Been flying a lot of lists lately with at least one T-65 in them. I've come to an intersting connundrum:

Is it better to spend the T-65's mod slot on a Shield Upgrade or a repositioning upgrade (VT or EU)?

I am aware that this question could easily be answered by a response that references IA in some way. I don't want IA to enter into the discussion unless you think it's the best ( i.e. as in there is no other, better, ) option for a T-65 player to use in the mod slot.

And, if you please, THIS IS NOT AN "X WING FIX" THREAD, PLEASE. I just need some opinions and insights, and there are a lot of you guys that have forgotten more about XWM than I may ever know. So with that out of the way...

The particular build I am looking at is this:

• Luke Skywalker
• Lone Wolf (Almost always clipped to my Luke card)
• R2-D2

Regardless of the rest of the list (which currently happens to be a HotCop C3PO RerollAll Han), I'm wondering what opinions you guys have on the choice of repositioning versus an extra shield. I see lots of lists with all sorts of burst damage potential; is a third shield a better option than being able to potentially arc-dodge at least one shooter?

I am fielding opinions...so feel free to let me know. I hope the question is clear, because I really cannot decide.

Is the answer dependent on the repositioning mod? If so, I can accept that. Of course, the whole argument may be rendered moot if the answer is "it's so situational there really isn't a clear-cut winning choice". If so, I can accept that.

Is the answer dependent on who Luke's wingman(-men) are?

Is the answer dependent on the local meta? If so, my local meta is lots of the Romulan-looking ship and/or Bossk with a sprinkling of lists fielding cannon-armed ships. Mostly scum lists tbh but where I am (U.S. Gulf Coast) really anything goes. Heck, I won my local league with a Ten Numb list (only played 5 games, but I was 4 - 1 with it) when the LGS went under and the league ended. That alone should give you an idea that my local meta is pretty varied.

Is the answer dependent on "the percentages"? If so, I can accept that provided someone can share those percentages with me.

Is the answer dependent on competitiveness? If so, I can accept that this isn't a "competitive" list, but it's fun to fly and fairly thematic, which is one of my primary motivators when theorycrafting. I have a dual-K list for when things get serious.

Anyhoo, whatcha think? Any help is greatly appreciated. TYIA.

Repositioning. Avoiding one arc will save you far more health than you'll ever get from a Shield Upgrade, unless R2D2 goes off like 4 times before you die.

IA is roughly as good as Shield Upgrade (better in some circumstances) and costs 4pts less.

VT would help you manage range with Lone Wolf in mind.

Well, integrated Astromech is much, much more efficient than a hull or shield upgrade, so the comparison is really Integrated Astromech vs. Repositioning upgrade. With the setup you have, I feel like Vectored Thrusters could be an option (Engine Upgrade is too expensive for x-wings, frankly), but I prefer to keep T-65s cheep.

2 minutes ago, Stay On The Leader said:

IA is roughly as good as Shield Upgrade (better in some circumstances) and costs 4pts less.

VT would help you manage range with Lone Wolf in mind.

Yes...I was wondering if anyone felt this way. I agree, but with burst damage in mind would your answer change?

2 minutes ago, Squark said:

Well, integrated Astromech is much, much more efficient than a hull or shield upgrade, so the comparison is really Integrated Astromech vs. Repositioning upgrade. With the setup you have, I feel like Vectored Thrusters could be an option (Engine Upgrade is too expensive for x-wings, frankly), but I prefer to keep T-65s cheep.

Is the reason IA is more efficient because it's 0 points and cancels a hit effect? I see that, but losing regen seems to be a waste of those 4 points. Am I off base here?

10 minutes ago, Hawkstrike said:

Repositioning. Avoiding one arc will save you far more health than you'll ever get from a Shield Upgrade, unless R2D2 goes off like 4 times before you die.

See, here's the rub: I get R2 to proc quite a bit over the course of a game because his wingman is such a hate magnet.

Also, jousting is just too difficult (and dangerous) in today's meta for a 2 shield ship. At least that's how I feel.

2 minutes ago, Scopes said:

Is the reason IA is more efficient because it's 0 points and cancels a hit effect? I see that, but losing regen seems to be a waste of those 4 points. Am I off base here?

R2 only bites the dust as a last resort. I would need to feel I had nothing at all else to spend those 4pts on before I went for SU over IA.

6 minutes ago, Scopes said:

Is the reason IA is more efficient because it's 0 points and cancels a hit effect? I see that, but losing regen seems to be a waste of those 4 points. Am I off base here?

If it's a choice between losing the Astromech and being destroyed, then it is not a waste of those 4 points because without IA you'd have been destroyed anyway.

For low PS, and Biggs IA is definitely the better pick, repositioning to avoid arcs or to get an arc isn't great unless you are moving after the other ships. Shield upgrade isn't worth the points unless it's with R2-D2 (and it still might not be). IA basically is the same as a shield upgrade with a 3 point discount (cost of a generic astromech)

For high PS aces, repositioning is nice, and you do have the ability to get out if arcs, but X-wings aren't the pinnacle of survivability, so IA still wins out most of the time.

With your LW regen Luke, I would probably go for VT, as you don't need an focus/TL action for offense and defense. And it can help you get out of range 2 of your other ship if needed. LW Luke is still a good ship, as long as you aren't up against TLTs. If you find you don't use VT much, Shield upgrade is the place to go with the build if you have the points to spare.

