So to start out, I know that per RAW it says that lightsabers can't be sundered. In the case that you give your players something that is way to OP or unintentionally breaks the game during combat, how would you go about "fixing it" without forcibly just taking the lightsaber with some lame reasoning? I want to bring balance to our combat encounters, but I don't want the PC to feel like I am targeting him...just make a hard enough encounter that may do something to "break" half of the double lightsaber so he is left with just 1 side that works going forward.

Backstory: I initially gave my players a kyber crystal that was meant to be high powered, but I thought they would make a normal lightsaber out of it...instead they made a double lightsaber and the PC who uses it constantly uses linked, doing anywhere from 11-25+ damage in a game where the rest of the players just can't do that level of damage on a regular basis which makes it hard to craft difficult enough combat encounters when one person has that kind of damage. I have debated on having it taken/stolen, but I can't think of a way to do so that doesn't seem like I am just picking on him directly and taking back a piece of equipment that I shouldn't have given out in the first place.

Bear in mind that while you can't use the Sunder weapon quality, you can spend 2 triumphs from a combat check to destroy an item, and this does include lightsabers.

However, instead of just outright destroying the lightsaber in question, I'd say have a one-on-one chat with the player away from the table and express your concerns that the kyber crystal you created has turned out to be too unbalancing (especially if it's a homebrewed one), and that for the sake of the game you need to revise it's stats to tone it down a few degrees. Unless the player's a self-centered berk, they should be amenable to scaling down the crystal's effects to something that's not quite as overpowered.

Donovan's suggestion should always be plan A. Talk to the player. If you really feel the need to reduce the power of the lightsaber

Tho I would say that if the only problem is the linked on the double ended saber, then that isnt really a problem with the lightsaber. Combat isnt a competition between the players for who does the most damage, and it shouldnt be the only thing going on at that time. If the players are not having anything to do cause the lightsaber guy kills everything, have them do something else. Have the slicer slicing, the mechanic fixing, the doctor doctoring and so on.

The other thing is that it is a lightsaber. Not alot of range. if he likes to go charging off into melee when everyone else stays at range, have the bad guys close the blast doors and cut off the lightsaber guy from the rest of the party. That even goes back to what I said before about having the other players do other things. Now that an entire stormtrooper legion is pouring into the room with the lightsaber guy, the mechanic or slicer needs to open the door before the lightsaber guy gets wacked.

Maybe if your players can find other things for their characters to do, the lightsaber wont be as much of a problem

Also for future reference: Double bladed sabers require two of everything, crystals included. This is why everything for a double saber costs double.

I already spoke with the PC about it and he really likes the ability to decimate enemies so quickly...he doesn't abuse it that often but I feel the others get overshadowed by his fighting prowess even though his main abilities have to do more with survival and investigation. I was thinking about maybe the next time I get a double triumph I could hit the crystal and emitter of one side of it, therefore rendering it a single lightsaber so the Linked part is no longer available, thus negating the problem altogether.

Did you give him two kyber crystals?

If you gave him only 1 then he can't have a double bladed lightsaber Unless he finds his own...

First of all, what kind of party is this to begin with? An Edge Campiagn with F&D attached or Age of Rebellion? Theres a lot of missing information

42 minutes ago, TheShard said:

Did you give him two kyber crystals?

If you gave him only 1 then he can't have a double bladed lightsaber Unless he finds his own...

I gave the group 2 crystals to use as they see fit, I made them unable to be upgraded so they were already at max essentially. Instead of 2 people getting 1, they decided to give both to the single PC.

40 minutes ago, LordBritish said:

First of all, what kind of party is this to begin with? An Edge Campiagn with F&D attached or Age of Rebellion? Theres a lot of missing information

It's a F&D campaign with all 4 PC's being Force sensitive.

Sounds like the group is okay with it. Are you only one that has a problem with it?

Well the group likes the fact that they have this powerhouse in their back pocket that they can just sit back and let him loose which will make combat encounters easier. My problem is that they all get into the fray and attempt to help but he tends to be the one that goes to one enemy and strikes him down, then the next, and the next, always dealing the killing blow even if they still have a decent amount of life left.

It gets frustrating crafting encounters that challenge the group as a whole when 2 others are fighting focused but can't do near the same damage he can. They all have various skills that are better than others, but no one is the "mechanic" or the "doctor" they have mainly focused on Force powers and Lightsaber skills...which has caused issues passing some of the more simple non-Force-related checks.

