drop a bomblet in a given turn.
6?
2 minutes ago, Q10fanatic said:6?
True
For some reason I was counting Barrel Roll as 1, not 2