46 minutes ago, mithril2098 said:

Actually the timing might be right to be Obiwans grand daughter.

If you subscribe to the fan theory that obiwan and Satine kryze got intimate back on that mission before tPM, with her 'nephew' Korkie actually being her and obiwans son.

Rey would actually be about right to be Korkie's kid. Would make her both a Kenobi, and a Mandalorian.

While I haven't seen hard evidence to support this, it is a fan theory I would love to turn out to be right.

I would also love if the Mandalorian leader Sabine is looking to find turns out to be Korkie.

1 hour ago, Cgriffith said:

While you are correct that "Bloodline" is told via the point of view of Leia; Lucasfilm has already said that nothing signifigant would be revealed canonially unless it was on screen (per Pablo Hidalgo) so while you are correct that it takes place 6 years before TFA and their is no mention of another child; it doesn't make it FACT as you are proclaiming.

Thats not revealing what happened. It's revealing what didn't happen. And the novels certainly do plenty of that.

So, if it's perhaps a ball turret at the base of the vertical fin, could that be another at the end of the 'tail'...but, what's the engine arrangement ?

...and might that be a dorsal turret ?

Oh, I love new ships!

8 minutes ago, TasteTheRainbow said:

Thats not revealing what happened. It's revealing what didn't happen. And the novels certainly do plenty of that.

Only time will tell just remember Star Wars is always told via "a certain point of view"

Given the shot of the tie Fo flying super close to the nebulon/B wing deal, yet still being behind it that ship can't be much bigger than the ghost, sure it'd be tall but not long enough to justify an epic ship, its visually only as big as the upsilon with wings up.

9 minutes ago, ianmiddy said:

So, if it's perhaps a ball turret at the base of the vertical fin, could that be another at the end of the 'tail'...but, what's the engine arrangement ?

...and might that be a dorsal turret ?

Oh, I love new ships!

The engines are tucked in the 'corner' where the wing meets the main body. It looks like a couple little blue ones if you pause just right when the shot shifts to the aft sections.

Edit: It looks like you can see them in this picture as well. check out the blue ship, looks like there are probably 4 because the innermost one is probably mirrored on the other side.

3 minutes ago, benbaxter said:

The engines are tucked in the 'corner' where the wing meets the main body. It looks like a couple little blue ones if you pause just right when the shot shifts to the aft sections.

Good spot...maybe 2 mains & 1 aux in a triangle ?

So much for the rebels "not having enough canon ships."

So many pessimistic Star Wars "fans" .... I however, am excited!

Eh, expected a full trailer, this one's not really exciting. Maybe I just don't have any hope after TFA, but honestly I'm MUCH more thrilled for Rebels Season 4 and we haven't even seen the trailer (and tbh I didn't like S3 very much).

Boring X-wings and A-wings and the Falcon again and again.

One exciting, fresh shot in the trailer, and it's Rebel speeders going against Imperial walkers... on a white planet...

...on the other hand the new bigg ship that they've shown is gotta be the ugliest piece of SF that was ever created. It beats Star Trek, it beats TFA boxes, it beats both TFA and R1 shuttles, it beats the Dornean Gunship, the creator of which wanted it to be buried, it beats Carrack and Lancer of the times rightfully forgotten...

Impressive.

1 hour ago, Thormind said:

Finally balance won't be about the light extinguishing the dark. For me balance was never achieved when Vader and Palp died. It was when the hundreds of Jedi were reduced to only a few...

But Luke as quite a dark tone here. He sounds a bit like Kreia from KOTOR 2. I hope he wont turn out like her. I believe that would be a bad move. My guess is that he lost something/someone really important to him and it affected his relation with and/or view of the Force. Rey would be the one to bring him back to his old self. No matter what, i really hope they dont turn him evil or even worst kill him. There needs to be some kind of link remaining between the old and the new. Even if it's just some small appearances once in a while. A bit like good old Yoda

I think that in Lucas's original vision, the Force was in balance when there was only the Light Side, pure and untainted. The Dark Side was inherently corrupt and was what happened when the Force was out of balance. Thus the end of ROTJ with the extinction of the Sith represented balance being restored in Lucas's view. This idea of "good" being the natural order of things is a very western perspective.

