2 minutes ago, thecactusman17 said:

Both sides had flotillas. Flotillas were a key part of the tournament on the whole, not just this list or the top 8. The top 8 was going to have multiple flotillas regardless of the list archetype or faction.

Well but I think thats Cal's point.

1 minute ago, Madaghmire said:

Well but I think thats Cal's point.

I was just typing that. Deserves a like.

2 minutes ago, AshesFall said:

How many of the top 8 had as many as three flotillas, or more?

That specific number? All of them as I understand it. However, most of the top cut likely had 5+ activations. Flotillas is how these fleets got 5+ activations. That doesn't mean taht every list with 5+ activations had 3 flotillas, or that every list with 3 flotillas got to the top cut, just that it was a common way to fill out ship activations.

Which it was explicitly designed to do.

The only things I dislike about flotillas right now is 1. Relay from on the OTHER SIDE OF THE MAP and 2. life boat admirals on the OTHER SIDE OF THE MAP. I mean it isn't a big issue for some I know, but I just don't like how it turns up in tournament and casual play.

Its the flotillas not Rieekan.

2 minutes ago, DrunkTarkin said:

It's flotillas not Rieekan.

What about Ramtrocity Rieekan spam?

Flotillas are part of the Rieekan-phenomena on a competitive level. Ramming fleets are not so competitive because there are hard counters to them.

16 minutes ago, TallGiraffe said:

The only things I dislike about flotillas right now is 1. Relay from on the OTHER SIDE OF THE MAP and 2. life boat admirals on the OTHER SIDE OF THE MAP. I mean it isn't a big issue for some I know, but I just don't like how it turns up in tournament and casual play.

Have faith. FFG will help us. They are our only hope.

Just now, Green Knight said:

Have faith. FFG will help us. They are our only hope.

Well I got Runewars and casual play of both Armada and IA to stem me over for now. Then Wave 6.

I didn't read all 13 pages of the thread. I'm a terrible person, but I lost interest in the near personal sniping that was going on for the first two pages.

How about, and I apologize if this has been floated before, if the Commander ability range of effect is modified by the base size of whatever they're equipped to:

Small Base - Range 1-3
Medium Base - Range 1-5
Large Base - Full Map

In a fluff sense, it'd play to the ability of a "ship of the line" to be capable of command/control of the battlefield, but a smaller support ship would be more limited in its ability to see what's going on. Sure you can drop Rieekan or whomever on a GR75 and park them way off to the side of the map, but then they'd be highly limited in what they get to support. The commanders in SW always seemed to be more of a medieval King, out leading on the field and in the thick of the combat.

I'd rather deal with broken combos than the problems we have over here.

It is a great day to be an Armada player.

Ok.

Last year. Why did Brikhaus decide to fly tight formation straight at the enemy and this year Norm did not?

So to answer my own question.

Prevent flotillas using relay. They are the only ship which has zero incentives to go in close.

A: Flotillas are the problem. They are cancerous.

B: Are you stupid? The problem is Riekan. He is OP.

C: Riekan OP? Haha! Did you notice how squadrons ruin this game?

And you ask for the nerf bat? Of course if we hit everything we will fix something.

1 hour ago, Marinealver said:

I'd rather deal with broken combos than the problems we have over here.

It is a great day to be an Armada player.

No one needs to cheat like that in Armada. Instead, flotillas everywhere.

Simply put, they were a mistake. Mistakes happen and should be addressed in some fashion, be it the person with fewer activations getting to pass or having flotillas pts count in 1/3 of the squad total.

Why did no one object last year?

People have been complaining about activation spam and bomber relay since it came out.

4 minutes ago, Mep said:

People have been complaining about activation spam and bomber relay since it came out.

Define 'it'

*sigh*

Listen, there are lots of potential issues with flotillas. Few to none of those issues presented themselves in the final game here, and likely few to none in the games deciding the top levels. I can say from direct experience playing against this list archetype that flotillas have very little to do with the way it plays. If the meta

If Flotillas have an issue, it's more to do with their core purpose and the broader game meta. That purpose is to provide additional activations to a fleet. And the meta currently favors a much higher ship activation count than it did previously. So they're the answer to the meta that existed, and still exists in some form. Until that issue is fixed, no amount of nerfing is going to significantly reduce flotilla presence. Far better to add more flotillas that feel purposeful and encourage an involved style of play.

