So Imperials right now are hurting in the competitive scene. There are a variety of reasons for this, one being in my opinion a lack of uniqueness. What I mean is, Imperials as far as I can see have no unique trick or slot. Scum have the Illicit, Rebels have astromechs, but Imperials have no tech they don't share with someone else. The SLAM drive is a strange example of FFG giving a upgrade that was supposed to have been developed by Imperials first and stolen by the Rebellion, to the Rebels not only first but exclusively. Cloaking used to be an Imperial only ability until Scum got their hands on it. They have solid ships but nothing exclusive mechanically.

I have a few ideas of things that can help bring Imperials back. One is give them access to a Hull regen crew member. It would be similar but different enough from the Rebel and Scum shield regen to give Imperials a bit more staying power without copying completely another factions ability. Call them "Engineering Crew" or something to that effect. Maybe make it an action to discard a facedown damage card or flip facedown a face up card. That gives it some reasonable limitations (For example not being able to use it while stressed) and sacrificing an action without it needing to cost an arm and leg.

Also it seems interesting we have seen no Imperial ship with astromech slots despite knowing in lore they produced and used astromechs for certain ships. Maybe include a card for the Phantom in a later Aces pack as a title. "Astromech Refit: Replace Crew slot with Astromech." And include some Imperial Astromechs that favor aggressive tactics.

Another is the introduction of a "Tactics" card. Similar to the status cards the Wave Ten introduced but have them be a card not tied to a specific ship but to the list in general. The Empire is a well trained and coordinated machine. Something that helps represent the squadron tactics trained at a military academy would help not only give the Empire an exclusive tool but could also help relieve emphasis on Aces. Simple ones could be something like "Squad Coordination: Each non unique ship after the first that fires on the same target may add one dice or cancel one (evade dice). Attacker must declare which effect they are using prior to rolling." Or "Defensive Formation: Each non unique fighter may sacrifice one attack die to add one defense die to a friendly ship at Range One."
Or even something like "We do need need their kind of Scum: Player may include one unique Scum ship in their list at an increased cost of (X)."


The Aggressor may bring back Imperial competitiveness. We will have to see but I am personally unsure about the value of seeing the Imperial version of the Y-Wing TLT swarm hitting the table. There are plenty of TIE variants to utilize and perhaps things like the TIE Scout may show up and be more strategic pieces or the much requested Assault Gunboat. FFG has tools and options to bring the Empire back to it's proper place of Galactic dominance. Only the Emperor knows if they will seize them

How 'bout this? Two birds, one stone.

9 minutes ago, KommanderKeldoth said:

How 'bout this? Two birds, one stone.

So with EI, you regain up to two hull at the cost of being stressed? Ah, who am I kidding, imperials would need that

10 minutes ago, DeathstarII said:

So with EI, you regain up to two hull at the cost of being stressed? Ah, who am I kidding, imperials would need that

Nope. You can only perform an action one time in a round. So with EI or Push the Limit you could potentially flip a face up card face down and then discard it (thereby regaining 1 hull).

Unless of course the face up card was a direct hit, then you would effectively heal two hull.

Really this card would be a huge boon to the Decimator and not much else.

25 minutes ago, KommanderKeldoth said:

Nope. You can only perform an action one time in a round. So with EI or Push the Limit you could potentially flip a face up card face down and then discard it (thereby regaining 1 hull).

Unless of course the face up card was a direct hit, then you would effectively heal two hull.

Really this card would be a huge boon to the Decimator and not much else.

That's why I said up to two hull, a 7 in 33 chance of losing two hull in one attack

The only thing imperials need is mindlink to get the x7 treatment and the jump increased in cost.

18 minutes ago, Rakaydos said:

The only thing imperials need is mindlink to get the x7 treatment and the jump increased in cost.

While this may be true I can foresee only one of those things happening (Mindlink change) as the is no precedence in FFG for adjusting the point cost of an upgrade, let alone a ship. This would require them to do a complete repackage and figure out a way to distribute the updated card to people whom had already purchased the ship. Could they do it? Yes, but I find it unlikely.

My thought experiment here was as stated in my opening, figuring out a way to give the Imperials something unique but lore appropriate to give them a tool be become competitive without making them overwhelmingly strong.

And a hull regenerating crew would also help both forms of the shuttle and potentially the Phantom. The TIE Bomber as well if you include the TIE Shuttle title. Though that said the TIE/FO SF should have had a crew slot (being explicitly a two pilot fighter). There are possibly other TIE variants this applies to.

