So. . .am I missing something or does this card just sorta give you an alternate pseudo-primary attack?

Just now, Darth Meanie said:

So. . .am I missing something or does this card just sorta give you an alternate pseudo-primary attack?

Nope, you have it sorted.

6 minutes ago, thatdave said:

Nope, you have it sorted.

Great.

"This is not the TIE Punisher fix you are looking for. Move along."

Yeah, Unguided Rockets is really more like an alternate primary than traditional ordnance. I remember when the card was first revealed and a bunch of players thought it sucked until they realized you don't discard it.

2 minutes ago, Darth Meanie said:

Great.

"This is not the TIE Punisher fix you are looking for. Move along."

I'm sadly not convinced they're ever planning on fixing the Punisher.

It is a bit better than a primary though in that, because it is a secondary weapon, there is no bonus evade dice at range 3.

9 minutes ago, joyrock said:

I'm sadly not convinced they're ever planning on fixing the Punisher.

Well, if the game lasts long enough, I think they will finally create some sort of ordnance that makes the Punisher worthwhile, a little like TLT and Y-Wings. I would agree, however, it will be more accidental than planned.

6 minutes ago, thatdave said:

It is a bit better than a primary though in that, because it is a secondary weapon, there is no bonus evade dice at range 3.

For 2 points and all your missile slots. . . .hmmm. Maybe if it was 0 points and therefore more of a change in configuration, but as an investment?

Yeah, it's basically a conditional Primary weapon upgrade. Its better at Range 3, but worse at range 1. And you need to have a focus to perform the attack, which is your only source of mods for the attack.

At least it will be good on Tomax with Crackshot. Move, Focus, and fire 3 dice, discarding one enemy Evade.

Tomax: Crackshot, LWF, Unguided Rockets. 29 points for PS8 and 3 dice dropping one enemy evade is decent for the points.

18 minutes ago, Darth Meanie said:

Great.

"This is not the TIE Punisher fix you are looking for. Move along."

How so is this not a fix for the punisher?

Giving it a conditional 3 attack dice isn't going to fix it is what he's saying.

It basically needs something to make it better at bombing. Like maybe the SLAM action?

3 minutes ago, DeathstarII said:

How so is this not a fix for the punisher?

Because it can be taken on the cheaper bomber and the bomber will still be better for less and have LWF for 2.5 agi.

1 minute ago, Oberron said:

Because it can be taken on the cheaper bomber and the bomber will still be better for less and have LWF for 2.5 agi.

So if that's the case, then nothing but a freaking systems slot or a punisher only upgrade will fix it, I'll field four punishers with UR, LWF, and collison detector because they work well, and the punisher is more durable despite less agility

4 hours ago, Darth Meanie said:

So. . .am I missing something or does this card just sorta give you an alternate pseudo-primary attack?

Well it is more of a restricted primary attack. You don't get range bonus and neither does the defender. Also you can't use target locks to modify your attacks so very restrictive compared to a primary weapon attack. However considering most 2x missile ships are 2 firepower it is an overall increase. It didn't really have to be range 1-3 though, it could have been perfectly fine as range 2-3 as all ships in standard have only 2 firepower so would be rolling 3 dice anyways and be able to use both focus and target lock. It requires focus so it can't be put on an Epic ship, even if it could why would you?

12 minutes ago, DeathstarII said:

So if that's the case, then nothing but a freaking systems slot or a punisher only upgrade will fix it, I'll field four punishers with UR, LWF, and collison detector because they work well, and the punisher is more durable despite less agility

correct.

As for the 4 punishers you might as well take 4 zeta specialist with title LWF and collison detector and be better off. More durable because of even more agi, and a better dial + rear arc. and a higher ps for what its worth.

46 minutes ago, EdgeOfDreams said:

Yeah, Unguided Rockets is really more like an alternate primary than traditional ordnance. I remember when the card was first revealed and a bunch of players thought it sucked until they realized you don't discard it.

It is still strictly worse than a 3 dice primary (only sometimes for r3 shots better), but it is a clear upgrade for two dice ships, especially when those ships will not using double mods for attack anyway. So a welcome TIE-Bomber buff.

