Just now, VanorDM said:

No, I'll just continue to play 1st edition, but I won't buy anything new. I'm not going to effectively throw my collection in the trash and then buy everything again. If I can buy just a conversion kit that lets me update everything for a reasonable price then I'd do that.

When Malifaux or Warmachine went to a new edition, people didn't have to spend $100's if not $1000's to upgrade their stuff.

If they go to a new editon, there are a couple of ways to do it:

1) Just new cards. Probably divided by faction (Buy Empire to update all your Imperial ships! Buy Rebels to update your Alliance ships!) probably with separate upgrade packs, but upgrades might also be included, with different upgrades in each faction pack to 'encourage' you to trade with friends... Maybe $15 per faction, with $10 upgrade packs?

2) New cards and dials - probably not for all the ships, but Wave 1-3 ships had horrendous dials compared to later ships. Maybe $20-30 or so, but I think that this is the least likely option.

3) A Most Wanted style update, where you'd get a new ship and all the cards you need for a single faction. Probably in the $30 for a small ship, and could be as much as $50 for a large ship.

I can understand getting peeved, but if they do a 2.0 you might want to hold off on the salt til you see if it's better or not.

I mean... don't you WANT TIE Interceptors and B-Wings to be good? Like, good enough to go against a Jumpmaster or Fenn Rau?

As far as not needing to spend a lot of money to upgrade stuff for WM and Malifaux... that depended. A lot of models were absolutely RUINED in the latest Warmachine transition - some people have $200 or MORE worth of fully painted models sitting on their shelves because 2e was focused on infantry, and 3e is focused on the big stompy robots. People bought the infantry for 2e, and now it's just useless metal. For Malifaux, the problem is that the new miniatures were simply beautiful compared to the old ones - so you wanted to update just for the aesthetic.

Buying all new ships - I'm out.

Buying a kit, wont be so bad. Maybe they can sell a rebel kit, Imperial kit, and scum kit for $39.99 each to convert all ships in the faction if it requires dials, cards, and maybe new dice system. That way you can slowly convert all ships, but fly your favorite faction in the meantime for just $40. That wouldn't be so bad.

No offense but a X-wing 2.0 could be benefic for the game :

A reanimation of the rules of the game becomes more and more necessary to the point that every new wave we have an FAQ.

Of course I also invested a lot in this game but FFG also needs to sell like any miniatures game company. If this were to happen I would change my way of buying too.

It is also possible to make a conversion pack for some ships like the x-wing or the tie fighter. But if we have a version 2.0 it is also in the interest of FFG to sell miniatures too.

Version 1.0 will still live if the community is strong and I think it is quite possible to have two cohesive versions. (look warhammer for example)

And anyway since it's Star Wars it will be enough to make sell to new players who is looking for a simple and effective figurine game in Star wars Universe.

My two cents

5 minutes ago, iamfanboy said:

As far as not needing to spend a lot of money to upgrade stuff for WM and Malifaux... that depended. A lot of models were absolutely RUINED in the latest Warmachine transition - some people have $200 or MORE worth of fully painted models sitting on their shelves because 2e was focused on infantry, and 3e is focused on the big stompy robots. People bought the infantry for 2e, and now it's just useless metal. For Malifaux, the problem is that the new miniatures were simply beautiful compared to the old ones - so you wanted to update just for the aesthetic.

Although, for what its worth, its becoming quite apparent that the real design of the new Warmachine is that stompy robots are the "core" of the game and everything else is designed for sub factions. A lot of those useless units are coming back with a vengeance as their respective theme forces are released. It's an interesting route I'm becoming more and more fond of as the pieces finally fall into place.

It's actually a good example of how edition changes can reshape a game into something that better accommodates the growth of the game. It's unfortunately also a good example of how those changes can be rough on players.

Would be interested in a new rule set. Would not be interested in purchasing new models.

Might buy models if the resculpts were exquisite.

