Ever get that feeling that a game has left you behind? I see that today. Once I felt I could take my best list out and do well with it. Now? I have no idea. I don't think I could make it in any of these strong areas.

What do you all think? How do you overcome that?

well, I feel like our current local meta is hmm... casual, to say the least. No one really runs flotilla heavy lists, no one runs (well, not many) rieekan aces lists. We're mostly playing for fun even in tournaments, and watching current world's made me realize we're not min-maxers at all!

Just now, Sybreed said:

well, I feel like our current local meta is hmm... casual, to say the least. No one really runs flotilla heavy lists, no one runs (well, not many) rieekan aces lists. We're mostly playing for fun even in tournaments, and watching current world's made me realize we're not min-maxers at all!

Same here from what I have seen. Of course I have not played against @Naboobo2000 or @shmitty in some time.

Only way to overcome it is to watch all the battle reports you can, listen to podcasts, theorize obsessively, start playing, take your lumps, and eventually get back in the swing of things.

Happens to me a couple times a year.

2 hours ago, Lyraeus said:

Ever get that feeling that a game has left you behind? I see that today. Once I felt I could take my best list out and do well with it. Now? I have no idea. I don't think I could make it in any of these strong areas.

What do you all think? How do you overcome that?

That happened to me with X-Wing. Work and life got busy, I didn't play for about 6 months, and two new waves completely changed the game.

That's one reason I hope Armada maintains a slow wave release schedule.

Not at all. I would be perfectly confident that I could beat any of those top 4 lists with my current Madine list it I flew it well. Above all I'm disappointed in the total lack of originality coming out of Worlds. I get it, everyone wants to win it all and they feel Rieekan Aces gives them the edge. But still, it's not that good. I hear one group of three intentionally showed up with the exact same list. Come on!

41 minutes ago, Truthiness said:

Not at all. I would be perfectly confident that I could beat any of those top 4 lists with my current Madine list it I flew it well. Above all I'm disappointed in the total lack of originality coming out of Worlds. I get it, everyone wants to win it all and they feel Rieekan Aces gives them the edge. But still, it's not that good. I hear one group of three intentionally showed up with the exact same list. Come on!

I'm bringing essentially the same list to the five Store Championships I can reach (probably only going to make four) but it's an anti-meta list I love and partially because I won't get enough practice to stand a chance if I change it up. Im starting to wonder if the Riemann bomber lists are the first real netlisting for Armada. There are many who found it and learned it on their own, but 30/75?

As one of the pioneers of Madine lists in the community, there's definitely something to the comment. It is a real fine art in game, however, because one mistake costs you tournament points in a big way. But yes, in the Texas meta we have one of the real pioneers of the gallant haven list and my list was theorized in an attempt to address it. Except in nearly 8 months since I started working on it, I only got one real text out of it, and I didn't even see the possible win till after he pointed it out after the game.

pick a concept. Stick with it.

and don't try to type whole posts on your phone like me. It wrecks your spellling and punctuation.

4 hours ago, Lyraeus said:

Ever get that feeling that a game has left you behind? I see that today. Once I felt I could take my best list out and do well with it. Now? I have no idea. I don't think I could make it in any of these strong areas.

What do you all think? How do you overcome that?

Water tactics- just bring something flexible and play the counter game as strongly as you can. Think on your feet, and use the small advantages in any situation to add up to a real tactical edge.

2 hours ago, Vergilius said:

As one of the pioneers of Madine lists in the community, there's definitely something to the comment. It is a real fine art in game, however, because one mistake costs you tournament points in a big way. But yes, in the Texas meta we have one of the real pioneers of the gallant haven list and my list was theorized in an attempt to address it. Except in nearly 8 months since I started working on it, I only got one real text out of it, and I didn't even see the possible win till after he pointed it out after the game.

pick a concept. Stick with it.

and don't try to type whole posts on your phone like me. It wrecks your spellling and punctuation.

My pioneer has never taken off in the community. My list set up is like yours though. A mistake will cost you.

2 hours ago, Grey Mage said:

Water tactics- just bring something flexible and play the counter game as strongly as you can. Think on your feet, and use the small advantages in any situation to add up to a real tactical edge.

That is what I play typically

Lyraeus,

I much like your basic concept. There's a good principle there.