1 hour ago, DeathstarII said:

So with EI, you regain up to two hull at the cost of being stressed? Ah, who am I kidding, imperials would need that

Based on the "GONK" card and its wording, you probably could do both in one round.

4xTLT

7 minutes ago, BlodVargarna said:

4xTLT

Yes, but as I said in my OP I don't want an Imperial version of the Y wing TLT spam to be the answer.

What the empire needs that fits their profile and they lost because of lazy game design, is overwhelming force aka swarms. How often in movies, lore, comics, cartoons whatever have you seen the empire take 3 ships against 3 ships? I'm willing to bet almost never. The empire views a fair fight as 20 on 1. Now I know gameplay doesn't permit a balance that skewed so my idea is this. It would have to be a title with a restriction of generic only and probably a cost ceiling but it would work that when a ship with that title is destroyed it comes back in it's starting zone with some token on it and lose the title. A token ship is worth no points and obviously wouldn't come back. This would have the effect of wave after wave, it's likely not fair and will illicit many wonderful single word no responses but it is VERY imperial. Regen is not imperial, cloak really isn't either. It's the only thing I can come up with that makes sense.

23 minutes ago, LordFajubi said:

What the empire needs that fits their profile and they lost because of lazy game design, is overwhelming force aka swarms. How often in movies, lore, comics, cartoons whatever have you seen the empire take 3 ships against 3 ships? I'm willing to bet almost never. The empire views a fair fight as 20 on 1. Now I know gameplay doesn't permit a balance that skewed so my idea is this. It would have to be a title with a restriction of generic only and probably a cost ceiling but it would work that when a ship with that title is destroyed it comes back in it's starting zone with some token on it and lose the title. A token ship is worth no points and obviously wouldn't come back. This would have the effect of wave after wave, it's likely not fair and will illicit many wonderful single word no responses but it is VERY imperial. Regen is not imperial, cloak really isn't either. It's the only thing I can come up with that makes sense.

This could make for some serious fun and I agree, it would be a great way to simulate the imperials "swarm" tactics.

27 minutes ago, LordFajubi said:

What the empire needs that fits their profile and they lost because of lazy game design, is overwhelming force aka swarms. How often in movies, lore, comics, cartoons whatever have you seen the empire take 3 ships against 3 ships? I'm willing to bet almost never. The empire views a fair fight as 20 on 1. Now I know gameplay doesn't permit a balance that skewed so my idea is this. It would have to be a title with a restriction of generic only and probably a cost ceiling but it would work that when a ship with that title is destroyed it comes back in it's starting zone with some token on it and lose the title. A token ship is worth no points and obviously wouldn't come back. This would have the effect of wave after wave, it's likely not fair and will illicit many wonderful single word no responses but it is VERY imperial. Regen is not imperial, cloak really isn't either. It's the only thing I can come up with that makes sense.

I'd actually be ok with an idea like this. Very thematic to the Empire and would require a rethink of other lists to combat it.

I also rarely play in tournaments so MoV doesn't mean all that much to me. Just getting a fun game in is what counts. I would limit the max points of a ship with this title would be as well, as mentioned. Don't want reinforcement royal guard interceptors but like the idea of recurring black squadron or academy pilots

It would work ok for tournaments too, just kill all the titled ships you win. Basically it's a trade keep their numbers even and go for a head shot or elliminate the whole mess but do it slowly. It makes any titled ship a priority.

Agreed on tie fighters and tie f/o only for this title though. Int's would be too tough and ordnance makes bombers too good. Classic swarm is perfect though.

3 hours ago, Deimos said:

So Imperials right now are hurting in the competitive scene. There are a variety of reasons for this, one being in my opinion a lack of uniqueness. What I mean is, Imperials as far as I can see have no unique trick or slot. Scum have the Illicit, Rebels have astromechs, but Imperials have no tech they don't share with someone else. The SLAM drive is a strange example of FFG giving a upgrade that was supposed to have been developed by Imperials first and stolen by the Rebellion, to the Rebels not only first but exclusively. Cloaking used to be an Imperial only ability until Scum got their hands on it. They have solid ships but nothing exclusive mechanically.

I have a few ideas of things that can help bring Imperials back. One is give them access to a Hull regen crew member. It would be similar but different enough from the Rebel and Scum shield regen to give Imperials a bit more staying power without copying completely another factions ability. Call them "Engineering Crew" or something to that effect. Maybe make it an action to discard a facedown damage card or flip facedown a face up card. That gives it some reasonable limitations (For example not being able to use it while stressed) and sacrificing an action without it needing to cost an arm and leg.