45 minutes ago, BadMotivator said:

Yeah, it's basically a conditional Primary weapon upgrade. Its better at Range 3, but worse at range 1. And you need to have a focus to perform the attack, which is your only source of mods for the attack.

Since I often take Focus over TL, and you don't spend the Focus to fire, for me it pretty much works out to a 3 die primary, same as guns at R1 and R2, better at R3.

37 minutes ago, BadMotivator said:

Giving it a conditional 3 attack dice isn't going to fix it is what he's saying.

It basically needs something to make it better at bombing. Like maybe the SLAM action?

Or double-barrel missile launches.

34 minutes ago, DeathstarII said:

So if that's the case, then nothing but a freaking systems slot or a punisher only upgrade will fix it , I'll field four punishers with UR, LWF, and collison detector because they work well, and the punisher is more durable despite less agility

An EPT on the generic wouldn't hurt, either.

I would have considered it a nice perk if it was a 4 die attack or a 0 point mod, but as is, it's doesn't do much more than give the ship a reusable 3 die attack for 2 points.

IMHO, the fix for the Punisher involves a mechanism that allows it to have lots of ordnance and fire it quickly (before it dies). Let the K-Wing be the bomber; make the Punisher the rocket launcher from hell.

15 minutes ago, Darth Meanie said:

Since I often take Focus over TL, and you don't spend the Focus to fire, for me it pretty much works out to a 3 die primary, same as guns at R1 and R2, better at R3.

3 die primary is a 4 dice attack at R1 ;-)

5 minutes ago, SEApocalypse said:

3 die primary is a 4 dice attack at R1 ;-)

Sorry. . .point being a 2 die primary on the Punisher/Aggressor = 3d at R1. But then the rest of my statement falls apart, so, nothing to see here, move along.

25 minutes ago, Darth Meanie said:

IMHO, the fix for the Punisher involves a mechanism that allows it to have lots of ordnance and fire it quickly (before it dies). Let the K-Wing be the bomber; make the Punisher the rocket launcher from hell.

That sounds almost like you want something like a … uhm … MISSILE BOAT.

7 minutes ago, SEApocalypse said:

That sounds almost like you want something like a … uhm … MISSILE BOAT.

Does it make me a bad Imperial pilot? Please sir, can I have something without solar panels?

Maybe a couple titles for the Punisher?

Rapid-Launch Suit: Title: TIE Punisher only: Cost 3 points

Your upgrade bar loses all Bomb slots and gains 1 Missile and 1 Torpedo slot. After performing a secondary weapon attack during which you spent a target lock, you may immediately acquire a target lock and then perform another secondary weapon attack.(Yes, I am intentionally wording this for use of all your missiles/torpedoes in one combat phase)

Bombing Refit: Title: TIE Punisher only: Cost -2 points

Your upgrade bar loses all Missile slots and gains 2 Bomb slots. If placing a bomb token that is placed before revealing a maneuver dial, you may choose to place the bomb either before or after you have performed your maneuver.

3 hours ago, Darth Meanie said:

For 2 points and all your missile slots. . . .hmmm. Maybe if it was 0 points and therefore more of a change in configuration, but as an investment?

2 points and slots most people don't use on the ships that would use this is pretty **** cheap for +1 attack. Especially compared to the other examples in the game.

2 hours ago, SEApocalypse said:

That sounds almost like you want something like a … uhm … MISSILE BOAT.

Unguided Rockets feels like it was MADE for an upcoming Missile Boat. Lots of Missile slots, but perhaps only a 1 primary attack? Feels like UR would be an autoinclude.

It's not just the range 3 deal that makes it better than a primary. This thing can't be modified by your opponent either. Situationally that can be good.

I admit, it's situational and not a reason to make it top tier. It's not.

Gamma Squadron Veteran (19)
Intensity (2)
Unguided Rockets (2)
Lightweight Frame (2)

Total: 25

Roll, Focus, FIRE! Then on those turns while you're trying to turn a Bomber around you recharge Intensity. Or take something with Fleet Officer to provide more Focus.