Question: Does Qui-Gon Jinn's ability trigger from the card Momentum Shift?
Qui-Gon: Before this character gains 1 or more shields, you may remove 1 of his shields to deal 1 damage to a character.
Momentum Shift: Move 1 shield from an opponent's character to one of your characters.
I would have to say no. A shield is just being moved onto him. He isn't gaining a shield. It's kind of like the card "Willpower" It says to move a damage from one of your exhausted characters to another exhausted character. It isn't dealing damage. It's just moving the damage. I hope that made sense and helps you out.
3 hours ago, Crabshack101 said:Question: Does Qui-Gon Jinn's ability trigger from the card Momentum Shift?
Qui-Gon: Before this character gains 1 or more shields, you may remove 1 of his shields to deal 1 damage to a character.
Momentum Shift: Move 1 shield from an opponent's character to one of your characters.
We don't know. 'Move' is only defined for damage, and 'gain' isn't defined at all. But hey, Destiny is an amazingly simple game, right?!?
Yeeeeah. I'd say this is a red hot 'maybe????'
My instinct is to say 'yes' because otherwise the card is kind of even more garbage than it already is, but it looks like it's yet another card that's not actually defined in how it works.
8 hours ago, Rogue 2 said:A shield is just being moved onto him. He isn't gaining a shield.
When you work for 100$ you, gain 100$, right?
When someone hands you 100$ you do gain 100$ right?
Edited by Vitalis3 hours ago, Vitalis said:When you work for 100$ you, gain 100$, right?
When someone hands you 100$ you do gain 100$ right?
Agreed.
Even though we don't have a game definition of "gain", it would be valid to think that the target of "moving" "gains" something.
4 hours ago, Vitalis said:When you work for 100$ you, gain 100$, right?
When someone hands you 100$ you do gain 100$ right?
When someone damages you, you take damage, right?
When someone moves damage on to you, you don't take damage, right? (Also, how the **** does something 'move damage' on to you?)
Applying 'common sense' to the rules doesn't really work. Considering how they've ruled move for other things, there's a good chance that you don't 'gain' the shield.
9 minutes ago, Abyss said:When someone damages you, you take damage, right?
When someone moves damage on to you, you don't take damage, right? (Also, how the **** does something 'move damage' on to you?)
Yes, but dealing damage is specified in rulebook - as resolving dice.
Resolving a shield is described as "giving" shields to a character.
Soo...either Qui-Gon never "gains" shields or any trigger that increases his shield tokens is "gaining" shields
Dealing damage isn't the same as resolving damage dice, considering it's possible to take damage from other sources.
The terminology they use is 'gives' shields. The only time they use 'gain' in rules terminology is in regards to resources (yes, the rules have specific terms for getting the different markers, that they promptly ignore once they start talking about gaining shields).
And yes, that's one interpretation that anything that increases your shields is gaining it. I'd argue it's a logical, common sense interpretation. It doesn't mean that it's the *right* interpretation given the game has shown it often doesn't use logic or common sense.
Easiest solution, don't play with Momentum Shift, it's a weak card!
9 hours ago, Vitalis said:When you work for 100$ you, gain 100$, right?
When someone hands you 100$ you do gain 100$ right?
The RRG either defines the terms or it doesn't. As much as I love the OED, they don't write rules for FFG.
Edited by WonderWAAAGHIn absence of an official rule or term definition for 'gain' or 'move', you can only go off the literal definition. In which case, moving a shield to Qui-Gon ends up with that character having a shield that they did not possess before. That fits the literal definition of 'gain'.
Edited by gokubb1 minute ago, gokubb said:In absence of an official rule or term definition for 'gain' or 'move', you can only go off the literal definition. In which case, moving a shield to Qui-Gon ends up with that character having a shield that they did not possess before. That fits the literal definition of 'gain'.
In the absence of official rules, there are no official rules. We call those guesses or assumptions, and that's a terrible way to play a game. Why are we having such a hard time acknowledging that FFG dropped the ball here?
4 hours ago, WonderWAAAGH said:In the absence of official rules, there are no official rules. We call those guesses or assumptions, and that's a terrible way to play a game. Why are we having such a hard time acknowledging that FFG dropped the ball here?
Did I say FFG didn't drop the ball. FFG's rules and clarifications stink and they're constantly playing catch-up because they haven't figured out how to identify and address card interactions and new terms before the release of a product. Obviously 'move' needs some form of rules built around it. But, until it has, using the literal definition is not a guess. It's the only way to move forward in absence of an official definition. Anything else is making up your own meaning to a word.
1 minute ago, gokubb said:Did I say FFG didn't drop the ball. FFG's rules and clarifications stink and they're constantly playing catch-up because they haven't figured out how to identify and address card interactions and new terms before the release of a product. Obviously 'move' needs some form of rules built around it. But, until it has, using the literal definition is not a guess. It's the only way to move forward in absence of an official definition. Anything else is making up your own meaning to a word.
I was referring to all of us, collectively. Too many people seem content to give FFG a pass on their card templating.
20 hours ago, Abyss said:Yeeeeah. I'd say this is a red hot 'maybe????'
My instinct is to say 'yes' because otherwise the card is kind of even more garbage than it already is, but it looks like it's yet another card that's not actually defined in how it works.
What I love most about legit questions like this is, that we then get a FAQ that asks.... if I have a character and my opponent has the same character can we both use it? I mean really!
Official ruling.
"Kyle,
2 hours ago, Crabshack101 said:Guess that means when something it moved the thing it is moves to gains it if possible.
Not necessarily. "Gain" for resources is explicitly defined as taking a token from the supply. So if you have a card that triggered when you gained a resource, whether it would trigger when your opponent pays you for Blackmail it would probably not trigger. Unless it did, of course.
Hooray for inconsistent terminology!!
Honestly, I can see them back peddling on this one come the next FAQ.
13 hours ago, Crabshack101 said:F unny how you can just as them these questions to get clarification...
Alas, if Destiny is anything like X-wing, those emailed clarifications should be taken with all the grains of salt. They're as wrong as often as they're right. The infamous 'Gonk' debacle springs to mind.