3 minutes ago, FTS Gecko said:

Cool topic. Scum calls dibs on Autothrusters, since they're only available with the StarViper anyway.

That might be a neat midpoint - specific to factions that feature the card in one of their expansions.

57 minutes ago, haritos said:

Why a nightmare? In what sense?

Do you really want 3 different cards for an upgrade like VI that essentially do the same thing?

How do you go back and change the cards you already have? I already have a number of cards I have to refer to a FAQ for to make sure it is used properly.

As already mentioned - Some factions get access to munitions and not others?

You already have existing faction specific upgrades and others that are usable by all. I don't see that there is a significant problem with the system the way it is. I do think that sometimes FFG issues upgrades without realizing the impact they will have or combination they will be used in.

11 hours ago, NakedDex said:

It's not just the number of waves, but what the waves contained, and you do need to factor in a new core set, too. Between them all, 2016 skewed the meta more than anything that could have been imagined. Granted, HotR didn't have quite as much of a splash, but Rey is a solid pick for a Rebel anchor, more so than most YT1300 pilots. Meanwhile Jumpmasters and Defenders became the absolute dominant force, bar none.

Core set was 2015.

Realistically, it was really just the jumpmaster and IV that made big splashes, and both have seen nerfs since. And they weren't necessarily bigger splashes than stuff we've seen in the past (such as pre-nerf phantom).

11 hours ago, NakedDex said:

2015's waves were fine, but arguably the biggest release of the year was the TLT and Palp . Both important tools in either arsenal even now, but nothing like what came subsequently. 2016 saw the Jumpmaster, the /fo (read, Omega Leader ), Countess Ryad , Maarek Steele, Jess Pava , Poe Dameron , Inquisitor , Fenn Rau , the Ghost , Asajj, Braylen Stramm and Norra . It also gave us Quickdraw , Backdraft and Manaroo , though their full power wouldn't be felt until later (in the /sf case, until LWF dropped).

2015 waves might not have had the same splash as the jumpmaster and IV, but part of that is because it had a lot of really bad ships released. Most of th eearly scum ships were too expensive. And palp and TLT both dfeinitely made big splashes of their own. So did Poe for rebels.

The FO was 2015, not 2016 (september for core set, december for FO). Ditto the T70, so Poe and OL were 2015. It also gave us TLT and palp as you said, as well as Miranda and the other k-wings.

11 hours ago, NakedDex said:

And that's not even mentioning upgrades. Integrated Astromech , Attani Mindlink , Comms Relay, Zuckuss , Dengar , Boba Fett , Juke , Kanan Jarrus , R4 Aggromech, /x7 and /D etc etc etc. These are all upgrades that aren't being used because they're new, but because they're incredibly potent compared to what came before. Kanan alone completely replaced Kyle Katarn . Comms Relay and Juke became the build for /fo fighters. Juke and /x7 was standard. Mindlink is still being talked about. Aggromech got nerfed, so ubiquitous was it in play, and IA saw us X-wings without AT, and making Biggs an even bigger pain.

Kanan didn't completely replace kyle. Quite a few people still run kyle dash. Palp from 2015 also saw the nerf bat. And the r4 agromech change was actually a consequence of the timing changes in the timing chart from the TFA core set, it just wans't really noticed/dealt with as such until it became an issue on deadeye scouts.

11 hours ago, NakedDex said:

What have we got this year? Pure Sabaac is alright, and Ahsoka isn't terrible in the right hands, and Rex is a nice little filler ship. That's about it. Some decent upgrades in LWF, Inspiring Recruit s (still think that's underrated), Ops Spec (ditto), and Kylo, but that's about it. Granted we have a wave to come, and an Epic, but the sheer amount of warp applied in 2016 is disproportionate to any previous year.

Pure sabacc is rather great. The TIE has seen pretty good use. The upsilon has seen a bit, the quadjumper less so. We'll see how the incoming stuff does.

11 hours ago, NakedDex said:

The nearest equivalent was the Wave 4/5 era when all you could see on tables was Corran / Dash and Whisper / Chirpy . Dash and Whisper both got nerfed during the subsequent release of Scum via AT and the decloak timing errata, but you still saw them out and about. Every list you see today is based on 2016 ships/upgrades, not just uses them. Again, not just because they're new, but because the 2016 threw the game such a curveball, you can't but use them if you want to stay in competitive play.
I'm not sure about you, but I'm not seeing many Corran or Whisper led lists in competitive events any more than I'm seeing many. Even Soontir - the original indomitable beast - has taken to retirement, and joined the massive graveyard of ships you only take out when you're having a silly, fun game.

I'd argue the whisper days were worse than what we have now. The biggest issue right now is that for scum, almost every list has mindlink and/or jumpmaster. But other factions can still compete and win, and even in scum there's a variety of actual lists. As for "still seing whisper about", she pretty much disappeared from the meta whent he nerf hit. It was like a year later before she actually started showing up competitively very often again. Despite that, Whisper made it to the top 16 at worlds with 0 2016 upgrades, just kylo from the upsilon this year + older stuff.

For scum, it makes perfect sense that all of their lists would have stuff based on 2016 ships/upgrades becuase they didn't have any ships worth flyinb before that (other than possibly brobots). 2016 actaully gave the faction good ships to fly finally. The jumpmaster is a bit TOO good perhaps, and mindlink probalby si as well when combined with multiple ships with green hard turns, but that doesn't change the fact that even if they hadn't gotten anything overpowered, as long as they got something actually COMPETITIVE theyd'st ill all be based on 2016 or later stuff.

11 hours ago, NakedDex said:

I don't mind skewing the meta to incorporate new mechanics, play styles, and ships - that's what keeps the game fresh and interesting - but dropping it all in the space of 12-14 months utterly warps a game, and it's very difficult to claw that back to balance and interest. A lot of people's future in this game will depend entirely on what this years releases - and indeed release schedule - are for the remaining 6 months. "Wave fatigue" is a very real thing, and it has already claimed more than a few players I very highly respected.

Even without vastly overpowered stuff, new releases are always going to warp the meta, though people trying the new stuff out if nothing else. If releases are underpowere,d it might not warp it much or for long, but as long as they're at least competitive they're going to see a lot of use. Sabine's tie has been big in rebels lists since release for instance.

I agree that 2016 may have warped the meta more than 2015 did, but I disagree with the premise that it's a bad thing (other than that the nerfs didn't quite hit scum hard enough)