I do have issues with squadron spam, but my larger issue is that we have few ways to counter it without a larger, more dangerous squadron game. When I consider that Rieekan makes most or all of those squadrons immortal and this immune to the "more dangerous squadrons " response, it only adds to the issues.

Rieekan is the overwhelming difference between those issues and the results witnessed at World's. Further, Rieekan is the reason for the complete shutout of Imperial fleets from the top eight.

I am sorry if this upsets some people but the fact is we get it, some hate squadrons. We here you, you repeat it often enough on nearly every blog that you can. The fact is they are part of the game so you need to deal with it or move on. FFG is not going to curtail to the whine, they may not even like cheese. There are many examples across the Star Wars games of this. It is not going to change.

The last couple of pages have had some good suggestions and experiences shared against Rieekan lists. In my experience I have seen some of these do fairly well. Played my first game today against a flechhette torpedo raider and it can shut down squadrons fairly well as JJ mentioned.

Yep squadrons are efficient, yep relay has not helped (and I am starting to dislike it), Yep some good players have looked at how to beat them and are still looking and yep transports are everywhere. For the rebels I feel cheap hammer heads could be on the way to help chase them down and limit there life cycle.

5 minutes ago, Radaeon said:

I am sorry if this upsets some people but the fact is we get it, some hate squadrons. We here you, you repeat it often enough on nearly every blog that you can. The fact is they are part of the game so you need to deal with it or move on. FFG is not going to curtail to the whine, they may not even like cheese. There are many examples across the Star Wars games of this. It is not going to change.

The last couple of pages have had some good suggestions and experiences shared against Rieekan lists. In my experience I have seen some of these do fairly well. Played my first game today against a flechhette torpedo raider and it can shut down squadrons fairly well as JJ mentioned.

Yep squadrons are efficient, yep relay has not helped (and I am starting to dislike it), Yep some good players have looked at how to beat them and are still looking and yep transports are everywhere. For the rebels I feel cheap hammer heads could be on the way to help chase them down and limit there life cycle.

Anybody letting a Flechettes Raider hit this list is playing it terribly.

Given how long it took for the recent very poor FAQ I don't see anything changing from FFG HQ anytime soon.

So, maybe the best thing is for local communities is to put their own restrictions in place with the idea of enrichening the game, opening up peoples minds to new builds, tactics and gameplay.

Sure, some may not like that, but who really enjoys playing against the same list every meet knowing that it is a forgone conclusion?

And just to be clear I'm not just referring to this combination.

Every game has them, its called 'house rules'.

2 hours ago, Radaeon said:

The fact is they are part of the game so you need to deal with it or move on.

This is going to seem like I'm focussing in on you, but really it's just a general comment that I've wanted to say for a while.

You've hit the nail on the head, but in a way I don't think you necessarily thought of.

Squadrons, flotillas, whatever the specific issue people are having with the game right now, I would put to you that a large amount of players have done exactly what you've said - they've moved on.

A lot of it is anecdotal evidence. Key members of the community putting their hands up and saying 'Hey this isn't really my thing any more', slowed or negative player growth in areas I see, and a lack of enthusiasm for the game from a lot of those still in it.

The one actually quantifiable measure I can point to is the activity on these forums. This place a year ago used to get anywhere between a page or two of new forum threads every day, now it's barely lucky to get half a page. I bet you if you also sat there and counted post counts on threads, and number of unique posters it would also be way down.

So sure man, you're right. If FFG doesn't change things, people can deal with it or move on.

Let me know how it goes when too many people pick the second option.

1 minute ago, Captain Weather said:

The one actually quantifiable measure I can point to is the activity on these forums. This place a year ago used to get anywhere between a page or two of new forum threads every day, now it's barely lucky to get half a page. I bet you if you also sat there and counted post counts on threads, and number of unique posters it would also be way down.

Actually no. I used to be able to read every single post on the main forum and sub forum. I no longer can, and fair few others have said the same thing. Activity actually rocketed when the Corillian Conflict was released.

55 minutes ago, Ginkapo said:

Actually no. I used to be able to read every single post on the main forum and sub forum. I no longer can, and fair few others have said the same thing. Activity actually rocketed when the Corillian Conflict was released.

Indeed. In my area too; we were 4 people, now we are 6,+2 that very rarely can play. The number is still small for a 5 millions city but no store supports armada here, so the community increasing is imho important.