20 minutes ago, Stay On The Leader said:

R2 only bites the dust as a last resort. I would need to feel I had nothing at all else to spend those 4pts on before I went for SU over IA.

That makes sense when you say it the way you did. Basically I arrived at a SA because of the points (I didn't want ordinance in the list for whatever the reason).

20 minutes ago, BlodVargarna said:

If it's a choice between losing the Astromech and being destroyed, then it is not a waste of those 4 points because without IA you'd have been destroyed anyway.

Yes...very good point. Didn't really think of that since I wasn't ever really considering IA. Hmm...

Have you considered BB8/Engine/PTL Luke?

2 minutes ago, Scopes said:

That makes sense when you say it the way you did. Basically I arrived at a SA because of the points (I didn't want ordinance in the list for whatever the reason).

If you have a random 2 pts it's not the end of the world to equip Seismic Torpedoes. In my very first game using them with Expertise Rey I used them to clear a landing zone that was otherwise non viable for the S-loop.

1 minute ago, Shockwave said:

If you have a random 2 pts it's not the end of the world to equip Seismic Torpedoes. In my very first game using them with Expertise Rey I used them to clear a landing zone that was otherwise non viable for the S-loop.

Great shout. My actual list I've been flying with for a few games is 98 points. I like the initiative bid, but when STs go off and do damage, it's great.

The 2-point torpedoes are both situational but potentially game-changing - having a wingman blow a rock out the way and giving you a shot you shouldnt have is nice, but don't dismiss flechette torps, either - he loses very little damage output for using them, and the potential for an automatic stress can really mess up pilots like the inquisitor

Integrated astromech is a nice toughness boost, but at the same time, having the ability to barrel roll could potentially be much more valuable: lukes already fairly tough with r2 in the back seat.

I personally like the idea of Luke with

1. Expertise
2. R2D2 or R5P9
3. Vectored Thrusters

Like this Luke never needs a Focus for offense / defense and he can always spend his action on repositioning or target locks.

If Luke uses R5P9 instead or R2D2 he can take a focus action to reload a shield and keep his maneuver dial open anyway.

Considering you have Integrated Astromech which is cheaper than a shield upgrade, there really is no need to use shield upgrade at all unless you are using a regen astromech. Still it might be better to hold on to the integrated astromech.

Shield upgrade is just so over-costed. It is really only worth its four points when equipped to a ship with 3 agility and only 1 shield. However pulse ray shield is coming out and that is better than a shield upgrade because it has potential to give you more than 1 additional shield (it really shouldn't have excluded the imperials).

So the consensus goes don't take shield upgrade as there are cheaper modifications that do the same thing.

However since you have R2-D2 in your build I'm still trying hard to figure if shield upgrade would be worth it. I still think not for the points and would almost recommend integrated astromech and taking another droid for reposistioning like BB-8. I would go for shield upgrade if and only if you are running Biggs, and in that case put Draw their Fire on Luke with a shield upgrade so you can pull off all the crits.

2 hours ago, Magnus Grendel said:

The 2-point torpedoes are both situational but potentially game-changing - having a wingman blow a rock out the way and giving you a shot you shouldnt have is nice, but don't dismiss flechette torps, either - he loses very little damage output for using them, and the potential for an automatic stress can really mess up pilots like the inquisitor

Integrated astromech is a nice toughness boost, but at the same time, having the ability to barrel roll could potentially be much more valuable: lukes already fairly tough with r2 in the back seat.

I like Flichette Torps as well. Very helpful to prevent hyper-mobile aces from turning behind you.

4 hours ago, Stay On The Leader said:

Have you considered BB8/Engine/PTL Luke?

Yes. However, regen is the way to go I think, at least with a T-65. Still, you have me thinking...

2 hours ago, Magnus Grendel said:

The 2-point torpedoes are both situational but potentially game-changing - having a wingman blow a rock out the way and giving you a shot you shouldnt have is nice, but don't dismiss flechette torps, either - he loses very little damage output for using them, and the potential for an automatic stress can really mess up pilots like the inquisitor

Integrated astromech is a nice toughness boost, but at the same time, having the ability to barrel roll could potentially be much more valuable: lukes already fairly tough with r2 in the back seat.

^ This. That's what I think, as well. However, there have been a lot of solid responses (all, in fact! Yay XW Community!) so I've got to playtest some more, methinks.

2 minutes ago, Scopes said:

Yes. However, regen is the way to go I think, at least with a T-65. Still, you have me thinking...

I think this combo is significantly better on a T70 as they have a 3 forward green which I find invaluable in repositioning that build.

I like vectored thrusters for arc dodging but integrated is probably your best choice unless the rest of the list simply can't use the 2 points. I also like Schu's suggestion of expertise. It makes you stronger in jousting scenarios complimenting other friendly ships. Ive never been a fan of lone wolf on small base ships because I often find flying to accomodate it gives your opponents a positioning edge and the ability to divide your list. I can definitely see the defensive upside with Luke though.

I have always liked the idea of Luke with IA, Lone Wolf or VI and R7-T1.

You don't always have to use that Boost to get closer to the enemy ship. Sometimes Boosting out of the opponents arc to set up a better shot and pocketing the TL for later is a better plan.

I'm a sucker for repositioning actions. But really, the Shield doesn't make much sense given that you can reach the same effect with an Integrated Astromech for 0 points.

IA is basically the shield for less but if you really don't want to, take the Vectored Thrusters. I've been enjoying playing Wedge VT, PTL, R2 astromech.