7 minutes ago, Lyraeus said:

Becuase you can't without creating a new game to do that or have cards that specify just bombers. Maybe they will do it maybe they wont

As Jondavies72 said above, his suggestion'd be through upgrades. Still, as you say, we'll have to wait and see.

3 minutes ago, pt106 said:

Good point. I think that any new cards that can be created aren't going to be seen until wave 7 (and most likely wave 8). The only reaction that can be done fast enough is FAQ/Errata.

Erm, given past examples, Wave 7-8 is faster than FAQ/Errata.

11 minutes ago, pt106 said:

The problem is that unless something changes people that write about strategy and ideas may just give up and move on to different games.

I suppose that's a danger.. but I don't think so. There will always be strategy. The main point is let's not get all bent out of shape about it. People are acting like Armada ran over their dog or something. It's a game and it's fun and I feel like, for most people.. excluding the elite who can exploit design weaknesses expertly, it will still be fun no matter.

The latest posts are much more "let's think of ways this could be better" as opposed to initial reactionary outrage to the data from worlds. That's what I was responding to. FFG will do something to try to fix the game if they feel like it's going to affect their bottom line or if they feel like people are leaving the game. At this point it's just wait and see and continue to play the game we enjoy playing.

1 hour ago, Undeadguy said:

How does this fix anything? Now B-Wings can double tap you from medium? Sloane can rip tokens from long? What's the intent here because I see a lot of ways this breaks the game.

The post I quoted was advocating a Rhymer nerf, which likely means no medium range squad attacks. My argument was for less clustering, something that I feel makes the game very difficult to manage on the table.

Lots of new features address it and it helps (relay, snipe, Rogue), but having Rhymer around (in most empire squad lists) helps the cluttering a LOT.

Its probably too late now, all I was saying is the game would be far less crowded if squads (and ships) had a much farther firing band. I really hope the red AS die on the Quasar isn't a misprint in the preview. It will help with clutter and may help fight the Rieeken ball too.

On 5/9/2017 at 10:00 AM, Darth Sanguis said:

Sorry, I'm not trying to be pissy, and I shouldn't make my statements so sharp, it's not you or even the folks that play squadron lists I'm mad at. Misdirected anger. But I am beyond annoyed with how relevant squadrons are. I'm not saying it's an invalid way to play, I'm saying it's become the MOST valid way to play, and that's what I'm hating... why bother buying a $60 ISD model if I can't use it because $25-$30 worth or 100 points of snub fighters can turn it inside out... And I didn't mean to imply people interested in squads should play X-wing instead, I just genuinely don't understand if squadron play is what draws you, why are you playing armada, X-wing really does snub fighters better?

Now we're on the same page. I remember thinking the exact reserve in wave 1. Intel in wave 2 I thought it the perfect spot. With the advent of the BCC, we started seeing the creep the other way. I don't personally have a problem with relay because you have to cut points into your squadron points to do it. It's BCCs, and I think especially double BCCs, that have put us over the top. I wish I had something concrete to give you, but all I can really say is have faith. FFG clearly recognized the wave 1 and 2 trends and make corrects. They'll do it again. We might not see it in full until wave 7, but I'm sure they'll get here.

In the meantime, I'm gonna go ram some flotillas. I keep a running tally of how many I kill with the various versions of my Team Ramrod list. My Liberty version went 7 for 8 in flotilla kills and went 8-3 (this was an Ace Holes list), 4-7, 5-6, and 10-1 at Stele. The Admonition version is 7 for 7 in flotilla kills and has gone 8-3, 9-2, plus a CC win. The moral of the story: CRambos are an inventive cure to the flotilla disease

Thought about AA:

Whenever a fighter makes an attack roll against a ship, that ship gets to roll it AA dice against the fighter BEFORE it makes the attack .

First of all, a fighter should HAVE to make it through waves of flak before getting their attack run, every time. As @Darth Sanguis said, "It isn't like the turbolaser fire stops just because the AA kicks in..."

It also makes Raider screens and the titles very much better, because now massive fighter balls HAVE to get past that 70-point obstacle, which will rip them to shreds, before proceeding to the meat. Also, Rhymer gets a bit of a buff, because now black AA dice don't hit him. It also means that forgoing an arc's attack to concentrate flak makes a ship able to hit squadrons fairly hard if necessary.

