Like Gohei is saying, they will probably be your most powerful clan character that you can play for your clan, and it will be expensive to play them, but otherwise they will just be a unique character like any other. Probably will have some cool printed ability and a lot of keywords, as well as plenty of military and political might.

1 minute ago, Yogo Gohei said:

Either you save up fate for a turn so that you can get them with a few fate tokens on them, or you buy them now for a big one turn push.

From all that we know, play in this version will go "faster" due to there being a Military and Political conflict that each player can utilize during their said turn. While it is possible that players will need to save up fate for a turn or two so that you can bring in a named character and keep it in play, the hazards of not spending Fate when you very much need to would be a large handicap.

I could see a Champion costing 6-7 Fate, for example, but also having a set trait which would give him/her built-in Fate of 2 for the designed purpose of staying a few rounds before being discarded. Reversely, if a Champion came in with a cost of 6-7 and owning player had to add additional Fate to keep him/her in play, then the sunk in costs are too high for that card and better spent on other characters/holdings.

Of course, if a Champion has specific powers (traits?) that give the owning player more options, then the matter of expending extra Fate wouldn't be much of an issue.

Just more thoughts.

6 minutes ago, LordBlunt said:

Reversely, if a Champion came in with a cost of 6-7 and owning player had to add additional Fate to keep him/her in play, then the sunk in costs are too high for that card and better spent on other characters/holdings.

<snip>

Of course, if a Champion has specific powers (traits?) that give the owning player more options, then the matter of expending extra Fate wouldn't be much of an issue.

I think you answered your own question.

7 minutes ago, LordBlunt said:

I could see a Champion costing 6-7 Fate, for example, but also having a set trait which would give him/her built-in Fate of 2 for the designed purpose of staying a few rounds before being discarded.

In that case, just make them cost 4 or 5 and give the player the option to add the fate.

10 minutes ago, LordBlunt said:

From all that we know, play in this version will go "faster" due to there being a Military and Political conflict that each player can utilize during their said turn. While it is possible that players will need to save up fate for a turn or two so that you can bring in a named character and keep it in play, the hazards of not spending Fate when you very much need to would be a large handicap.

I could see a Champion costing 6-7 Fate, for example, but also having a set trait which would give him/her built-in Fate of 2 for the designed purpose of staying a few rounds before being discarded. Reversely, if a Champion came in with a cost of 6-7 and owning player had to add additional Fate to keep him/her in play, then the sunk in costs are too high for that card and better spent on other characters/holdings.

Of course, if a Champion has specific powers (traits?) that give the owning player more options, then the matter of expending extra Fate wouldn't be much of an issue.

Just more thoughts.

Hm...the thing I'm wondering with having characters just gain Fate inherently, is what advantage does that mechanic have over, say, just reducing the cost by 1-2 and letting players decide for themselves how much Fate they need?

If inherent Fate is a mechanic, I think it would have to have some other cost besides just being a more expensive card. Maybe Clan Champions could have a trait like, "When bringing this character into play, you may bow your stronghold. If your stronghold bowed, give this character 2 Fate." Having something allow you to get more Fate on more powerful characters would be interesting, but if it's just making them cost more, I'd prefer having cheaper characters and making the decision myself.

EDIT: Ninja'd by a Scorpion. OF COURSE.

There are also other options.

I am just going to leave this here.

25 minutes ago, hidasaurus said:

One thing I would be concerned about, however, if my clan champ had higher glory like three or four, is that now they are extremely likely to get targeted for dishonor and would lose any mil or political advantage they had if they were dishonored. Too much risk reward element to play with. I hope they stick to 1 or 2 glory with more rare examples of 3 or higher. Even for clan champs.

I completely agree, a three would already be pretty borderline, since then they have to be very careful about every card that honours or dishonours a character, and a four would be totally insane, and pretty much ask that every player has to play around honour and dishonour cards.

12 minutes ago, Drudenfusz said:

I completely agree, a three would already be pretty borderline, since then they have to be very careful about every card that honours or dishonours a character, and a four would be totally insane, and pretty much ask that every player has to play around honour and dishonour cards.