I would like to get everyone back to the same level so everyone has the chance to shine, even if the group elects to allow him to go crazy on enemies and finish them off...it would be much cooler for the narrative if the others got to do that from time to time as well.

As long as the players don't have a problem with the situation it's okay to leave it for the time being. The fact that they're all saber-focused suggests that rather than wrecking the saber it's probably better to give the others theirs soon so that they can all become wrecking machines.

That isn't a bad thing: it's the sort of gameplay that they're after, so give it to them. They get to be death on wheels for mooks and come up against the occasional challenge that's worthy of their fighting skills, over-the-top action movie style. And they'll still be dealing with noncombat scenarios from time to time, so it's not like the sabers solve everything.

20 Minions... in a single group! Pack animals are good for this. he will be occupied for a while so the others can deal with other "problems" as mentioned above.

Another option is a nemesis Force User with lots of Reflect and a Training Saber (don't need another crystal in their hands!). Give the PC a massive target that no one else can actually deal with. Then lure the PC into a chase, make it into a "fencing montage" similar to those seen in musketeers or pirates movies. Meanwhile the others have their own problems to deal with.

But really the best option was mentioned above. Make combat encounters where the combat is actually unwanted.

Perhaps a heat exchanger breaks outside the ship, pc's head out to repair it and find 10 or more mynocks. The exchanger needs fixing now or the engines will overheat, but someone has to keep the mynocks at bay.

Or the crew are trying to download data off an old encrypted computer in some ruins. Tremors are fairly regular and the building could collapse at any moment, the download can't wait. Just as they get to the computer a pack of wild animals and their pack leader arrives. Someone has to keep the download going, someone has to protect that person. Then the other 2 need to fight off the pack. Possibly during the fight a small group sneak up on the computer guy, bypassing twirling death, ensuring the others have a chance to make a significant combat contribution.

Another possibility is to lead them on a series of short adventures to find crystals for everyone else, or bigger guns if that's their thing, to even out the playing field.

What are the other characters good at? You could consider developing encounters that requires that expertise to be at the forefront, focusing the attention on them for a little. The other way to do this is write part of their background or Morality into the encounter "your having a quiet drink in a booth of the local cantina when you overhear someone mentioning your brothers name, the brother that went missing 2 months ago"

Lastly I would ask about this character and their Morality. Are they acting impulsively? Are they leaping into combat with no other plan, no attempt at negotiation? Are they enjoying combat a little too much? Are they finishing off opponents that no longer pose a threat? Those things all attract a certain amount of Conflict, handing out more could slow the character down, giving the others a chance to step into the spotlight.

I'll echo the sentiment of others in that if the other players are 100% cool with one player pretty much dominating combat (as tends to happen when lightsabers enter the fray), then I'd say don't fret that much about it. Besides, if any of the PCs are investing into the Ranged (Heavy) skill, there's some extremely powerful weapon combinations to be found, especially once attachments and weapon mods start coming into play. A DH-X Heavy Blaster Rifle (Dangerous Covenants) with the augmented spin barrel (EotE or AoR corebook) that's been substantially modded can deliver a punch that's nearly as frightening as a lightsaber but from a much greater distance. There's also the Nova Dragon blaster pistol from Fly Casual that while expensive is an extremely potent weapon (Damage 7, Accurate 2, Pierce 2) that just gets beefier with a fully modded custom grip and blaster actuating module. So if the other players feel the need to step up their damage-dealing game, the options are out there; they just might need the credits to afford all those goodies.

One bit of tactical advice to keep in your pocket for occasional usage is that you can spend 3 advantage or a Triumph to disarm the 'saber monkey of his glowstick of doom. Depending on how you as the GM handles disarms, it could be as simple as spending a single maneuver to scoop up the dropped weapon, or could require two maneuvers (one to 'engage' with the weapon, second to pick it up). If it's the two maneuvers route, then that's quite likely to slow down the 'saber user, as those builds tend to be very reliant upon strain and don't always have an easy way to recover spent strain in the midst of combat (Ataru Striker is especially guilty of this). Just make sure you don't use this tactic in every single combat encounter.

Another option to use on occasion is refined cortosis, be it gauntlet or staff, which has the fun ability to briefly short out a lightsaber (can be reactivated as an incidental, but not until after the final action in the following round). Such a weapon would be a very good thing for a major villain to have, especially the staff if they have the Parry talent; while the 'saber user's doomstick is out of order, this gives the other PCs the option to step up and work towards taking the opponent down. Again, not every opponent should be carrying a refined cortosis weapon, but it is a thing.