A strategy game is a game of question and answer. I know that X list is out there, how am I going to answer it? For me, this comes naturally from a chess mindset, where when you're contemplating a move, you're also contemplating the potential responses that your opponent can make to it. Usually there are 3-4 plausible responses. Those plausible responses are the other lists that are represented in the meta, specifically your local meta, but at an event as big as Worlds, that means contemplating the national meta.

I'm generally starting with "my concept." Here's what I want to do. I try to leave that concept general and vague so that there's flexibility for me to work different solutions around it. So if I start with Madine and a Liberty, I have to start looking at how to answer different things that might appear in my games. The more specific I make that concept (e.g. let's add Mon Karren, and 2 MC30s), the more difficult it becomes to weave a good answer to everything that is in the meta. So take Dodonna the Oppressor. The core of your idea is really Dodonna, Scout Frigates, and Intel Officer. It really doesn't have to be any more than that. Maybe it shouldn't be any more than that. Maybe it doesn't even have to be Dodonna. After all, I played a Mothma variant of your list, basically. MC30s are still solid.

Good ideas are generally good ideas, and with some ingenuity, you can work around it to match up. The hardest part is usually letting go of some of those basic ideas we all cherish about what a list is supposed to be. In my own list, letting go of Salvation when I really wanted him to work was a tough blow, but I really needed the points. I let go of some tough upgrades that I had an affection for over the past few months. Sometimes, you learn that what you thought was necessary, you can really live without.

If you like Dodonna the Oppressor, keep modifying it and keep playing!

I am troubled for a long time now by a sinking feeling that my beloved Cr90a and Admo swarm with Dodonna wont stand any chance. Id have to dilute firepower so much just to keep up with activations.

But not railing against development, though, it is what it is. I am no fan of the overusage of flotillas (and I use them myself in competition) and no fan of the ever growing squad centricity, but I dont cry out for nerfs and changes.

And Truthiness speaks, well, the truth when he bemoans the lack of originality. But I cant and wont blame players that they do what they think gives them the best chances in the environment that FFG creates.

Luckily they have demonstrated they have no compunctions about changing things if they aren't happy.

I will tell you a secret:

The stream is not stronger.

No, no, no. Quicker, easier, more seductive.

But not stronger. Our path is for heroes, not for officers pursuing a promotion.

I've only ever had this problem with Magic: The Gathering, and that was mainly because a combination of working during Friday Night Magic and disinterest in the card pool made me lose interest in Standard. I still play, but I only play a format called "Commander" that rarely changes. New cards improve or create new decks, but the list of cards I can use only gets bigger. It probably helps that we're pretty casual about Armada. Triple VSDs can pose a significant threat most days, as long as you have Jerjerrod or move cleverly.

*For reference, Standard uses roughly the last two years worth of cards released so that it's reasonable for a new player to get into. It rotates when new sets of cards come out, knocking out the oldest set and replacing it with the new one. Commander doesn't rotate, it just has a list of banned cards that rarely changes. Keeping up with format rotations is something I really don't miss.

2 minutes ago, Hockeyzombie said:

I've only ever had this problem with Magic: The Gathering, and that was mainly because a combination of working during Friday Night Magic and disinterest in the card pool made me lose interest in Standard. I still play, but I only play a format called "Commander" that rarely changes. New cards improve or create new decks, but the list of cards I can use only gets bigger. It probably helps that we're pretty casual about Armada. Triple VSDs can pose a significant threat most days, as long as you have Jerjerrod or move cleverly.

*For reference, Standard uses roughly the last two years worth of cards released so that it's reasonable for a new player to get into. It rotates when new sets of cards come out, knocking out the oldest set and replacing it with the new one. Commander doesn't rotate, it just has a list of banned cards that rarely changes. Keeping up with format rotations is something I really don't miss.

100% agree with this. Commander is such a fun format to play and my cards are actually worth something. I never had any desire to spend hundreds of dollars every few months to stay competitive.

In regards to the OP, I feel Star Craft 2 got way ahead of me. I played WoL for a long time and then HotS dropped and I went to college. I didn't have time to play anymore. Once LotV came out, I tried multiplayer again. I had no freakin clue what I was doing. There were new units and builds and I kept losing. It sucked cuz I really enjoyed Star Craft but I don't even bother getting on anymore.

I don't feel like that either. Granted the wordbeater list is different now, but who wants to beat the world? it's an US-exclusive overhyped event anyway and I prefer to run lists that are more fun to fly than are die-hard effective against anything but it's a suffering to play (I'm looking at you Rieekan's CR90Bs!).