There is a flip side here. Honoring such a character would make them into a TANK! Depending on your deck's plans, that risk may very well be worth the reward.

34 minutes ago, Yogo Gohei said:

I think you answered your own question.

I was attempting to say that a champion card can go either way, or a separate, more distinct manner of design that we haven't seen yet with the few cards that have been released.

As a player, since there is only a single champion card per Clan, I can see myself including 2 or maybe 3 copies of my Clan champion in my deck. But my gaming strategy won't solely revolve around its appearance during each game. Having the option of 2 moderately powerful character cards versus one uber-powerful card, I'd rather bank on the multiple characters showing up and allowing me more options, rather than one powerful card coming in and shifting the game.

We are all discussing this topic without having seen any of the said cards yet which is all rather academic. Said cards will change our approach, for sure.

5 minutes ago, Yogo Gohei said:

There is a flip side here. Honoring such a character would make them into a TANK! Depending on your deck's plans, that risk may very well be worth the reward.

Oh, absolutely!

However, a single Event card costing 1-2 Fate can render said Champion card moot for 1-2 rounds, which would very much be an easy counter to a pumped up Champion. Or, an Event card (iirc in the previews) can Bow a lone defender for a low cost - which would be painful played at the right time against an uber-Champion.

Risks and rewards are what specifically look at to determine practicality. Until we get more previews released, it's rather difficult for me to question the viability of a card costing upwards of 7+ Fate if that card can be easily countered.

And please note I'm only positing my thoughts here.

Well clan champions used to be so strong they could swing the game just by entering play. You could go from losing to stablized, or even winning when they hit the field, so they were worth the cost. but that was when they stuck around, I hope that if they cost 6-7 they enter play with 1-2 fate, or have an ability to gain a fate when you win a conflict they are involved in. that might not work for the shugenja type clan champions or Daimyo types

2 hours ago, Akodo_Metuki said:

Well clan champions used to be so strong they could swing the game just by entering play. You could go from losing to stablized, or even winning when they hit the field, so they were worth the cost.

See, I don't remember that. Possibly due to the players in my meta not playing with many Champions in their deck. ??

3 hours ago, JJ48 said:

Maybe Clan Champions could have a trait like, "When bringing this character into play, you may bow your stronghold. If your stronghold bowed, give this character 2 Fate."

This type of ability would make sense. I can certainly see FFG enact something like this for Champions.

3 hours ago, JJ48 said:

EDIT: Ninja'd by a Scorpion. OF COURSE.

LOL!!!

I'm sure there will be considerations meant to protect your big characters, such as reprieve (L5R's equivalent to Thrones' Bodyguard, essentially). But I doubt they have special rules.

I expect the daimyos and clan champs to be in the 4 to 6 fate cost range base. They'll probably have 4s and 5s for stats and will likely have a great ability that will make your opponent want to generally avoid them. I suspect plenty of PK, duels, immunities (immune to discard effects, perhaps) and blanking effects to be printed on the champions.

During the Reddit AMA, I asked the question:

Quote

In the previews we saw mostly generic characters. I assume there will be named characters as well. How do you plan on making clan champions and other high profile characters, who are likely higher cost, worth playing, considering all characters don't last very long?

I worry that weenie armies will be very strong unless the clan champs are significantly more efficient and impactful.

The response:

Quote

Each Clan has a mix of both non-unique and unique, named characters. Unique characters tend to have more specialized, and/or Clan-defining abilities while non-unique characters provide the foundation upon which to build consistent decks.

Investing fate into higher-cost characters tends to provide more of a return over the course of a game. Also, lower-costed characters can be more vulnerable to certain card removal effects. -ED and NF

So, based on that response, I think it's clear there will be some sort of removal that can't target higher cost characters and they will be given significantly above curve abilities to make up for their high fate investment.

If they had special rules like extra fate or do not discard when their fate goes away, I feel like they would have mentioned that in response to my question.

7 minutes ago, Joe From Cincinnati said:

So, based on that response, I think it's clear there will be some sort of removal that can't target higher cost characters and they will be given significantly above curve abilities to make up for their high fate investment.