Would buy 2.0 and throw all my collection into the bin if it meant that T-65 X wings actually kicked ass like we see them do in movies and books. ?

If I could use my existing ships and update everything else for a reasonable price then sure. Of course it should be an improvement to the game, I would hope.

10 minutes ago, iamfanboy said:

If they go to a new editon, there are a couple of ways to do it:

1) Just new cards. Probably divided by faction (Buy Empire to update all your Imperial ships! Buy Rebels to update your Alliance ships!) probably with separate upgrade packs, but upgrades might also be included, with different upgrades in each faction pack to 'encourage' you to trade with friends... Maybe $15 per faction, with $10 upgrade packs?

2) New cards and dials - probably not for all the ships, but Wave 1-3 ships had horrendous dials compared to later ships. Maybe $20-30 or so, but I think that this is the least likely option.

3) A Most Wanted style update, where you'd get a new ship and all the cards you need for a single faction. Probably in the $30 for a small ship, and could be as much as $50 for a large ship.

I can understand getting peeved, but if they do a 2.0 you might want to hold off on the salt til you see if it's better or not.

I mean... don't you WANT TIE Interceptors and B-Wings to be good? Like, good enough to go against a Jumpmaster or Fenn Rau?

As far as not needing to spend a lot of money to upgrade stuff for WM and Malifaux... that depended. A lot of models were absolutely RUINED in the latest Warmachine transition - some people have $200 or MORE worth of fully painted models sitting on their shelves because 2e was focused on infantry, and 3e is focused on the big stompy robots. People bought the infantry for 2e, and now it's just useless metal. For Malifaux, the problem is that the new miniatures were simply beautiful compared to the old ones - so you wanted to update just for the aesthetic.

Update packs would be a pain in the neck to manage due to varying numbers of duplicates. I have lots of X-, Y-, A-, and B-Wings, but only one each of the K-Wing and E-Wing.

The only rule I can envision FFG changing is related to turrets, to bring them back to being arc-locked.

I also find it hilarious that we're already back to the "Don't you want Interceptors to be good?" considering that Soontir and Carnor were mainstays until Sabine came along.

At this point, I don't think people understand just how big, massive, and potentially expensive for FFG to undertake.

First of all, there is the initial work on redesigning the rules. As L5R has shown, FFG likes to give them time, so probably a year. But now you get into the tricky part. Because as most people have said, they are out if they can't use their old ships. So, not only do you have to work on the base rules, you now have to redesign and playtest ALL ELEVEN WAVES ready for release. Seriously, a year is being generous for them to get it out in time.

But now we get to the kicker. People are seriously expecting FFG to give up on production of their biggest seller for 6-12 months? I mean, come on.

And now, we get to the actual new game that people seriously expect not to have to buy the re-released ships. I mean, we know FFG's sales model at this point. There will be upgrades not available in the conversion kits. Which means you have rebuy ships you already own. And, as Descent 2nd has shown, that the conversions will not necessarily be viable for some time as development of the new game system evolves.

Frankly, X-wing is too big for a 2nd edition, thanks to their sales model. Besides, there are rather obvious signs of when a new edition comes out.

18 minutes ago, Arkanta974 said:

No offense but a X-wing 2.0 could be benefic for the game :

A reanimation of the rules of the game becomes more and more necessary to the point that every new wave we have an FAQ.

Counterpoint: a new version of X-Wing will only end up requiring a new FAQ anyway. An FAQ was needed for Night Beast, and he came in the very first Core Set.

1 hour ago, DailyRich said:

A second edition that required me to buy new ships would be a second edition I would not be playing. Simple as that. I've got too much invested in the game at this point to start over again.

This.

I would argue that they update game structure, win conditions, maybe even add another dice type with wave 14. There are lots of solutions besides a 2.0. A 2.0 would create a schism. I think they should avoid at all costs.

