I almost posted this to an existing thread, but I didn't want to derail its discussion further. I am prepared for the hatestorm, but I had to get this out of my system.

I'm a pretty patient person. But does every single Kami-forsaken thread have to turn into a continued bemoaning of the lack of Mantis and/or Spider? I'm terribly sorry your factions were not included. Truly. I can't imagine how it feels to feel so slighted. But for the love of the Fortunes, I don't know how much more I can take.

Mantis wasn't a faction when AEG started this game way back in the day. Spider wasn't even a glimmer in the story team's collective eyes. Maybe it'll happen in the future. Maybe it won't! Maybe we'll get some bizarre Lobster clan full of tainted pirates sworn to Gaidotsu. And maybe not. Plenty of factions have come and gone over the years under AEG, and we have no reason to believe that FFG won't do the same!

I played Mantis. I played Spider, I played Lion, Unicorn, Dragon, Ratling, and Crane. Enough. Take a nice deep breath, and -- as mono no aware will teach us, if Disney has not yet done so -- let it go.

Or, alternatively, educate me. Tell me why nearly every single thread in this board has been infiltrated by, what essentially boils down to, "Oh yeah, well at least you have a clan!"

They want to feel relevant in a time when they aren't. I understand where they're coming from, but I just wish most of them could just get some chill.

1. You're obviously reading the wrong threads. There really isn't that much discussion of it.

2. Who cares that the Mantis weren't a faction when the game started? Neither were the Scorpion! It has nothing to do with anything and I don't know why people keep bringing it up.

Some people are whining and moaning, but others of us are just having fun with it. No need to get worked up by it.

Also, what is this "mono no aware" everyone keeps mentioning?

I haven't seen to much serious complaining.

We know that Yoritomo does exist, and I would like to see him getting to found his own clan.

Honestly, most of the Spider players I have seen are pretty chill with the fact that we aren't a faction. We're content, you know, waiting until the Shadowlands Horde arrives. Until then, many are just planning on trying to play corrupt in the LCG and pushing the Fu Leng agenda.

But to answer your second part...

Faction Loyalty is a big part of the L5R Experience. It is very hard-coded into the root of what appeals for the game. Asking a Spider or Mantis loyalist to let go of that loyalty is, literally, asking them to let go what they love about the game. Yes, some are more loud about this than others, but so what?

Now what is so great about the Spider Clan? For me, it is the players. The Spider Clan players have been amazingly inclusive people. They have welcomed me into their ranks with open arms, encouraged my weird deck designs, followed my odd article series, and actively supported me throughout Winter Court IV (which is where I had what little impact I did on the storyline). For the Mantis Clan players, I suspect it is the same thing. We have created communities surrounding these Factions, and being a member of that community is what has kept us in the game.

I am not saying that everyone has that same sense of Faction loyalty, nor that it is as central to the enjoyment of the world and game as it is for the loyalists. But in the spirit of "There is no bad fun that does not remove someone else's fun", I feel that this continued loyalty to previous Factions is a good thing... so long as it keeps people being positive, inclusive, and sharing in the enjoyment of something we all love.

I am a Spider Clan loyalist. Before that, I was a Naga loyalist. I have certain storyline hopes for the return of the Spider Clan or the rise of a Shadowlands Horde, but not having them is not going to stop me from enjoying this game, or being a part of an amazing, inclusive community of players. I will go to GenCon, and I will wear my colors, and I will represent my Clan, and I will play this LCG, and I will dedicate my victories to the faction that took me in when I returned... because that is how I am having fun.

And I hope to see you there, having fun along with me.

Thank you all for demanding the three cuts. Maybe I'm overreacting a bit. That happens from time to time. *sigh* Ok, I guess I need to chill out, too!

Name-dropping Yoritomo in the very first fiction would imply they've got plans, big plans, for our friends in green. And honestly, I DO hope they become a playable faction, with thematic mechanics and a badass story. I'd also happily welcome the return of my favorite namespeaking rodents.

I will only tolerate the Mantis if they don't repeat the Mantis Civil War thingie, and have a cool character set up with an obvious (tragic) end only to go "LOLNOPE SHE IS FINE LADZ!" and then ruin her completely. And no, I'm not only referring to the girl. Her dad is guilty too.

Just sayin'.

...also, I was actually being serious about asking whether someone could say what "mono no aware" is...

To @twinstarbmc I will say this. In the past year and a half, this board has been host to many (Mostly RPG) players expressing their opinion that Spider should have never been made a Clan. Mantis get to be the follow up gripe for many of these people. Most of us have ignored it, as we have become accustomed to this exclusionary attitude from certain sections of the community. (I wasn't one of the cool kids in high school or college, so nothing new there.)

But people have their limits. And those limits always seem to be shorter on the internet. So when they are being told they have no place in the community, they push back.

For myself, I'm fine with people showing who they are so I know if I should put them on my ignore list.

3 minutes ago, JJ48 said:

...also, I was actually being serious about asking whether someone could say what "mono no aware" is...

The Google knows.