I want fighters to stay a threat. Canonically, they ARE a threat - every source shows us waves of fighters first, then the big ships come in to fight IF the squadrons haven't done their job, and Armada should represent that.

I agree that Rieekan and flotillas are too strong, and removing Rieekan's buff to uniques and flotillas as scoring ships would make that swing back the other way while still keeping them useful.

1 hour ago, Norsehound said:

So... I take it you feel the Rieekan fighter swarms are the epitome of Star Wars Armada play then? Maximum fighters and little else but enhancements to that fighter ball?

Glad we cleared that up. I wonder how I ended up with three redundant Imperial Star Destroyers then. Next I'll hear Hammerheads should auto-defeat ISDs within distance 1 of each other because the movies do it too?

Nope. I prefer playing big ships and low squadron counts.

However I am absolutely right about the Star Wars franchise. It's always been about the victory of the little guys: heroes flying squadrons doing amazing things - tiny ships outfoxing and defeating larger ships. With the massive imperial ships in the background as set dressing or target practice. Multiple ISDs can't stop a single rogue freighter. A small group of Y-Wings can ionize and disable an ISD. A small frigate can ram an ISD into another and eliminate both.

That's just Star Wars.

Quote

It's also statements like these that caused Blail to explode. We want some acknowledgement over the dissatisfaction of this element of the game, dismissal tells us our concerns and opinions do not matter.

Some of us feel one piece is lacking though, and it's a particular piece we really enjoy. The reason I'm sticking it out and not quitting over fighters is because I hold out hope the pendulum will swing back someday. The core of the game is strong... stronger than the green dice for ship survival of X-Wing. If AA ratings for capital ships were buffed to functional levels, we'd be good.

Nothing I typed had any malice or vitriol in it.

Choosing to explode at "statements like" mine is the result of a persecution complex. That's on the poster, not on me.

I'm just here to talk about Star Wars and the game.

3 minutes ago, Thraug said:

I really hope the red AS die on the Quasar isn't a misprint in the preview. It will help with clutter and may help fight the Rieeken ball too.

One nice thing about red AA is that it increases in power as the opponent brings more squadrons. So, it hurts 134-squads more than 80-squads. seeing it on a 50-60 pt ship feels about right to me, especially an imperial carrier, since the Imperial fighter doctrine seems to be more about combined arms & coordination than the rebel individual heroic style.

You know... If the Quad Battery Turrets turns out to be an anti Squadron upgrade I will laugh and laugh.

Zombie Aces have been overpowered since dead Obi-Wan (and Han, who FLEW OFF TABLE!!!) helped Luke DESTROY A DEATH STAR in episode 4.

Flotillas are just as bad. 4 Blue Dice (Planetary Ion Cannon) + Flotilla/BCC and 2 X-Wing Squadrons annihilate an ISD in episode 5.

Why was anyone surprised at Endor? We knew Zombie Squads + Flotillas were OP. The warning signs were there.

IT'S BEEN 34 YEARS! FFG DID NOTHING THEN AND CONTINUES TO DO NOTHING NOW.

I'm done with this game.

2 minutes ago, NerfYoda said:

Zombie Aces have been overpowered since dead Obi-Wan (and Han, who FLEW OFF TABLE!!!) helped Luke DESTROY A DEATH STAR in episode 4.

Flotillas are just as bad. 4 Blue Dice (Planetary Ion Cannon) + Flotilla/BCC and 2 X-Wing Squadrons annihilate an ISD in episode 5.

Why was anyone surprised at Endor? We knew Zombie Squads + Flotillas were OP. The warning signs were there.

IT'S BEEN 34 YEARS! FFG DID NOTHING THEN AND CONTINUES TO DO NOTHING NOW.

I'm done with this game.

6 minutes ago, Lyraeus said:

You know... If the Quad Battery Turrets turns out to be an anti Squadron upgrade I will laugh and laugh.

It will... seen on screen exclusively shooting at squadrons in EP1

16 minutes ago, Truthiness said:

I don't personally have a problem with relay because you have to cut points into your squadron points to do it.

I would disagree with you here. On Imperial side using Jendon as a relay doesn't really cuts into points due to his synergy with heavy hitters, and fleeing relaying flotillas fully invalidate "kill the carriers" strategy. Its too much benefit without any significant risk. I fielded Jendonball at my regionals and I felt wrong using it.

