I think discarding the card still counts as playing it.

So if you have 2 cards in your hand, you can play Smuggling, discard the other card, and then gain 2 resources.

Also, the discard cost is part of playing the card, so the discard happens simultaneously to playing the card, whereas ORS triggers "after" playing the card.

10 minutes ago, Kieransi said:

I think discarding the card still counts as playing it.

So if you have 2 cards in your hand, you can play Smuggling, discard the other card, and then gain 2 resources.

Also, the discard cost is part of playing the card, so the discard happens simultaneously to playing the card, whereas ORS triggers "after" playing the card.

Discarding IS NOT playing a card.

20 minutes ago, gokubb said:

I'm curious as to the timing on Outer Rim smuggler:

When you play a card that also has a cost associated with it of discarding a card from hand, like Smuggling:

Does the cost of the discard for Smuggling occur before or after you play it? If before, you would trigger Outer Rim Smuggler, since Smuggling would then technically be the last card in your hand. If after, then when you played Smuggling, the card you plan to discard for it would still be in your hand, not triggering Outer Rim Smuggler's ability. Anyone run into this, or is there a ruling around paying additional costs for cards that clarifies the timing here?

Being the ORS's triggered effect an after effect, you add it to the queud after resolving the previous action.

The tricky thing is that discarding a card for Smuggling is not a cost but an effect of the card too ..

My guess is: if you they don't specify on the next FAQ exactly when ORS's after effect is checked, with the current ruleset you wouldn't gain the resource

33 minutes ago, blackholexan said:

Discarding IS NOT playing a card.

Being the ORS's triggered effect an after effect, you add it to the queud after resolving the previous action.

The tricky thing is that discarding a card for Smuggling is not a cost but an effect of the card too ..

My guess is: if you they don't specify on the next FAQ exactly when ORS's after effect is checked, with the current ruleset you wouldn't gain the resource

Well, an FAQ would probably also decide that smuggling works here, if for no other reason because thematically it would be really dumb if an "Outer Rim Smuggler" couldn't synergize with "Smuggling"...

That's exactly what I thought. They should synergize and it's a dumb oversight if they do not.

But, as I read it and as rules are right now, I agree that the Smuggling probably doesn't trigger ORS in this case.

2 minutes ago, gokubb said:

That's exactly what I thought. They should synergize and it's a dumb oversight if they do not.

But, as I read it and as rules are right now, I agree that the Smuggling probably doesn't trigger ORS in this case.

I agree fully. @blackholexan has most likely made a correct assessment of the rules here, as they currently stand, but ORS thematically should work. It's kinda odd that he doesn't say "after you play or discard the last card from your hand"...

He's still pretty good with Smuggling - you get rid of more cards, and get his resource quicker. I guess you just have to make sure not to play Smuggling last.

Odd question - if Smuggling is your last card, can you still play it, discard no cards, gain no resources, but then gain 1 resource from ORS' ability?

I wouldn't think so. The discard a card is connected by AND with 'Spot a Yellow character'. Makes me think it's a condition of playing the card.

Unless spotting isn't a condition to play the card, but instead a condition to get the card's effect.

49 minutes ago, gokubb said:

I wouldn't think so. The discard a card is connected by AND with 'Spot a Yellow character'. Makes me think it's a condition of playing the card.

Unless spotting isn't a condition to play the card, but instead a condition to get the card's effect.

Spotting is not a play restriction. If you can't spot the right character the effect does nothing.

Play Smuggling - it enters limbo. (This is where Smuggler would trigger if Smuggling was the last card in your hand)

Resolve the effect of Smuggling: Spot a yellow character and discard a card, to gain a resource.

Resolve Smuggler if he triggered.

I don't believe discarding the last card in your hand counts to trigger Smuggler, doesn't look like these will synergize.

1 hour ago, netherspirit1982 said:

Play Smuggling - it enters limbo. (This is where Smuggler would trigger if Smuggling was the last card in your hand)

Resolve the effect of Smuggling: Spot a yellow character and discard a card, to gain a resource.

Resolve Smuggler if he triggered.

I don't believe discarding the last card in your hand counts to trigger Smuggler, doesn't look like these will synergize.

This.