Just now, JJ48 said:

...also, I was actually being serious about asking whether someone could say what "mono no aware" is...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mono_no_aware

The awareness of the transience of all things.

2 minutes ago, AtoMaki said:

The Google knows.

1 minute ago, Coyote Walks said:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mono_no_aware

The awareness of the transience of all things.

Yes, I can see that in philosophical terms. I was just wondering if some of the players could say what they mean by it specifically in regards to this game, since it seems to be a pretty popular term on these boards.

1 minute ago, JJ48 said:

Yes, I can see that in philosophical terms. I was just wondering if some of the players could say what they mean by it specifically in regards to this game, since it seems to be a pretty popular term on these boards.

Fate Tokens are intended to represent that concept.

1 minute ago, JJ48 said:

Yes, I can see that in philosophical terms. I was just wondering if some of the players could say what they mean by it specifically in regards to this game, since it seems to be a pretty popular term on these boards.

From FFG:

Quote

In Rokugani culture, a central philosophical concept is mono no aware. Literally translating to “the pathos of things,” mono no aware is an understanding and bittersweet acceptance that everything in the world is impermanent and transient. In Legend of the Five Rings: The Card Game, this is played out through your characters and your fate. After playing a character from one of your provinces, you may choose to pay any number of additional fate, placing these fate tokens directly onto the character.

5 minutes ago, Coyote Walks said:

To @twinstarbmc I will say this. In the past year and a half, this board has been host to many (Mostly RPG) players expressing their opinion that Spider should have never been made a Clan.

Ok, that's just not cool. Like many things going on in the world right now *cough*trump*cough* I may not agree that Spider should have been made a Great Clan, but they were, so there you go. Suck it up, haters, and go on with your lives. Which is also why I made the original post... Mantis isn't in the game (yet, I actually hope they get it some day), so accept it and carry on. I guess I'm just a deal-and-move-on kinda guy.

Though, I agree what others have said about clay loyalty. I get it.

1 hour ago, Yoritomo Reiu said:

1. You're obviously reading the wrong threads. There really isn't that much discussion of it.

2. Who cares that the Mantis weren't a faction when the game started? Neither were the Scorpion! It has nothing to do with anything and I don't know why people keep bringing it up.

I might be wrong, but I think Scorpion cards were released in the first set, like Kachiko, although they didn't have a stronghold then.

On the discord there are discussions about Yoritomo killing off Hotaru's husband. For maximum drama she could marry him later for political reason to get hold of his pirates to fight against the shadowlands.

I really like the idea of Doji Yoritomo.

Also what we can gather that this pirates are not immediately identified as Mantis Clan so the question is if there even is a Mantis Clan at all...

2 minutes ago, RandomJC said:

From FFG:

Thank you. That was what I was looking for.

Hm...not sure how I feel about fate tokens being tied to such a philosophy, though.

1 hour ago, Yoritomo Reiu said:

Who cares that the Mantis weren't a faction when the game started? Neither were the Scorpion!

1 minute ago, Barbacuo said:

I might be wrong, but I think Scorpion cards were released in the first set, like Kachiko, although they didn't have a stronghold then.

You are not wrong!
Compare Moshi Wakiza (Clearly belongs to a clan, yet tagged "Unaligned") with Bayushi Kachiko and Bayushi Togai (Clearly belongs to a clan, and also tagged with "Scorpion Clan" keyword).

And then there's the Naga, who are in a weird place with their own unique border art/color but no "clan" tags or stronghold, lol.

1 minute ago, JJ48 said:

Thank you. That was what I was looking for.

Hm...not sure how I feel about fate tokens being tied to such a philosophy, though.

I like it. Mono no aware looks like a core philosophy as part of the game design which is expressed through the fate mechanic.

3 minutes ago, Bayushi Tsubaki said:

You are not wrong!
Compare Moshi Wakiza (Clearly belongs to a clan, yet tagged "Unaligned") with Bayushi Kachiko and Bayushi Togai (Clearly belongs to a clan, and also tagged with "Scorpion Clan" keyword).

And then there's the Naga, who are in a weird place with their own unique border art/color but no "clan" tags or stronghold, lol.

The few scorpions in imperial also had a unique border art / color.

Hisa may have been a low-scale Hida Yakamo Oni-style misprint, lacking a Scorpion name but having the border.

42 minutes ago, Yandia said:

On the discord there are discussions about Yoritomo killing off Hotaru's husband. For maximum drama she could marry him later for political reason to get hold of his pirates to fight against the shadowlands.

I really like the idea of Doji Yoritomo.

Also what we can gather that this pirates are not immediately identified as Mantis Clan so the question is if there even is a Mantis Clan at all...

Well Technically the Mantis Clan only existed as a minor clan for about 12 years, and not anywhere near the day of thunder. so according to the empire they were just a bunch of pirates who claimed to be a minor clan. They somehow ended up leading the coalition of minor clans, mainly because of Yoritomo's presence not because they were a minor clan. So there really isnt any reason for Hatoru to identify them as the Mantis