11 minutes ago, Lyraeus said:

You know... If the Quad Battery Turrets turns out to be an anti Squadron upgrade I will laugh and laugh.

I am pretty sure it will be.

1 minute ago, pt106 said:

I would disagree with you here. On Imperial side using Jendon as a relay doesn't really cuts into points due to his synergy with heavy hitters, and fleeing relaying flotillas fully invalidate "kill the carriers" strategy. Its too much benefit without any significant risk. I fielded Jendonball at my regionals and I felt wrong using it.

Agree with this assessment, also that PT should feel dirty for using it.

1 minute ago, Madaghmire said:

Agree with this assessment, also that PT should feel dirty for using it.

Especially given that I might've been the first person using that strategy.

12 minutes ago, Lyraeus said:

You know... If the Quad Battery Turrets turns out to be an anti Squadron upgrade I will laugh and laugh.

Quad Battery Turrets, whatever points. If you did not perform an attack against any squadrons this activation, exhaust this card to choose an attack arc. You may perform an attack against all squads in that arc using your AA armament.

1 minute ago, pt106 said:

Especially given that I might've been the first person using that strategy.

Eh. Jendon ball is an obvious strong play. If it hadnt been you it would have been someone else. We're using variations of jendon ball pretty much every week, except when we conciously dont.

7 minutes ago, ianediger said:

Quad Battery Turrets, whatever points. If you did not perform an attack against any squadrons this activation, exhaust this card to choose an attack arc. You may perform an attack against all squads in that arc using your AA armament.

Let's not jump the gun.... how about:

Select one enemy squadron within range of your AA dice. Selected squadron is DESTROYED.


"You may fire when ready"



"No please, we are a peaceful planet..."



PEW PEW PEW




Squadron chunks everywhere!

Just now, Madaghmire said:

Eh. Jendon ball is an obvious strong play. If it hadnt been you it would have been someone else. We're using variations of jendon ball pretty much every week, except when we conciously dont.

I know you do I did it at Boston regional early Wave 5 and discussed it with Reinholt and the rest of IFF crew. Even then it felt too strong (And I'm pretty sure some would've done it as it's an obvious synergy)

4 hours ago, pt106 said:

I know that FFG gathered statistics on Demo usage at Worlds and only one fleet with the gladiator in it didnt have demo title. So, Ithink that some action against Demo is likely.

I'm genuinely suprised by the fact there one. From how you worded it, it wasn't even in a 2 glad fleet?

Well let me throw in my two cents. As many have started the core game in Armada is amazing, but it's the interaction of upgrades that let you break/bend the core game that led us to this place so here are my thoughts.

BCC-dose not stack. It will still help bombers be consistent but you won't get three re-rolls to get the hit crit all the time.

Flotillas- are just flotillas they are not 'ships' they do not prevent tableing. As they are not ships they can not be and objective ship, or flag ship.

Reeiken- I have had some ideas but this is what I'm toying with now. A ship effected by this ability must discard a title upgrade if it cannot it is removed from play a Squadron effected by this ability must discard a defence token if it has no token to discard it is removed from the play area. I like this because Reeiken will still work and still be good but once yavaris is gone so is it's title and in a round about way ups Reeikens cost as you have to take titles for him to work on ships. With squadrons we get around him working on gold squadron etc.

14 minutes ago, TheCallum said:

I'm genuinely suprised by the fact there one. From how you worded it, it wasn't even in a 2 glad fleet?

Yes, and it was in my fleet, so after the tournament of of the judges mentioned this fact to me and that's how I know the story

41 minutes ago, Lyraeus said:

You know... If the Quad Battery Turrets turns out to be an anti Squadron upgrade I will laugh and laugh.

I would lay a modest bet it will be, I would also lay a bet that it will be a bit rubbish, FFG have form in being a bit over cautious in designing anti squadron upgrades (they are generally naf) This may be one of the reasons we are where we are.

The only really effective anti fighter cards are Demo (on a glad 2) and the two raider titles (with OE) when linked with kalus and/or ruthless. These do give the Imps some limited options to develop focused AAA ship builds, but the Rebels have none?.

6 minutes ago, pt106 said:

Yes, and it was in my fleet, so after the tournament of of the judges mentioned this fact to me and that's how I know the story

Was it a 2 Pt?