8 hours ago, duder said:

I have personal experience in sending a video of someone changing their dia to FFG OP. They did nothing.

What was the month/year if I may ask?

4 hours ago, Marinealver said:

What was the month/year if I may ask?

It was in March 2016 during a store champs

On 5/12/2017 at 5:12 AM, tsondaboy said:

I do not have the luxury to make my own rulings when there are official ones and risk being the bad guy on a power trip and start loosing players to that.

Why are you worried about losing players who don't believe in strict punishments for cheating?

8 minutes ago, VaeVictis said:

Why are you worried about losing players who don't believe in strict punishments for cheating?

We don't have official support here (Japan), and the X-Wing community is stagnant and slowly evaporates.
And although we did not have any major incidents as far as X-Wing goes so far, I simply cannot afford to ban anyone at the moment, cheater or not.
We did have an incident a few months ago with a player that got banned from tournaments and the local store for a year for another game (infinity).
It created such a strong backlash that the game community for that game almost died.
Thus I would prefer if FFG had a very clear strict policy about cheating to act as a deterrent, so something like this does not happen to the game I like the most.

That's a bummer. Well, put out an email to everyone who plays, and ask them what they think is the just punishment then.

Offer options like Tournament DQ, automatic loss, etc. Then you aren't the tyrant. Can easily phrase it as "At the Worlds, this happened, so I'd like to get everyone's input on what they think is fair."

Banning somebody is rarely the best way to handle anyone but the repeat offenders. It's just a game, not life and death. A tournament DQ is fair for a first offense. It's not perfect, but usually the offending player will learn their lesson.

On 5/12/2017 at 5:17 AM, TasteTheRainbow said:

Stop.

I've got tickets for the Armada champs at NoVa in August. I'm considering a refund, at the cost of hundreds of dollars for the event and hotel. I haven't even bought plane tickets yet. One time national tournament regulars in my area have put their full collections up for sale.

Don't stop. Flood the forums. Revolt. Refuse to engage in offiicial FFG tournaments until the person is retroactively permabanned and clear rules are offered stating that cheating is to result in an immediate ejection, then a loss. In that order.

If you give in now, just accept that there is no longer a purpose to the rules against cheating.

5 hours ago, duder said:

It was in March 2016 during a store champs

Okay, well store champs are not premier so they are supposed to be just like FFG tournaments but since FFG is only involved by proxy you really can't call a store's TO decision a precedent.

I forgot, regionals are considered Formal not Premier, right? So the same might be said for Regionals as well.

It shouldn't matter, an event is an event. They still cheated, FFG let it pass

5 minutes ago, duder said:

It shouldn't matter, an event is an event. They still cheated, FFG let it pass

But FFG has no real way to clearly identify the player in question, do they? From what I gather they have your word that the name you submitted belongs to the footage you submitted. That is not enough. In the Worlds incident, they do have the names of all participants at hand and know the footage was run live, so there is no question of who did what there.

7 minutes ago, Admiral Deathrain said:

But FFG has no real way to clearly identify the player in question, do they? From what I gather they have your word that the name you submitted belongs to the footage you submitted. That is not enough. In the Worlds incident, they do have the names of all participants at hand and know the footage was run live, so there is no question of who did what there.

They were given the name and email of the TO running the event. If FFG wants the income of x-wing being a top game, they need to create rules needed for a top game.

58 minutes ago, duder said:

They were given the name and email of the TO running the event. If FFG wants the income of x-wing being a top game, they need to create rules needed for a top game.

What evidence do you have that FFG are interested in this?

1 hour ago, duder said:

If FFG wants the income of x-wing being a top game, they need to create rules needed for a top game.

X-wing already is a top game, in fact it is or at least was the top selling game for a while.

You don't need strict floor rules to have a good event, even on the scale of a Worlds, and you definitely don't need them something like a Store Championship.

12 minutes ago, SOTL said:

What evidence do you have that FFG are interested in this?

