Multi-Turn Action Combos are Non-Interactive, and that's why they should be mitigated, not enhanced.

Do I think Maz and Force Speed and Fast Hands are going to break the game completely? No

Do I think these things will make the game less interactive and less fun? Yes

Inter-activeness is why pvp games are great, taking that element away waters them down and makes them bad.

That's it. I know most people will agree, I just hope FFG reads this and figures a way to slow the game DOWN, not speed it up.

Don't worry too much about it. I actually think that Force Speed and Fast Hands are fine for the game, as they give these "speedy" options to characters outside of just Jango and Rey. That said, they're not especially powerful (although they have their spots), and players who invest too much in speed are going to be punished.

There's a sweet spot for non-interactive "speed" type plays, where they let you recognize a window for resolving actions that ends up yielding you extra value over your opponent. The catch is, if you have a Tactical Mastery when you spot one of those windows, you're doing great, but if you're holding 3 Tactical Mastery type cards when you spot that window, it just means that you have 2 dead cards in hand, and in all other instances where that window hasn't popped up yet, you're really look down at 3 dead cards. The more types of effect like this that make it into the game, the more people are going to realize that you only really want a light dusting of them at most.

Where have I heard this before.....?

Oh yea!

Sith Holocron.

Yup. Sky is falling.

This isn't anything like the Sith Holocron concerns. Action advantage already exists. There's a reason Jango and Rey decks are top tier. Rey, especially, is also not very fun to play against. To say that Hit and Run, Tactical Mastery, Rey, Jango, All In, Force Strike and all the rest of the action accelerators aren't meta defining would be wrong. In SoR, they've gone and printed a whole lot more. Sky isn't falling, they've just decided to print cards that take away the back and forth decision making, which to many, creates a negative play experience. FFG themselves have already lamented the fact that they printed so many of these effects.

Yeah its all getting a bit ridiculous, I watched a TTS game on YouTube the other day (NooBrainer playing Recolytes) where the guy took 8 actions in a row!! Admittedly there were 2 Force Speed resolutions in there but he literally played almost his whole turn without the other player actually getting an action. At the end he had all of his Rey dice and all of his Acolyte Dice in pool ready to resolve along with a vibroknife and something else I think.

I was really hoping that thy would pull back on the super action economy, but with cards like Maz, Fast Hands and force speed giving consistent action efficiency every turn the game is looking a vastly different game than it was when released.

Exactly. Thats why i wrote Lukas about it a couple of weeks ago. Of course no answer from him, but i just wanted to express my concerns.

Why even have a back and forth system if someone can take 7-8 actions in a row.

There should be a rule of three. So you cant stack more than 3 actions in a row.

Just like Sith Holocron, something must be given up to attempt to gain the advantage later. SoR has also introduced new ways to get rid of upgrades and support cards.

Again, the sky is not falling. That perfect dream setup where you get 8 or 9 turns in a row is not going to be as easy to come by as you're dreaming it to be. Some of us have even been playing with these cards on simulator programs....

I don't think its too out of hand yet...

To double up force speed youre giving up 2 upgrade slots, slots that could be doing damage. Fast hands also has this issue.

Jango and Rey are a pain in the arse, and there's a reason they're in so many of the top end decks... those are something of a concern, but they're not in every deck.

All in/its a trap/tactical mastery/etc. Are generally speaking, a twice a game thing - powerful but not utterly broken.

Personally I'm far more concerned by Planetary Uprising.

Meh, we'll see.

15 hours ago, Mace Windu said:

Yeah its all getting a bit ridiculous, I watched a TTS game on YouTube the other day (NooBrainer playing Recolytes) where the guy took 8 actions in a row!! Admittedly there were 2 Force Speed resolutions in there but he literally played almost his whole turn without the other player actually getting an action. At the end he had all of his Rey dice and all of his Acolyte Dice in pool ready to resolve along with a vibroknife and something else I think.

I was really hoping that thy would pull back on the super action economy, but with cards like Maz, Fast Hands and force speed giving consistent action efficiency every turn the game is looking a vastly different game than it was when released.

8 actions and he didn't resolve any dice? what .. ????

8 actions sounds impressive, but you need to get tangible advantage or it actually becomes a disadvantage. If you don't get something good out of it you are almost finished for the round having accomplished little and ceded the rest of the round to your opponent, possibly with little interference from you.

I too believe that player interaction is one of the best features of the game. However, it has not been my experience that stacking actions eliminates player interaction. In my opinion it slightly reduces it and barely changes the feel of the game. Who knows, maybe the new set will change my mind, but at the moment it seems unlikely.

I'm concerned with the trend of SoR, but also going to see how it plays out. Force Speed looked terrible undercosted, but seeing it in play it's not as bad as it first appeared...I'd not thought about how taking one of 3 upgrade slots mitigates it, and aside from the special, the dice alone doesn't do much. So stacking 2 actions, while good, isn't OP.

Now, late game, when you roll specials on your Light Saber and Force Throw and Force Speed, you're setting up one killer turn. But that's what the game is built on.

What concerns me maybe more is the combination of more consistent dice with extra action abilities. If you need to spend one of those extra actions on a re-roll, there's mitigation. When your dice are coming up how you want them on your main roll, things could get out of hand.

Again, we'll know more in a few more weeks as SoR hits the shelves.

Stuff like playing out ROUND worth of turns before your opponent takes 1 turn already happens in awakenings. If you didn't have a problem with it before you shouldn't now either.

28 minutes ago, krzykoopa said:

Stuff like playing out ROUND worth of turns before your opponent takes 1 turn already happens in awakenings. If you didn't have a problem with it before you shouldn't now either.

Yeah, it's annoying but it's also a dice game, so they could roll crap and then have nothing to do with all their actions, or they have to waste them rerolling.

I played against a Jango Veers player and he ended up rolling in Jango on my turn, Jango and Veers were both pretty decked out by then, he played both Tactical Mastery copies and an unpredictible and couldn't do any damage.

Another recent game against Han/Rey he had 2 Force Speeds and ambush shenanigans on Rey and couldn't manage to roll anything over the course of about 6 or 7 actions, then the next turn I killed Rey. Bye Bye Force Speeds.

Yes, taking all those actions against you is annoying and sometimes it's not fun. It all depends on how meaningful all those extra actions were. If they exhaust and resolve everything but don't kill you and run out of stuff to do, you get to the same thing right back with them passing all the time.

1 hour ago, netherspirit1982 said:

Yeah, it's annoying but it's also a dice game, so they could roll crap and then have nothing to do with all their actions, or they have to waste them rerolling.

I played against a Jango Veers player and he ended up rolling in Jango on my turn, Jango and Veers were both pretty decked out by then, he played both Tactical Mastery copies and an unpredictible and couldn't do any damage.

Another recent game against Han/Rey he had 2 Force Speeds and ambush shenanigans on Rey and couldn't manage to roll anything over the course of about 6 or 7 actions, then the next turn I killed Rey. Bye Bye Force Speeds.

Yes, taking all those actions against you is annoying and sometimes it's not fun. It all depends on how meaningful all those extra actions were. If they exhaust and resolve everything but don't kill you and run out of stuff to do, you get to the same thing right back with them passing all the time.

I am not sure why you quoted me but yes!

17 hours ago, Ezzet said:

Exactly. Thats why i wrote Lukas about it a couple of weeks ago. Of course no answer from him, but i just wanted to express my concerns.

Why even have a back and forth system if someone can take 7-8 actions in a row.

There should be a rule of three. So you cant stack more than 3 actions in a row.

make it flavorful, make it the rule of 2