This has arisen from a chat I had with some friends regarding 'dial-gate'. These guys don't play X-wing (yet) but they asked a very pertinent question 'if he was thinking about cheating, why not ask to not stream the game?'

Cheating aside, there are quite a few valid reasons somebody wouldn't want a game to be streamed or recorded. As I've never been to a large tournament, I'm curious: do players have a say in this? Can they refuse?

Depends on the vendor.

If FFG didn't have the players sign a waiver, then yes, of course they have a say.

You can definitely say no. Most of the streamers will ask ahead of time. Your friends make a good point.

Yes, you absolutely can ask, and the streamers should let you avoid it.

Bear in mind people can want to avoid the public eye for many reasons which are not related to foul play, so assuming anything about a person's reasons for wanting not to be streamed should be avoided.

This is interesting because at my regionals, in the semi finals match I was going to be streamed, which I was perfectly ok with.

However they had set up a dice cam too and the place to throw the dice was hard to see for my height and I like being able to just roll right in front of me, so I asked if I could go without it. They of course took it away, but were kind of mad about it. But that's the way it goes.

'if he was thinking about cheating, why not ask to not stream the game?'

He didn't plan on it. More like, he screwed up his approach causing a bump train and leaving himself vulnerable. He had a panic-moment and cheated to try to save himself by getting the HWK out of the bump train to Focus up his Attanni list.

Prior to that, he was probably pretty stoked to be on stream.

I get really nervous at tournaments. Having a handful of people watching makes my belly have butterflies. A live stream? Omg.

2 minutes ago, Fuzzywookie said:

I get really nervous at tournaments. Having a handful of people watching makes my belly have butterflies. A live stream? Omg.

I thought the same thing, but once you are there, after a round or two you are so focused on the game you forget the cameras are even there. Im sure that is what happened to the cheater.

I always ask before putting someone on stream, and have had several people ask not to be streamed. Usually, the reasons are nerves or superstition ("I always lose on stream!"), or if they look across at their opponent and see he has a really bad list for them and they don't want to be streamed getting stomped. I always respect their wishes, unless it is the final match to determine the winner of the event.

9 minutes ago, pheaver said:

I always ask before putting someone on stream, and have had several people ask not to be streamed. Usually, the reasons are nerves or superstition ("I always lose on stream!"), or if they look across at their opponent and see he has a really bad list for them and they don't want to be streamed getting stomped. I always respect their wishes, unless it is the final match to determine the winner of the event.

This, we've always asked people if they want/are willing to be on camera. Only had a few people that declined. Never had anyone turn down the finals, not even Duncan!

9 minutes ago, Brunas said:

This, we've always asked people if they want/are willing to be on camera. Only had a few people that declined. Never had anyone turn down the finals, not even Duncan!

I think it's also somewhat fair to say sorry, you're in the finals so you're on stream. At all other times there are other matches to watch but the finals is the only match remaining and the most important one of the tournament.

11 minutes ago, nigeltastic said:

I think it's also somewhat fair to say sorry, you're in the finals so you're on stream. At all other times there are other matches to watch but the finals is the only match remaining and the most important one of the tournament.

If you're running the event, I'd agree, but usually we just show up to things with a camera. Who are we to tell you that you have to be on stream!

1 hour ago, nigeltastic said:

I think it's also somewhat fair to say sorry, you're in the finals so you're on stream. At all other times there are other matches to watch but the finals is the only match remaining and the most important one of the tournament.

If I didn't want to be streamed and was being forced into it, I'd probably forfeit and just have the final round canceled.

5 hours ago, LordBlades said:

This has arisen from a chat I had with some friends regarding 'dial-gate'. These guys don't play X-wing (yet) but they asked a very pertinent question 'if he was thinking about cheating, why not ask to not stream the game?'

Cheating aside, there are quite a few valid reasons somebody wouldn't want a game to be streamed or recorded. As I've never been to a large tournament, I'm curious: do players have a say in this? Can they refuse?

The guy probably did not think about cheating in advance. He made a bad move and realized it could cost him the game. I'm pretty sure it was more an emotional reaction. Otherwise he would have remembered there was a camera and thousands of players watching...

5 hours ago, Rinzler in a Tie said:

Depends on the vendor.

If FFG didn't have the players sign a waiver, then yes, of course they have a say.

Well, FFG does state that by purchasing a Worlds Ticket, you acknowledge and accept that you can and/or will be filmed.

Its part of their terms and conditions, and purchasing a worlds ticket is acceptance thereof, it seems like.

10 minutes ago, Drasnighta said:

Well, FFG does state that by purchasing a Worlds Ticket, you acknowledge and accept that you can and/or will be filmed.

Its part of their terms and conditions, and purchasing a worlds ticket is acceptance thereof, it seems like.

There's the answer. Mods, close this topic.

4 hours ago, kris40k said:

He didn't plan on it. More like, he screwed up his approach causing a bump train and leaving himself vulnerable. He had a panic-moment and cheated to try to save himself by getting the HWK out of the bump train to Focus up his Attanni list.