Just now, Yogo Gohei said:

Yea.

I expect plenty more effects like this to be shown as time goes on. They need to give players an incentive not to go full on weenie army.

Being that the champions are such influential characters for their clans, I wouldn't be surprised to see entering play or passive effects. That way you will immediately get some return on your investment even if you do drop them in for one turn. Example: Doji Hotaru. Forced reaction: When Doji Hotaru enters play, gain one honor for each Crane Clan Courtier you control (Likely being a courtier to trigger off herself).

Just a thought...

12 hours ago, HirumaShigure said:

Being that the champions are such influential characters for their clans, I wouldn't be surprised to see entering play or passive effects. That way you will immediately get some return on your investment even if you do drop them in for one turn. Example: Doji Hotaru. Forced reaction: When Doji Hotaru enters play, gain one honor for each Crane Clan Courtier you control (Likely being a courtier to trigger off herself).

Just a thought...

I know she's crane, but she doesn't really feel Courtier to me.

Yeah, you're right. I was just thinking "she had to meet Kachiko somewhere" and often Crane Champions excel at many aspects of being samurai.

True, but she could have easily been at court without being a courtier, she is the daughter of the emerald and clan champion, and Kachiko is the Imperial advisor. It's pretty easy for them to meet.

I'm going to say that the Phoenix Clan Champ will be the only champ in the core set that is not unique. That was how the original Phoenix Clan Champ worked so it would be pretty cool if FFG tapped into little bits of nostalgia like this.

2 hours ago, Ishi Tonu said:

I'm going to say that the Phoenix Clan Champ will be the only champ in the core set that is not unique. That was how the original Phoenix Clan Champ worked so it would be pretty cool if FFG tapped into little bits of nostalgia like this.

Yeah, but that was a typo. Which they later lampshaded in Way of the Phoenix, when Ujimitsu has a reputation of being able to be in 3 places at once.

22 minutes ago, Tonbo Karasu said:

Yeah, but that was a typo. Which they later lampshaded in Way of the Phoenix, when Ujimitsu has a reputation of being able to be in 3 places at once.

And.........?

Things like that were some of my more fond memories of Old5R. I think it would be neat to see them pay homage to some of those quirky things from the CCG. I think this is one they could do relatively easy. the true heads of the Phoenix Clan are the Elemental Matsters so a slightly less powerful Phoenix Clan Champ that is non-unique could be supported by the story with fairly little effort. Change the story to be that Ujimitsu is actually a set of triplets raised in secret to help preserve the mystique of the Phoenix Clan. Could be losts of fun imo.

1 minute ago, Ishi Tonu said:

And.........?

Things like that were some of my more fond memories of Old5R. I think it would be neat to see them pay homage to some of those quirky things from the CCG. I think this is one they could do relatively easy. the true heads of the Phoenix Clan are the Elemental Matsters so a slightly less powerful Phoenix Clan Champ that is non-unique and could be supported by the story with fairly little effort. Change the story to be that Ujimitsu is actually a set of triplets raised in secret to help preserve the mystique of the Phoenix Clan. Could be lists of fun imo.

I love that idea, maybe not for the Phoenix, but I do enjoy the idea. Reminds me of the Soshi daimyo and her other two sisters switching off back in Secrets of the Scorpion.

Already done with Soshi Uidori, Yukimi and Miroko!

And with the very traditionalist aspect of the Phoenix, I don't see them ignoring an ill omen like identical triplets with as much pragmastism as the Scorpion clan (or is the triplet ill-omen only a Scorpion thing?).

2 hours ago, KerenRhys said:

Already done with Soshi Uidori, Yukimi and Miroko!

And with the very traditionalist aspect of the Phoenix, I don't see them ignoring an ill omen like identical triplets with as much pragmastism as the Scorpion clan (or is the triplet ill-omen only a Scorpion thing?).

I believe it was Scorpion only, Bayushi was twins with Shiba, but was 3rd to fall in the Tournament IIRC.