It's there whether they like it or not. People are willing to travel internationally to play.

3 minutes ago, VanorDM said:

X-wing already is a top game, in fact it is or at least was the top selling game for a while.

You don't need strict floor rules to have a good event, even on the scale of a Worlds, and you definitely don't need them something like a Store Championship.

I think you do. It's clear people are willing to cheat to win. I'd kick someone out of a quarterly kit tournament for cheating. And that's why they need floor rules, specific punishments for specific wrong doings

13 minutes ago, duder said:

It's there whether they like it or not. People are willing to travel internationally to play.

Yeah I just don't think FFG are interested in this at all. They don't want their games to be taken seriously, they want people to have fun. This disconnect between FFG's objectives and the objectives of a portion of the player base that want X-Wing to be this competitive and serious tournament scene is really where the whole problem arises from.

They aren't going to go to all the hassle of making proper organised play, hammer cheats, create floor rules etc.... they're just going to wonder what all the fuss is about that's making people want to cheat and get so worked up about it all... just for some plastic target lock tokens? It's crazy.

Just now, duder said:

I think you do.

And I think you're wrong. However I have the weight of evidence on my side, since we've had several years of Store Championships, Regionals and Worlds, plus a number of other major events, all of which have had a Ton of people, most of them being 250+, none of them have had floor rules, and there has been next to no real issue with cheating at any of them.

The whole system is based on the premise that the TO/Marshal has half a brain and can deal with cheaters appropriately. If the person running your events lacks that and/or is unable to do what is needed, then the fix is fairly obvious.

8 minutes ago, duder said:

People are willing to travel internationally to play.

That's not actually proof of anything other than people like how FFG runs their events, and want to be part of them. It is not proof that FFG is doing anything wrong or needs to change anything, if anything it's evidence to the contrary.

Now if there was the kind of money that MtG has on the line, then perhaps a more formal set of floor rules would be appropriate, but as it stands now, no one is getting much of anything short of bragging rights for winning any event, no matter how big or small.

That doesn't mean that cheating should be tolerated, and by and large it's not. But it also doesn't mean FFG needs to get involved anytime someone cheats at a Store Championship, or even Regional, because the people running those events should be capable of dealing with it themselves,

Ok, people will create their own rules, then there will be an inconsistency.

5 minutes ago, duder said:

Ok, people will create their own rules, then there will be an inconsistency.

Which is fine, exactly the situation that has worked so far and exactly what FFG are happy with.

9 minutes ago, duder said:

Ok, people will create their own rules, then there will be an inconsistency.

What's wrong with that, especially for small local events?

As long as everyone agrees the event was run fairly, nothing else matters.

Because you get to worlds, then people aren't sure how to handle it.

Its not like there are actual stakes on the line here when we are competing for bragging rights and plastic chits. X-Wing does not have a professional scene. It has very dedicated amateur players that compete because they enjoy the game, not because they get anything out of it.

Just now, duder said:

Because you get to worlds, then people aren't sure how to handle it.

Aren't sure how to handle what? Not cheating?

Anyone who's dedicated enough to the game to go to worlds, is going to know how to properly play the game, and if someone breaks a rule there is a Marshal there to deal with it, as they dealt with it this time.

5 minutes ago, Admiral Deathrain said:

Its not like there are actual stakes on the line here when we are competing for bragging rights and plastic chits. X-Wing does not have a professional scene. It has very dedicated amateur players that compete because they enjoy the game, not because they get anything out of it.

No, there isn't anything real at stake, but people are going to have fun, and not to get screwed over.

5 minutes ago, VanorDM said:

Aren't sure how to handle what? Not cheating?

Anyone who's dedicated enough to the game to go to worlds, is going to know how to properly play the game, and if someone breaks a rule there is a Marshal there to deal with it, as they dealt with it this time.

I'll fully believe that when FFG issues a ban