A card only errata pack to update the existing game to version 2.0?

I'd be all over that.

A complete restart and have to buy everything all over again?

FFG would never get another penny from me. Ever.

17 minutes ago, Sithborg said:

Frankly, X-wing is too big for a 2nd edition, thanks to their sales model. Besides, there are rather obvious signs of when a new edition comes out.

I don't agree with this at all. Warhammer 40k is a much, much, much bigger game and it's in the process of changing over to its 8th edition this summer. I'm not advocating an edition change at this point, but it can absolutely be done.

First of all, you don't have to halt all development while the new edition is in the design/playing-testing process. You can do parallel development as long as the different development teams are in communication with each other.

Often times releases near the end of edition are clearly designed with the next edition and might be awkwardly under/over powered for a bit before the transition is implemented.

As long as an edition change isn't just dropped in the community's lap, I think it could be done well. Just be honest and up-front about why and how the edition is changing. Some people will quit in a fit of knee-jerkery, but you can't worry about that. People quit for all sorts of reasons all the time. Obviously you don't want to push anyone out, but letting the game get stale for fear of reactions doesn't help anyone either.

The release models of the games makes the two games very, very different.

A lot of things go thru my mind after a tough loss (I'm hereby renamed this thread "Tough Loss Thread 6.0"): Should I have boosted that one time? Should I have Target-Locked during reset instead of Evade since nobody K-Turned anyway? Should I stop second-guessing everything?

Nope, ran thru my short list and "Change the entire base ruleset" NEVER enters my mind after a tough loss.

1 hour ago, devotedknight said:

This post was prompted by a discussion at the local gaming store. There are a few members who think that FFG needs to fix several major flaws in the game . as well as update many of the cards.

What is the Community's Opinion?

Which are? (out of curiosity).

8 minutes ago, Sekac said:

I don't agree with this at all. Warhammer 40k is a much, much, much bigger game and it's in the process of changing over to its 8th edition this summer. I'm not advocating an edition change at this point, but it can absolutely be done.

First of all, you don't have to halt all development while the new edition is in the design/playing-testing process. You can do parallel development as long as the different development teams are in communication with each other.

Often times releases near the end of edition are clearly designed with the next edition and might be awkwardly under/over powered for a bit before the transition is implemented.

As long as an edition change isn't just dropped in the community's lap, I think it could be done well. Just be honest and up-front about why and how the edition is changing. Some people will quit in a fit of knee-jerkery, but you can't worry about that. People quit for all sorts of reasons all the time. Obviously you don't want to push anyone out, but letting the game get stale for fear of reactions doesn't help anyone either.

You aren't wrong, but consider the actual reason GW cycle all their games roughly every 5 years.... kerching... Increasing profit is the ONLY reason they do it, or god love us we'd still be at Rogue Trader and I'd still have access to Vortex grenades.. If they released a new edition to correct issues or perceived issues with the current rule set it would be like them admitting they were wrong... something I've never seen GW do in 30 years in gaming.

17 minutes ago, PhantomFO said:

Counterpoint: a new version of X-Wing will only end up requiring a new FAQ anyway. An FAQ was needed for Night Beast, and he came in the very first Core Set.

Yes and No ! FFG now know what to do if they restart their game. A faq could coming too, but less than we have actually.

Look Dark Curse : Before we can't target him with a secondary weapon who need focus tokens, people have complain and now we can use it thank to a change of rules with a another consequences for others ship/combo.

Or Valen Rudor : Before we can perform free action between a "twice attack" now if after the two attack thanks to a modifications about the rules. And I remember Faq was very fast for him.

Better to have a clear and precise new version (with a faq if necessary) than to modify the rules on each occassion to solve temporarily the problem.

I would probably not buy a 2.0, and it's not needed. FAQ and errata are a normal part of gaming.