It looks like the new trilogy are going for a more Yin/Yang approach to balance (I think Bendu in Rebels also reflects this shift). What this means for the story is open to speculation. A lot depends on when in the film Luke's "Time for the Jedi to end" line occurs. If it is near the start of the film then he is still in grumpy hiding mode. Rey will spend time persuading him to give the Jedi-thing one more go and he eventually relents and agrees to train her. If it occurs later in the film then it suggests a more profound change of approach.

Yoda told Luke that he would be the last of the Jedi and told him to pass on what he had learned. Luke clearly took this to mean he should rebuild the Jedi order which led to Ben's fall. Maybe the lesson he was meant to pass on was that a rigid Jedi Order was part of the problem since it represented an inflexible mindset and also a target for those looking for potential Darksiders. Perhaps the real lesson was in the strength of an individual to change the Galaxy through their beliefs. Anakin brought about the fall of the Jedi and the Republic because of his belief that Padme would die and he was right. Luke believed that his Father could be redeemed and he was also right which led to the destruction of the Empire. Both Anakin and Luke were well outside the traditional Jedi mould.

I think Luke realised that looking to the past was a mistake and he should not have tried to rebuild the Jedi as an order. I think the future lay in a small, more individualistic breed of Nu-Jedi acting individually on their own conscience and guided by the Force rather than answerable to a structured order and the New Republic beyond. Getting involved in politics and leading the Clone War was instrumental in the Jedi's destruction. A de-centralised band of nomads following a spirit of compassion rather than an organisation with a base, hierarchy and agenda would be almost impossible to destroy (at least in a single act).

5 hours ago, Verlaine said:

not enough RED .

5 hours ago, FlyingAnchors said:

I don't think so, I think there air speeders of some sort. They look like uglies more than anything, the one to the right of the main one in the shot has t-65 engines, or at least it looks like it.

Plus they are open topped.

17 minutes ago, Karhedron said:

I think that in Lucas's original vision, the Force was in balance when there was only the Light Side, pure and untainted. The Dark Side was inherently corrupt and was what happened when the Force was out of balance. Thus the end of ROTJ with the extinction of the Sith represented balance being restored in Lucas's view. This idea of "good" being the natural order of things is a very western perspective.

It looks like the new trilogy are going for a more Yin/Yang approach to balance (I think Bendu in Rebels also reflects this shift). What this means for the story is open to speculation. A lot depends on when in the film Luke's "Time for the Jedi to end" line occurs. If it is near the start of the film then he is still in grumpy hiding mode. Rey will spend time persuading him to give the Jedi-thing one more go and he eventually relents and agrees to train her. If it occurs later in the film then it suggests a more profound change of approach.

FWIW, in that "Lucas's original vision", the heroic 'Jedi' of the stories were actually called the 'Jedi-Bendu'. So...would be interesting to see if that comes back around...

1 hour ago, xanderf said:

FWIW, in that "Lucas's original vision", the heroic 'Jedi' of the stories were actually called the 'Jedi-Bendu'. So...would be interesting to see if that comes back around...

If Luke says "The last of the Bendu died on (that one planet in rebels)" it would be a neat tie in.

1 hour ago, Karhedron said:

I think that in Lucas's original vision, the Force was in balance when there was only the Light Side, pure and untainted. The Dark Side was inherently corrupt and was what happened when the Force was out of balance. Thus the end of ROTJ with the extinction of the Sith represented balance being restored in Lucas's view. This idea of "good" being the natural order of things is a very western perspective.

It looks like the new trilogy are going for a more Yin/Yang approach to balance (I think Bendu in Rebels also reflects this shift).