Also it seems interesting we have seen no Imperial ship with astromech slots despite knowing in lore they produced and used astromechs for certain ships. Maybe include a card for the Phantom in a later Aces pack as a title. "Astromech Refit: Replace Crew slot with Astromech." And include some Imperial Astromechs that favor aggressive tactics.

Another is the introduction of a "Tactics" card. Similar to the status cards the Wave Ten introduced but have them be a card not tied to a specific ship but to the list in general. The Empire is a well trained and coordinated machine. Something that helps represent the squadron tactics trained at a military academy would help not only give the Empire an exclusive tool but could also help relieve emphasis on Aces. Simple ones could be something like "Squad Coordination: Each non unique ship after the first that fires on the same target may add one dice or cancel one (evade dice). Attacker must declare which effect they are using prior to rolling." Or "Defensive Formation: Each non unique fighter may sacrifice one attack die to add one defense die to a friendly ship at Range One."
Or even something like "We do need need their kind of Scum: Player may include one unique Scum ship in their list at an increased cost of (X)."


The Aggressor may bring back Imperial competitiveness. We will have to see but I am personally unsure about the value of seeing the Imperial version of the Y-Wing TLT swarm hitting the table. There are plenty of TIE variants to utilize and perhaps things like the TIE Scout may show up and be more strategic pieces or the much requested Assault Gunboat. FFG has tools and options to bring the Empire back to it's proper place of Galactic dominance. Only the Emperor knows if they will seize them

The issue with Imps goes all the way back. They rely on green dice.

green dice eventually crap out, and so you need to be lucky to win, competitive players don't like this so they go with hull, regen and insane alpha strikes.

FFG know the Imps have these issues, so have put stuff in the game to smooth that luck out.

Then, because Imps actually can't have nice things the forums get really dull with endless whine, and eventually FFG caves and screws over the Imps.

Even though nothing is actually as annoying as bloody rebel regen and bloody Miranda.

but hey, at least the Imps are suffering, so all is well.

2 hours ago, KommanderKeldoth said:

How 'bout this? Two birds, one stone.

I like this card! Would putting an "or" in there and removing the second "Action:" help to avoid any confusion as someone could potentially use those as 2 separate actions?

23 minutes ago, LordFajubi said:

It would work ok for tournaments too, just kill all the titled ships you win. Basically it's a trade keep their numbers even and go for a head shot or elliminate the whole mess but do it slowly. It makes any titled ship a priority.

Agreed on tie fighters and tie f/o only for this title though. Int's would be too tough and ordnance makes bombers too good. Classic swarm is perfect though.

how about 20 point cap? a bomber with a single missile, an alpha squadron with no ept, a TAP with title and autothrusters can all respawn, but hull upgrade howlrunner doesnt.

What we need is a super-weapon...

Something to restore order to the galaxy...

Something...

BIG!

1 hour ago, BlodVargarna said:

4xTLT

Just Nope. That is not the answer. Assuming it is good, all it does is create a 3rd TLT variant for TLT players. It does not create better ways to fly the two major archetypes that Imperial players were drawn to the faction for (Aces and Swarms).

I do hope the Aggressor is good an fun to fly but I'm not really interested in including even a single TLT Aggressor in an Imperial list.

50 minutes ago, Malabor said:

This could make for some serious fun and I agree, it would be a great way to simulate the imperials "swarm" tactics.

There's too many of them!

Any swarm worth mentioning has empty modification slots and nothing to put in them. fix that, and swarms will become more powerful.

2 hours ago, Deimos said:

...My thought experiment here was as stated in my opening, figuring out a way to give the Imperials something unique but lore appropriate to give them a tool be become competitive without making them overwhelmingly strong.

...for some reason, I'm at a complete loss for ideas.

1 hour ago, Rakaydos said:

how about 20 point cap? a bomber with a single missile, an alpha squadron with no ept, a TAP with title and autothrusters can all respawn, but hull upgrade howlrunner doesnt.

That was another reason I thought generic tie only would be a good limiter, you could put howl runner in there but she wouldn't regen. TAP's walk a line but I was afraid people would just alpha strike wave after wave with torps or missles, which while cool would likely make this too good of a move.

2 hours ago, BlueSquadronPilot said:

I like this card! Would putting an "or" in there and removing the second "Action:" help to avoid any confusion as someone could potentially use those as 2 separate actions?

Yeah I think that would be smoother wording but I guess I was designing it as an Imperial "Gonk". Basically I was intending for them to be separate actions.

4 hours ago, DeathstarII said:

That's why I said up to two hull, a 7 in 33 chance of losing two hull in one attack

Ah, I missed the 'up to' in the sentence. Apologies.