Title, 0 pts. You may equip your ship with accuracy corrector upgrade (paying its point cost).

Fixed.

Think about it.

maybe they could make an upgrade that lets them regen in exchange for being ionized.

2 minutes ago, skotothalamos said:

maybe they could make an upgrade that lets them regen in exchange for being ionized.

Not enough

It's actually not bad when you realise that'll also work on the primary. As in, roll one attack die, cancel it, replace it with two hits.

3 points for AC might still be a bit of a tax on a ship that struggles without several points of upgrades as it is, though. I do like the idea, though.

12 minutes ago, NakedDex said:

It's actually not bad when you realise that'll also work on the primary. As in, roll one attack die, cancel it, replace it with two hits.

3 points for AC might still be a bit of a tax on a ship that struggles without several points of upgrades as it is, though. I do like the idea, though.

For a struggling ship, it made the cut just fine at worlds. Top 4 actually ;-)

Better dial.

Some sort of Rebel HWK only Smuggling Compartment (adds an illicit and still allows the Pulsed Ray Shield).

if it flies off the board it should reappear on another board edge, as the lore intended.

I look at it this way, you need at least 2 points for an Autoblaster. It is a turret, but only at range 1. One more point would give you 2 hits, and 2 hits only all the way to range 3, but in arc and the defender gets range bonuses. You probably would not take it with Moldy Crow as focuses are not a concern. Likewise, it does not work with blaster turret. It pushes TLT to cost 1 point more than the equivalent Y wing so there is a cost there, and what it does for dorsal turret, it makes it the same cost as a TLT.

I think it would balance it well.

Uh...guys? That means Quad HWK Generic + AC + TLT is exactly 100 pts.

It will go down straight from slightly underpowered to jumpmaster-grade cancer!

...that, and you'll start seeing Primarists (i.e, people who condemn the acts of using a secondary weapon) chanting harder for TLT nerfs

Just now, Grivoire said:

Uh...guys? That means Quad HWK Generic + AC + TLT is exactly 100 pts.

It will go down straight from slightly underpowered to jumpmaster-grade cancer!

...that, and you'll start seeing Primarists (i.e, people who condemn the acts of using a secondary weapon) chanting harder for TLT nerfs

So it will basically be a tie aggressor with a crap dial. A 4 TLT list is a different issue.

Just now, balindamood said:

So it will basically be a tie aggressor with a crap dial. A 4 TLT list is a different issue.

A tie agressor with crap dial that spews highly accurate 8 shots a round with focus left purely for defense, yes.

Based on the new canon .

honestly...the tie aggressor is what the hwk should be except with a crew slot instead of rockets and a boost instead of a barrel roll. Assuming the aggressor dial will be manuverable with 1 and 2 turns + a k as the only red.

forget it...just release a ravens claw pack with a new model and a hwk/claw title that adds 1 attack dice and lets you use the ravens claw dial on the hwk.

1 hour ago, SEApocalypse said:

For a struggling ship, it made the cut just fine at worlds. Top 4 actually ;-)

And they had several points of upgrades, which is my point.

Don't get me wrong, I've used Hwks to hilarious effect in plenty of tournaments. My point is that need 5-8 points sunk into them to make them actually capable. Put a TLT or an ICT on Palob, and of course it'll be viable. Run Jan Ors with no upgrades and you're just handing over points.

It's also worth noting that while the Scum Hwks are fine, the Rebel counterparts are anything but. Scum lists have enough raw power to allow a utility Hwk in a tournament list. Rebels don't have the room for the likes of Roark, regardless of what weapon you give him.

2 minutes ago, NakedDex said:

And they had several points of upgrades, which is my point.

Don't get me wrong, I've used Hwks to hilarious effect in plenty of tournaments. My point is that need 5-8 points sunk into them to make them actually capable. Put a TLT or an ICT on Palob, and of course it'll be viable. Run Jan Ors with no upgrades and you're just handing over points.

It's also worth noting that while the Scum Hwks are fine, the Rebel counterparts are anything but. Scum lists have enough raw power to allow a utility Hwk in a tournament list. Rebels don't have the room for the likes of Roark, regardless of what weapon you give him.

I am not disagreeing with you regarding the rebel hawks. I wonder of it is more of a function that decent rebel ships push 29-35 points each, meaning you have only two sharp pointy things, versus Imperials that do have options in the 25 point range that are not terrible.

19 minutes ago, NakedDex said:

And they had several points of upgrades, which is my point.

Don't get me wrong, I've used Hwks to hilarious effect in plenty of tournaments. My point is that need 5-8 points sunk into them to make them actually capable. Put a TLT or an ICT on Palob, and of course it'll be viable. Run Jan Ors with no upgrades and you're just handing over points.

3

Why is that wrong?

28 minutes ago, balindamood said:

I am not disagreeing with you regarding the rebel hawks. I wonder of it is more of a function that decent rebel ships push 29-35 points each, meaning you have only two sharp pointy things, versus Imperials that do have options in the 25 point range that are not terrible.

To be fair, there's a fair few decent rebel ships in that price range. The problem is more that they've taken a back seat to ships that can spike damage more reliably, or can weather beatings. Biggs aside, Tarn was always a favourite of mine, and is actually not bad in today's game. GSP A-wings are still solid, and more recently the Rebel TIE gave us a little pocket hero in Rex.

13 minutes ago, RufusDaMan said:

Why is that wrong?

/Sigh

It's not. It's also not what I'm saying. My point is, with the OPs proposed upgrade, it's actually a solid idea but for how much it costs, it would lopsidedly benefit Scum Hwks - who don't really need that buff. Rebel Hwks could do with a nudge, however, and a title like the OP suggested would give them a boost, but for the cost loading that is already a factor against them in building lists.

A Rebel Hwk could benefit from an AC upgrade, but a rebel list with a Hwk probably doesn't have the points budget for it in competitive terms, particularly the uniques. Now an /x1 style title that offers a system slot with a discount? That has potential. A 0 point upgrade with a 2 point discount on a system for unique rebel pilots? Sign me up.

Ah. Got it. Sorry, a bit preoccupied this evening, didn't quite get your point before.

I know the feeling. I'm 10 hours deep into a 12 hour night shift. My brain isn't fully operational right now either.

Just now, NakedDex said:

I know the feeling. I'm 10 hours deep into a 12 hour night shift. My brain isn't fully operational right now either.

lol. Me too. My shift ends in a bit less than 3 hours

HWKs are fine. They probably ought to have 2 attack dice, but they're fine, they're strong support ships which actually work as support ships - Jan, Palob and Roark all have places in strong lists right now, and TLT makes them work fine, and will continue to do so until such time as it might get nerfed - and even then, it'll probably be fine.

You just can't expect to run them naked and still have them work, any more than you can expect to run a Y Wing orTIE Bomber or Dengar or Soontir pr Poe naked and have them work either. Upgrade slots exist for a reason, and in many if not most non-ordnance non-mod cases, not filling them is a mistake.

I'm flying two hawks in my rebels list for store champs.

I think they are fun and competitive.

Can we stop with the HWK jokes now?

HWKs are genuinely good, and have been for getting on for a year. We have Roark, Palob and Jan Ors all delivering good tournament results - you can find another dead horse to beat because this one is actually pretty healthy.

I think that the problem isn't the ship but the upgrades: a good fix for molty crown and blaster turret will make the HWK very good.

for blaster turret: same cost and effect but you need to have the focus token for attack instead of discard it.

molty crown: cost 1, same effect but you can not keep more than 3 or 4 focus token