The clone wars showcases the yin/yang aspect fairly majorly in the two main places it got philosophical. In the Mortis Arc, Annakin as the chosen one was supposed to replace 'the father' as the balancing factor, keeping both 'the son' (the avatar of the dark side), and the 'the daughter' (the avatar of the light side') in check because (as we found out later after the daughter died) which ever gained the upper hand would effect the force across the whole galaxy. Controlling both light and dark was the emphasis, not destroying one or the other (as the Jedi and Sith were both trying to do)

Later in the Yoda arc at the very end, we got a more direct explanation. To connect to the cosmic force (and remain after death), you had to not only be strong in the force, but also face your own inner dark side. Not to fight it or destroy it.. But to come to terms with of and accept it as part of yourself. We get told by the spirit things that teach Yoda that the ancient Jedi once understood all that, and followed those beliefs (with the unstated implication being that the switch to focus entirely on the light side has twisted their beliefs into self destructive forms. the Jedi Order's failure to recognize, accept, and move past the dark side within themselves leading to the arrogance and corruption they had leading up to the clone wars, and the problems they were having during it.)

Interesting title. Jedi: the same word is used for singular and plural. One Jedi, Two jedi.

So is Luke the last of the Jedi? Is it Rey? Is it both of them? Or will there be more (a few still in hiding perhaps)?

12 minutes ago, Robin Graves said:

Interesting title. Jedi: the same word is used for singular and plural. One Jedi, Two jedi.

So is Luke the last of the Jedi? Is it Rey? Is it both of them? Or will there be more (a few still in hiding perhaps)?

"The Last Jedi" title was translated as a plural in other languages.

Woe. OK. So that was the dullest, most boring, least inspiring trailer I've ever seen. Literally nothing of note or intrigue is shown.

Paradoxically, I'm taking that as a good sign. Because the trailer(s) for The Force Awakens were literally breathtakingly good. And the Force Awakens was an unimaginative frame-by-frame retread of A New Hope.

So yeah, the trailer was hot garbage. With a bit of luck that means the film itself could be quite good.

5 hours ago, mithril2098 said:

5 hours ago, Bullox said:

@mithril2098: "The t70 in the foreground is slightly closer than the cockpit area of the nearest ship. It is about the same length as the conical part of the prow."

Oh, wait. I see a significant difference in our assumptions. To me it looks like the X-Wing is between the first and second new ship and the A-Wing is closest to the first red one. If the X-Wing really is closer than that first ship then you would be right and the new ship would be much larger than my estimates.

It is fairly close to the ship either position. So we're probably still looking at 60+ meters.

I'll rewatch the trailer when I get home, when I can pause and examine easier.

Either way, between the long length and the height, we're looking at an Epic ship, way bigger than the VCX.

ok on closer review of the scene, the X-wing passes behind the ship's chin guns an instant earlier (right as the scene starts. i got lucky to find it)

but it looks pretty darn close proximity. so my estimate is off by a bit (the cone is probably only 6-8 meters deep) but that still puts the sip in the 60-80 meter range. given the size of the ball turrets, i'd say closer to 70 to 80. combined with the ~70 meter height, that would still put it closer to the Gozanti in size (which is 63.8 meters long, 14.7 high, and 32 wide.)

given the ball turrets, i'd suspect it may be an anti-fighter platform. like a pocket Lancer Frigate. or perhaps just a light patrol ships, comparable to the Torpedo Boats/Fast Attack Craft IRL. (especially the ones seen near the end of WW2, where they traded away their anti-ship torpedoes for greater anti-aircraft and anti-personnel weaponry to help fight off airstrikes and other Torpedo boats.)

could make an interesting Epic ship for the Resistance.. introduce PWT hardpoints perhaps? or perhaps just be an epic with forward firing hardpoint weapons, and a trio of standard turret slots?

What manner of nerdery is afoot here?