1 hour ago, Vargas79 said:

X-wing 2nd edition would be the easiest way to fix the JM5K

Really??? So an entire new edition is easier than FAQing 1 points cost - that's the easiest possible fix. Not an entire new game.

Question. How many "new" cards in each set? For the people that have more than one ship of each release this can get very expensive. With 7 Zs how many packs would I need to buy? The same applies to Ties, X-wings, T-70s etc. If I need to buy 3or 4 of each Ver 2.0 that's going to get expensive fast. I may have to find a new game or stick with old.

I don't know that we're quite there yet but we are certainly getting close enough. Here are my thoughts:

Has to be done via update kit

Update all old cards with new text.

Add 1 different color dice for attack and defense (elite dice) that are available to "advanced" ships out of the box and all via upgrade OR Increase red and green dice to increase granularity and differentiation between ships OR separate accuracy and damage.

Update dials Waves 1-4

Do away with MANY pilots and upgrades or significantly recost them.

16 minutes ago, boomaster said:

If they released a new edition to correct issues or perceived issues with the current rule set it would be like them admitting they were wrong... something I've never seen GW do in 30 years in gaming

What we've done is reexamine every aspect of the game, and made plenty of improvements, many based on the gaming community's feedback and suggestions.

https://warhammer40000.gw-hub.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2017/04/New-Edition-of-40K-FAQ.pdf

Sounds pretty "mea culpa" to me as they are making changes based on the community feedback of their game. Games Workshop has been changing over the last few years, its not the same like it was back in 1st or 2nd Ed.

Well here are a few of my thought after reading everyone's post.

1. X-wing may have a 2nd edition if it proves to be popular enough, however that is not in the foreseeable future and there probably is no plans for such. Not before Episode 9 is out which is for sure since X-wing has many source material to chose from.
2. It could be beneficial but it could also be disastrous. If a 2nd edition comes out and it invalidates a lot of the models you would have an exodus of players. Sure some people will migrate over to 2.0 but many will not.
3. One of the worse thing you can do to a living game is make it just like another game. So the double dials of Runescape for X-wing, just get that idea out of your head . I used to think that it would maybe a good idea for Armada but even then how do you balance it with the command dial system? Nope is the best answer to that. The movement dial provides enough hidden information.

Still the overall question is what difference would a 2.0 game be. Simply releasing another core set wouldn't exactly be 2.0. I am surprised to see so many people calling for it. X-wing is fine as is IMHO and I don't see why people would want it to be overhauled. However this is nothing new with living games as it changes sometimes it changes in ways that many players don't like. Any one to leave now would be fooling themselves to think that they would be the first ones to leave and even more so that it would mark the end of X-wing just like 40K (which didn't end when I or many others left).

Still if 2.0 is done it won't be the end of X-wing, yes end of 1st edition but 2.0 didn't end Arkham or GoT even though that invalidated everyone's set. The only living game that was abruptly ended was Conquest but that was not due to the player base but contractual separation. For 2.0 I would like to see how some of the ships with the new maneuvers be redone (such as a TIE Interceptor with S-loop) also maybe some new actions such as S-foils for X-wings. Also for those that are calling for the Falcon to go to a mobile firing arc can just stop posting it had 2 turrets, not one , so it can fire in all directions. If it did go to Mobile firing arcs then it would have to have 2 attacks and still shoot out of arc.

21 minutes ago, ThalanirIII said:

Really??? So an entire new edition is easier than FAQing 1 points cost - that's the easiest possible fix. Not an entire new game.

Calm down, it was a joke.

While I think that a second edition is likely, the lessons learned from game design for armada, Imperial Assault, and so on, could make for a great revamp.

I also think that FFG is savvy enough to not alienate the target market by making the 2.0 game render the old ships obsolete. Truly an x-wing 2.0 upgrade kit, whether new dice, stickers to update current cards, and brand new rule cards would be a great idea. Heck, call it x-wing advanced or something.

Honestly adding in a couple new die types increases the design possibilities.