Prior to that, he was probably pretty stoked to be on stream.

hence why the "malicious" part was dropped. Still I can see why people on't want to be streamed. Just ask any popular Twitch streamer of all the problems they had. Backseat gaming, stream sniping. Now on the table top format it might be harder since you are not paying attention to the chat and people can't list tailor. But then again knowing the MOV and if a player know you have a list that is at a disadvantage to their own there is a small chance of sniping through MOV. Again that is excessive and some might say if a player is that good they deserve to snipe to the top cut.

Now FFG has a waiver because they stream on Twitch too. but they don't have the resources to cover such a large event which is why Gold Squadron, Team Covenant and other 3rd Party Table Top venues are invited to participate and cover their events. Question is will Dialgate change that policy and how?

How does every thread devolve into this same discussion?

Dialgate ruined a lot of your weekends, huh?
LET THE IT GO , he was flying a HWK ffs - the only way to get to Day 2 with a HWK is to cheat. Com'mon...

50 minutes ago, Thormind said:

The guy probably did not think about cheating in advance. He made a bad move and realized it could cost him the game. I'm pretty sure it was more an emotional reaction. Otherwise he would have remembered there was a camera and thousands of players watching...

I agree. Even without streaming, 'dial in a bad move then change it while nobody is watching' is a pretty bad game plan. I'm pretty sure it was a spur of the moment thing.

Regardless, I was curious about streaming in general, dial gate merely sparked the question

Not sure about the US, but in Poland you are not allowed to film people without their consent. So unless you agreed to be streamed (because it was in the t&c for buying a ticket, for example- but it usually isn't) you have every right to say no.

6 hours ago, pheaver said:

I always respect their wishes, unless it is the final match to determine the winner of the event.

...

So you'd consciously put a player who you know gets anxious in front of the camera at a disadvantage in the finals?

If I was in tour finals and you'd try to pull that on my opponent, I'd sure as hell refuse to play on stream too. Streams are great and I love watching them too, but tournaments are first and foremost meant to be enjoable for the players, not some randoms on the internet.

3 hours ago, LordBlades said:

I agree. Even without streaming, 'dial in a bad move then change it while nobody is watching' is a pretty bad game plan. I'm pretty sure it was a spur of the moment thing.

Regardless, I was curious about streaming in general, dial gate merely sparked the question

I would say if you are suffering from anxiety you might be able to ask. I dont think it would work if you reach the top spots though. Major events are a big source of publicity. People see what's being played and kinda want to buy the same thing :-). I'm pretty sure you can ask the camera guy to stay on the game mat but that's almost always what happens anyway. All we usually see from people is their hands.

I don't like being filmed or photographed. I was still on stream 6 times this year, because I don't hate the camera as much as my opponents wanted to be on stream, so I figured wth.

The final to our regional is another issue as I know my opponent declined being filmed in top 8. We were both so tired by that 9th match that we both stopped caring, I guess.

My son asked to be once and loved it. But then his friends failed to understand why that (or x-wing in general) was cool, so he lost interest in being on the stream. 7 year olds, what can you do?

5 hours ago, Drasnighta said:

Well, FFG does state that by purchasing a Worlds Ticket, you acknowledge and accept that you can and/or will be filmed.

Its part of their terms and conditions, and purchasing a worlds ticket is acceptance thereof, it seems like.

FFG was only running their stream for post cut matches this year, I believe. Pretty sure you could have told whatever podcast was streaming Swiss rounds (was not paying attention, too busy scrubbing out with Y-Wings) you didn't want to play on stream.

33 minutes ago, Rogue37 said:

FFG was only running their stream for post cut matches this year, I believe. Pretty sure you could have told whatever podcast was streaming Swiss rounds (was not paying attention, too busy scrubbing out with Y-Wings) you didn't want to play on stream.

Their statement also included the fact that you could simply be filmed walking around the center, while they were doing things in-between games and streams and such. It is basically a blanket statement.

Here's the relevent section from the Competitor Pamphlet:


NOTICE OF FILMING

The Fantasy Flight Games Center and the auxiliary space at the Radisson Hotel are being used to photograph and record video and film footage for use by Fantasy Flight Games. By your presence in these areas, you acknowledge that you have been informed that you may be photographed and recorded for use in any media now known or hereafter devised, in perpetuity throughout the universe.

Further, by your presence here, you grant your permission for your likeness and voice to be included therein without compensation, credit, or other consideration. If you do not wish to be photographed, recorded, or appear under these conditions, you must leave this area immediately. Thank you for your cooperation.

3 hours ago, Thormind said:

I would say if you are suffering from anxiety you might be able to ask. I dont think it would work if you reach the top spots though. Major events are a big source of publicity. People see what's being played and kinda want to buy the same thing :-). I'm pretty sure you can ask the camera guy to stay on the game mat but that's almost always what happens anyway. All we usually see from people is their hands.

Or hair when you fly your ship across the board and have to reach. Could always wear a pilot helmet.