Rules question, charge?

By sludrick, in Runewars Miniatures Game

If i have a charge set into the dial, and I get hit before I reveal , when I do reveal it after the attack resolves, does my charge allow me to attack? Or is my action wasted?

It's wasted. The action is cancelled

1 minute ago, sludrick said:

If i have a charge set into the dial, and I get hit before I reveal , when I do reveal it after the attack resolves, does my charge allow me to attack? Or is my action wasted?

Charge is a movement modifier, and if you are engaged you cannot move or use movement mods.

So yes, your charge is cancelled.

You cannot march or use march modifiers, but you can still move via shift. You just can't move away unless you disengage first. But you can shift to slide around your opponent. Reform also still works.

Edited by Budgernaut
6 minutes ago, Budgernaut said:

You cannot march or use march modifiers, but you can still move via shift. You just can't move away unless you disengage first. But you can shift to slide around your opponent. Reform also still works.

If you shift while engaged with an enemy you can only do one of two things, reposition or disengage.

If you reposition, you must be touching the same unit along the same edge that you were touching them before. So you can't slide around side them.

If you disengage, you must move directly away from them, and then you receive a panic token.

This is all detailed in section 73.

Shift 1, as most shifts are, only moves you back slightly. Next round you can't move past who you were engaged with all you can do is shift , rally, reform. While the army you are running from can easily charge you again.

so you would need to engage the army with another of your units or siengage seems pretty useless. I haven't played yet, so maybe experienced gamers know why you might want to disengage?

11 minutes ago, Ywingscum said:

Shift 1, as most shifts are, only moves you back slightly. Next round you can't move past who you were engaged with all you can do is shift , rally, reform. While the army you are running from can easily charge you again.

so you would need to engage the army with another of your units or siengage seems pretty useless. I haven't played yet, so maybe experienced gamers know why you might want to disengage?

Some units can chain movement with bonus actions, or upgrades. It just depends on the situation.

If you disengage before they attack you have negated that unit's activation.

Charge is a modifier, and the modifier is not cancelled by being engaged, only March actions.

If you had keyed in a March+Charge on your dial, and you were charged before you took your action, when your initiative round comes up you would reveal your March action and then have that March action cancelled because you are engaged with another unit. Because you did not move, your unit did not hit an enemy unit, so you did not collide, so you do not get the triggered attack action from charge.

If you had keyed in a March+Skill on your dial, and you were charged before you took your action, when your initiative round comes up you would reveal your March action and then have that March action cancelled because you are engaged with another unit. However, your Skill bonus action is not cancelled, and your would still be able to resolve it (assuming it does not trigger a March action or a Ranged Attack action without the Close-Quarters Targeting upgrade card).

If you had a Shift+Turn+Charge on your dial, your Shift is not cancelled by being engaged (nor the modifiers on it), but you can't choose a move that would overlap the enemy, thus you can't collide and still can't trigger the attack from the charge modifier. You could still use the Turn modifier when you disengage, allowing you to move using the turn template instead of the normal straight movement template.

Edited by drkpnthr
21 minutes ago, drkpnthr said:

Charge is a modifier, and the modifier is not cancelled by being engaged, only March actions.

If you had keyed in a March+Charge on your dial, and you were charged before you took your action, when your initiative round comes up you would reveal your March action and then have that March action cancelled because you are engaged with another unit. Because you did not move, your unit did not hit an enemy unit, so you did not collide, so you do not get the triggered attack action from charge.

If you had keyed in a March+Skill on your dial, and you were charged before you took your action, when your initiative round comes up you would reveal your March action and then have that March action cancelled because you are engaged with another unit. However, your Skill bonus action is not cancelled, and your would still be able to resolve it (assuming it does not trigger a March action or a Ranged Attack action without the Close-Quarters Targeting upgrade card).

If you had a Shift+Turn+Charge on your dial, your Shift is not cancelled by being engaged (nor the modifiers on it), but you can't choose a move that would overlap the enemy, thus you can't collide and still can't trigger the attack from the charge modifier. You could still use the Turn modifier when you disengage, allowing you to move using the turn template instead of the normal straight movement template.

Movement modifiers have no effect if the movement didn't happen. If you reveal march and charge while engaged, the march is canceled and the charge automatically has no effect, regardless of anything else going on in the game. It doesn't matter whether you moved or not, or touched a new enemy, etc (you typically won't anyway if your march is canceled). The march was canceled, so charge automatically has no effect.

15.2 A modifier is not canceled when the action is canceled. However, movement modifiers and the enhance modifiers have no effect if their corresponding action is not performed.

@rowdyoctopus I'm not sure if you are trying to say something different or not. I was trying to clarify some incorrect statements earlier that said the modifiers are cancelled if the action is cancelled, which is not true. As I said in my example, and as you repeated, the movement modifier has no effect if the unit does not move. However, in the case of a Shift, the unit CAN move, and the fact that the modifier is not cancelled is important, because you can still apply a movement modifier with a Shift action.

For instance, the new Leonx Rider can Shift+March. If it has an upgrade like Agressive Cornicen that adds a Charge movement modifier to all March actions, it could potentially reveal the Shift, disengage (taking panic), then it would deal with the March bonus action, and collide with the same enemy, triggering an attack action. This is a situation where the distinction between the modifier being ignored with a March action and the modifier being cancelled are important.

3 minutes ago, drkpnthr said:

15.2 A modifier is not canceled when the action is canceled. However, movement modifiers and the enhance modifiers have no effect if their corresponding action is not performed.

@rowdyoctopus I'm not sure if you are trying to say something different or not. I was trying to clarify some incorrect statements earlier that said the modifiers are cancelled if the action is cancelled, which is not true. As I said in my example, and as you repeated, the movement modifier has no effect if the unit does not move. However, in the case of a Shift, the unit CAN move, and the fact that the modifier is not cancelled is important, because you can still apply a movement modifier with a Shift action.

For instance, the new Leonx Rider can Shift+March. If it has an upgrade like Agressive Cornicen that adds a Charge movement modifier to all March actions, it could potentially reveal the Shift, disengage (taking panic), then it would deal with the March bonus action, and collide with the same enemy, triggering an attack action. This is a situation where the distinction between the modifier being ignored with a March action and the modifier being cancelled are important.

You were saying charge didn't work because you didn't collide, etc. That actually isn't the case. Those things do not matter if the March is canceled. There are other things that could cancel a March, rather than being engaged, and it would still cause the charge to have no effect.

@sludrick to answer the other part of your question, reveal your dial at the initiative value as you normally would.

This keeps your opponent from knowing that he blocked you.