8 hours ago, Vergilius said:

*snips the great info for reading and post length issues*

Some value locations I value Flexibility. In fact I have gotten into several discussions with people over Flexibility vs planned play. For me the former is far more important

3 hours ago, Hockeyzombie said:

I've only ever had this problem with Magic: The Gathering, and that was mainly because a combination of working during Friday Night Magic and disinterest in the card pool made me lose interest in Standard. I still play, but I only play a format called "Commander" that rarely changes. New cards improve or create new decks, but the list of cards I can use only gets bigger. It probably helps that we're pretty casual about Armada. Triple VSDs can pose a significant threat most days, as long as you have Jerjerrod or move cleverly.

*For reference, Standard uses roughly the last two years worth of cards released so that it's reasonable for a new player to get into. It rotates when new sets of cards come out, knocking out the oldest set and replacing it with the new one. Commander doesn't rotate, it just has a list of banned cards that rarely changes. Keeping up with format rotations is something I really don't miss.

3 hours ago, Undeadguy said:

100% agree with this. Commander is such a fun format to play and my cards are actually worth something. I never had any desire to spend hundreds of dollars every few months to stay competitive.

In regards to the OP, I feel Star Craft 2 got way ahead of me. I played WoL for a long time and then HotS dropped and I went to college. I didn't have time to play anymore. Once LotV came out, I tried multiplayer again. I had no freakin clue what I was doing. There were new units and builds and I kept losing. It sucked cuz I really enjoyed Star Craft but I don't even bother getting on anymore.

I played EDH as well. It is my favorite format. Until it got too competitive and an existence of how much money you had in it. Now I just don't have the funds or time to spend on that.

16 hours ago, Lyraeus said:

Ever get that feeling that a game has left you behind? I see that today. Once I felt I could take my best list out and do well with it. Now? I have no idea. I don't think I could make it in any of these strong areas.

What do you all think? How do you overcome that?

I've been living in this universe for at least the past half year, or howeever else as long as Mythics has been taking this list. Once every other week when I finally had a chance to play Armada, I'd put together a try, fly it, and get tabled by this list. I'm amazed I've stayed with the game this long given how many times I've seen B-Wing Yavaris apocalypse swarm deflate my hope and destroy any attempt to overcome it by means other than meta-gaming and choosing to draw. I'm happy at least other players are now seeing and can't deny the power of the list I've been forced to face for many weeks, and maybe we can all come up with a solution that is fun to play along with being competitively functional.

18 minutes ago, Norsehound said:

I've been living in this universe for at least the past half year, or howeever else as long as Mythics has been taking this list. Once every other week when I finally had a chance to play Armada, I'd put together a try, fly it, and get tabled by this list. I'm amazed I've stayed with the game this long given how many times I've seen B-Wing Yavaris apocalypse swarm deflate my hope and destroy any attempt to overcome it by means other than meta-gaming and choosing to draw. I'm happy at least other players are now seeing and can't deny the power of the list I've been forced to face for many weeks, and maybe we can all come up with a solution that is fun to play along with being competitively functional.

Breathe, breathe try something new. Focus on that list. I think I will be tabled a lot as well

Honest question, do you guys' communities just always bring their hardcore lists to weekly Armada?

I'm all for iron sharpening iron, but we give that a rest in our community pretty often. Some weeks the name of the game is just fun ideas, not competitiveness.

7 minutes ago, WuFame said:

Honest question, do you guys' communities just always bring their hardcore lists to weekly Armada?

I'm all for iron sharpening iron, but we give that a rest in our community pretty often. Some weeks the name of the game is just fun ideas, not competitiveness.

Not mine but I can play anything as such

4 minutes ago, WuFame said:

Honest question, do you guys' communities just always bring their hardcore lists to weekly Armada?

I'm all for iron sharpening iron, but we give that a rest in our community pretty often. Some weeks the name of the game is just fun ideas, not competitiveness.

I have a rule. If a list wins a tournament, it goes on the shelf for a while. I'll never understand flying the same thing exclusively for an entire wave. That would get boring as hell for me, not to mention the people I play against.

Outside of competition season our community mainly runs special rules and low-point events. Keeps things fresh and since we rarely have weekend play nights it makes sure everyone gets to bed at a reasonable hour.