Ugh. I really don't like when people claim that TFA is a frame-by-frame/scene-by-scene/shot-by-shot retread of ANH. The film had to have some elements that reflected what outraged nerds people were whining about claimed was missing or "wrong" in the prequel movies. Remember how LFL kept insisting that so much of TFA was "practical effects" and like the Original Trilogy? Even though it had been 10 years since, they had to try to distance themselves from the prequel movies and endear themselves to the new/current audience/demographic that would see this new era of Star Wars. There had to be enough familiar ingredients to the recipe, that it wouldn't be outright rejected by the masses. Billions of dollars and the hearts and minds of nerds (myself included) everywhere were at stake.

Like I said, the film had to have some elements from the Original Trilogy or there would not be a new era of Star Wars right now.

Don't dismiss TFA so casually. It's an awesome addition to the SW family that brought a lot of new things of it's own even if in part they are influenced by things that have come in films past. We ourselves are "retreads" of our parents, yet we have things within ourselves that are unique.

Don't forget that the entire SW story arc is based off of movies George Lucas liked (Hidden Fortress etc.) and his characters are archetypes heavily influenced by Joseph Cambell's theories of the Hero's Journey.

4 hours ago, Karhedron said:

I think that in Lucas's original vision, the Force was in balance when there was only the Light Side, pure and untainted. The Dark Side was inherently corrupt and was what happened when the Force was out of balance. Thus the end of ROTJ with the extinction of the Sith represented balance being restored in Lucas's view. This idea of "good" being the natural order of things is a very western perspective.

It looks like the new trilogy are going for a more Yin/Yang approach to balance (I think Bendu in Rebels also reflects this shift). What this means for the story is open to speculation. A lot depends on when in the film Luke's "Time for the Jedi to end" line occurs. If it is near the start of the film then he is still in grumpy hiding mode. Rey will spend time persuading him to give the Jedi-thing one more go and he eventually relents and agrees to train her. If it occurs later in the film then it suggests a more profound change of approach.

Yoda told Luke that he would be the last of the Jedi and told him to pass on what he had learned. Luke clearly took this to mean he should rebuild the Jedi order which led to Ben's fall. Maybe the lesson he was meant to pass on was that a rigid Jedi Order was part of the problem since it represented an inflexible mindset and also a target for those looking for potential Darksiders. Perhaps the real lesson was in the strength of an individual to change the Galaxy through their beliefs. Anakin brought about the fall of the Jedi and the Republic because of his belief that Padme would die and he was right. Luke believed that his Father could be redeemed and he was also right which led to the destruction of the Empire. Both Anakin and Luke were well outside the traditional Jedi mould.

I think Luke realised that looking to the past was a mistake and he should not have tried to rebuild the Jedi as an order. I think the future lay in a small, more individualistic breed of Nu-Jedi acting individually on their own conscience and guided by the Force rather than answerable to a structured order and the New Republic beyond. Getting involved in politics and leading the Clone War was instrumental in the Jedi's destruction. A de-centralised band of nomads following a spirit of compassion rather than an organisation with a base, hierarchy and agenda would be almost impossible to destroy (at least in a single act).

One popular speculation (and quite possible) is that in his researches, Luke found out that the Jedi philosophy was flawed and that's what caused their demise. He was trying or maybe he is going to start something new. The book we see in the trailer would actually be some kind of proof that at some point, a Jedi found the flaws. Many are talking about some kind of "grey" Jedi...

21 minutes ago, Thormind said:

One popular speculation (and quite possible) is that in his researches, Luke found out that the Jedi philosophy was flawed and that's what caused their demise. He was trying or maybe he is going to start something new. The book we see in the trailer would actually be some kind of proof that at some point, a Jedi found the flaws. Many are talking about some kind of "grey" Jedi...

Grey Jedi rules! Good thing they are coming back.

19 minutes ago, Odanan said:

Grey Jedi rules! Good thing they are coming back.

Hehe, as long as we see Luke kick some ass somewhere in the movie, he can be any color he wants :-)

Well maybe not a pink Jedi...