We should probably make a concerted effort to eliminate the whole 'thematic' mindset as a means of rules interpretation, because flavor and game balance are often going to be mutually exclusive with a setting as well defined as Star Wars.

24 minutes ago, WonderWAAAGH said:

We should probably make a concerted effort to eliminate the whole 'thematic' mindset as a means of rules interpretation, because flavor and game balance are often going to be mutually exclusive with a setting as well defined as Star Wars.

You're 1000% right, but there's a 0% chance of that happening unfortunately.

1 hour ago, WonderWAAAGH said:

We should probably make a concerted effort to eliminate the whole 'thematic' mindset as a means of rules interpretation, because flavor and game balance are often going to be mutually exclusive with a setting as well defined as Star Wars.

FFG must agree with you - ensuring players can't combine characters who make sense together, like Luke and Obi Wan.

If ORS read "no cards in hand" it wouldn't be ambiguous.

So you play smuggling, spot a yellow character, discard a card then gain one resources. The event fully resolves with no cards in hand. So the timing of the After ability happens when the event is fully resolved. There is no indication of the timing of the trigger. Does play mean the initiation or the resolution? Mostly likely as other have pointed out, it is the initiation.

Odd thing here, if Smuggling was the last card in your hand and you played it, it would have no effect, i.e. no resource, since you couldn't discard and would be considered a pass action. However it does change the game state because of ORS, so it in effect gives the one resource without the need to have the extra card to discard.

So yes, they do work together. You'll get one resource from playing it.

8 hours ago, Stu35 said:

FFG must agree with you - ensuring players can't combine characters who make sense together, like Luke and Obi Wan.

Yeah it's so odd you can't pair Episode 6 Luke with Episode 4 Obi...

What a natural pairing that is, way more so then Han/Rey, Han/Leia, Han/Chewie, Emp/Guard, Baze/Chirrut, Dooku/Assaj.

Because there is no way they release any more Luke character cards. So there is no way we will ever see a 14 or less point Farmboy Luke.

They actually made Han and Chewie able to be played together with one being elite. Also, Lukas has said he starts with the character and figures out what thematic ability that character would have. It isn't game play driven necessarily.

I don't know what an outer rim smuggler is though. Some random dude never in the movies or else where. Not someone to get overly thematic about.

10 hours ago, Stu35 said:

FFG must agree with you - ensuring players can't combine characters who make sense together, like Luke and Obi Wan.

Jedi Knight Luke and Hermit Obiwan don't make sense together time line wise.

Young luke would or ghost obi

1 hour ago, Stranglebat said:

Jedi Knight Luke and Hermit Obiwan don't make sense together time line wise.

Young luke would or ghost obi

Agreed.

And the fact that you cannot combine ObiWan e Luke from different moment of the trilogy is, indeed, thematic.

Furthermore Jedi Knight is not the Last Jedi ( pun intended :P) Luke you will see in this game, I guess

Pedantic wankers. Hows this one then - Darth Vader working best with his mate the Tusken Raider.

I can guarantee you all right now that Young Luke won't pair well with Obi Wan either - there'll be a much better combo.

My point is that thematics have very little to do with gameplay in this game.

Sometimes i forget just how pernickety some bellwhackers are...

53 minutes ago, Stu35 said:

Pedantic wankers. Hows this one then - Darth Vader working best with his mate the Tusken Raider.

I can guarantee you all right now that Young Luke won't pair well with Obi Wan either - there'll be a much better combo.

My point is that thematics have very little to do with gameplay in this game.

Sometimes i forget just how pernickety some bellwhackers are...

Any specific reason to be this harsh / rude?

The game has some nice (intended, I bet) and thematic character combination (Dooku and his apprentice Asajj for example).

Obviously balance and gameplay superseed theme in game design but there a few examples (even on dice faces characters/upgrades got) where they found a good compromise imho

16 minutes ago, blackholexan said:

Any specific reason to be this harsh / rude?

Personal sense of humour. Tongue was in cheek for it.

1 minute ago, Stu35 said:

Personal sense of humour. Tongue was in cheek for it.

I think there is no way to see that on a forum, lol

7 hours ago, blackholexan said:

I think there is no way to see that on a forum, lol

Actually there is but we are all glad he didn't take a pic.