22 hours ago, Ender07 said:

Well the group likes the fact that they have this powerhouse in their back pocket that they can just sit back and let him loose which will make combat encounters easier. My problem is that they all get into the fray and attempt to help but he tends to be the one that goes to one enemy and strikes him down, then the next, and the next, always dealing the killing blow even if they still have a decent amount of life left.

It gets frustrating crafting encounters that challenge the group as a whole when 2 others are fighting focused but can't do near the same damage he can. They all have various skills that are better than others, but no one is the "mechanic" or the "doctor" they have mainly focused on Force powers and Lightsaber skills...which has caused issues passing some of the more simple non-Force-related checks.

I would like to get everyone back to the same level so everyone has the chance to shine, even if the group elects to allow him to go crazy on enemies and finish them off...it would be much cooler for the narrative if the others got to do that from time to time as well.

You need the squad rules from the aor gm kit/screen. Basically you can group minions with a rival or nemesis and each successful hit against the nemesis kills 1 minion instead of dealing damage to the nemesis. There's a bit more to a squad than that but that should slow down the lightsaber wielder. And minion groups with large numbers of minions should slow him down too

22 hours ago, Ender07 said:

Well the group likes the fact that they have this powerhouse in their back pocket that they can just sit back and let him loose which will make combat encounters easier. My problem is that they all get into the fray and attempt to help but he tends to be the one that goes to one enemy and strikes him down, then the next, and the next, always dealing the killing blow even if they still have a decent amount of life left.

It gets frustrating crafting encounters that challenge the group as a whole when 2 others are fighting focused but can't do near the same damage he can. They all have various skills that are better than others, but no one is the "mechanic" or the "doctor" they have mainly focused on Force powers and Lightsaber skills...which has caused issues passing some of the more simple non-Force-related checks.

I would like to get everyone back to the same level so everyone has the chance to shine, even if the group elects to allow him to go crazy on enemies and finish them off...it would be much cooler for the narrative if the others got to do that from time to time as well.

Capture them and take away all their lightsabers....Luke lost his first one....hardly a reach narratively.

I've wanted to make an Ataru striker with something like a blaster pistol build into one end, and wield it like a force Lance from gene Roddenberry's starship Andromeda or a staff weapon from Stargate fighting with both ends. Ataru striker so that agility applies to both ends of the weapon.

Cortosis armor. Cortosis can stop lightsabers, and Refined Cortosis can shut them off.

At some point, these guys are going to draw the attention of the Empire, if they haven't already. The Empire is going to say "Thats enough of THAT!" and send in some heavy hitters.... Inquisitors with Cortosis gear, rival-level NPC's and oodles of minions.

As a GM, its your job to craft a fun, challenging game for your players. When they start getting 'too big for their britches', however, don't be afraid to pull out some heavy artillery, as it were.

14 hours ago, EliasWindrider said:

I've wanted to make an Ataru striker with something like a blaster pistol build into one end, and wield it like a force Lance from gene Roddenberry's starship Andromeda or a staff weapon from Stargate fighting with both ends. Ataru striker so that agility applies to both ends of the weapon.

OMG this! I'm making my first Jedi character now and as soon as I saw the rules for an inbuilt blaster mod I was thinking about doing this. Unfortunately that mod is for stun only, but I may try to see if my GM would be willing to allow it. Modded with a force user only trigger for the lightsaber I could pass it off as a unique blaster.

Thank you all for the input! There is a new development following last nights game now...the PC who always wielded the double lightsaber just lost his right arm due to a direct shot from a disruptor pistol and received a "maimed" critical. I am aware that you can still use a double lightsaber one-handed, but it seems they are primarily made for users with 2 hands to operate well due to the cumbersome quality. What I said, at least for right now, since he just lost his arm and is going to have to fit a cybernetic replacement at some point (probably) he will be facing increased difficultly in checks when using the double lightsaber one-handed...because if it was cumbersome before with 2 hands, it will be even more so with just 1, in addition to the fact that he is not yet used to living without it.

I don't know if he will choose to make a regular lightsaber so he can utilize it better, or if we will end up making a "Wolverine-type claw" with a cybernetic replacement, or what might happen...but it seems at least as of now the issue somewhat resolved itself.

11 hours ago, Ahrimon said:

OMG this! I'm making my first Jedi character now and as soon as I saw the rules for an inbuilt blaster mod I was thinking about doing this. Unfortunately that mod is for stun only, but I may try to see if my GM would be willing to allow it. Modded with a force user only trigger for the lightsaber I could pass it off as a unique blaster.

You seem to be reading my mind, so I have a question for ... is this a case of

1) great minds think alike,

2) it takes 2 fools to share 1 thought,

3) we're twins separated at birth with a telepathic conection, (appropriate for a star wars message board), or

4) you've hacked my computer (because I had this idea on my computer since back when wotc had the license, I think when RCR was the current edition of the game, i.e. BEFORE saga edition)?

It's really not that difficult in this system, so long as you're GM gives approval. Using the Two Weapon Combat rules your character attacks with a Ranged Light weapon and a Lightsaber. Your really only able to target a single opponent, and the difficulty will unfortunately be increased twice to Daunting DDDD. You also have to use the lowest Characteristic and Skill of those applicable. 2 Advantage lets you hit with the second weapon. Really an Ataru Striker is the best for this since you can have both skills based on the same characteristic.

The only thing this weapon is a workaround for is not having to draw 2 weapons to attack.

Unfortunatly it's not a very easy thing to do, and my hopes of a swashbuckler grow smaller every book released, since I too would love a Saber/Pistol character. In the end you're better off with a normal Saber using Saber swarm and an auto fire or linked pistol. Then choose a single weapon each time you attack instead of using both.

3 hours ago, Richardbuxton said:

It's really not that difficult in this system, so long as you're GM gives approval. Using the Two Weapon Combat rules your character attacks with a Ranged Light weapon and a Lightsaber. Your really only able to target a single opponent, and the difficulty will unfortunately be increased twice to Daunting DDDD. You also have to use the lowest Characteristic and Skill of those applicable. 2 Advantage lets you hit with the second weapon. Really an Ataru Striker is the best for this since you can have both skills based on the same characteristic.

The only thing this weapon is a workaround for is not having to draw 2 weapons to attack.

Unfortunatly it's not a very easy thing to do, and my hopes of a swashbuckler grow smaller every book released, since I too would love a Saber/Pistol character. In the end you're better off with a normal Saber using Saber swarm and an auto fire or linked pistol. Then choose a single weapon each time you attack instead of using both.

Actually I believe it would be DDDDD, you upgrade the difficulty of making a ranged attack when you're engaged, but you could knock that down to DDDD with Dynamic fire talent (vanguard or recruit), so yeah the RAW sucks for this concept, so if you want to pull this off you've got to talk to the GM about some sort of accomodation (the GM of the game I'm going to be playing in said I could use linked on a double bladed lightsaber one end replaced with a blaster with the difficulty upgraded once so a 3 purple dice pool. I ended up not going with the concept so that I could have a regular lightsaber/one hand free to use unarmed parry from the martial artist.

But I would really love if FFG could provide a way to pull of "gun-fu"

1 hour ago, EliasWindrider said:

Actually I believe it would be DDDDD, you upgrade the difficulty of making a ranged attack when you're engaged, but you could knock that down to DDDD with Dynamic fire talent (vanguard or recruit), so yeah the RAW sucks for this concept, so if you want to pull this off you've got to talk to the GM about some sort of accomodation (the GM of the game I'm going to be playing in said I could use linked on a double bladed lightsaber one end replaced with a blaster with the difficulty upgraded once so a 3 purple dice pool. I ended up not going with the concept so that I could have a regular lightsaber/one hand free to use unarmed parry from the martial artist.

But I would really love if FFG could provide a way to pull of "gun-fu"

Wait a minute I'm forgetting whether the text says to "upgrade' or 'increase' the difficulty. Because if it's upgraded, it's not all that hard to succeed against 2 red.

Its increase.

first you determine the difficulty of using each weapon. The hardest is the one that applies to the check. Then you increase the difficulty buy one for two weapon combat. You increase it one more time if the two weapons require different skills to use.

ranged light is an average check when engaged (Easy with a single increase for being engaged). And obviously any melee check is an average as well.

for the positive dice you use the lowest of the two characteristics and the lowest rank of skills

My idea was to have the hilt also be a blaster ala the pistol hilt but the lightsaber could only be ignited by someone who was force sensitive like the force attuned resonator.

That way the weapon would appear as an odd blaster under most checks.