Grey Characters?

By Piscettios, in Star Wars: Destiny

I wish we had a few grey characters for each set. I did a quick search and didn't see it discussed much here. I think the flexibility would be nice, seeing a character with two different sides to play on. The cards available to each side could make one character completely different played on a different side.

I sure they debated the idea and the ship has kind of sailed on this with Anakin coming in SoR, him being one of the best choices for this role. But I'd still like to see it down the road.

There's plenty in Star Wars lore that played both sides or crossed to the other. Rush Clovis and Pong Krell from CW come to mind...Lando maybe. Jawas, bounty hunters and droids could fit in too.

Anyone else think this would be a nice addition or is it maybe too late?

Part of the reason the new dark side Anakin is a villain, is to give him the proper name "Darth Vader" so that he can't be paired up with any other versions of Darth Vader.

Also, there's a difference between Grey-colored characters (not Red/Blue/Yellow) and Neutral characters. Grey characters might actually be a detriment; since they wouldn't bring any color of their own to the table. On the other hand, perhaps that could be a balancing mechanic. Neutral characters is what you're describing, and I think we might wind up seeing them at some point.

Neutral generic characters make the most sense: for instance, a Yellow Jawa character who would work for either Heroes or Villains. I'm not convinced any of the named characters you suggested would really benefit from being neutral, and make more sense as being either a Hero or a Villain. Named characters who "switch sides" would probably benefit from having two distinct cards, one hero and one villain. That being said, there's a case to be made that some minor characters are truly neutral and would best fit under that heading (Hondo and Fenn Rau, for instance)... but I would still expect FFG to start off exploring the design space with generic characters.

Personally, I am not interest in Neutral or Grey characters

boba fett would fits since his side depends on who pays him

I'm not too hot on Grey characters. Simply because it doesn't really add anything interesting mechanically. And pretty much everyone should be able to fit into the B/Y/R pie.

Neutral characters are at least a little more interesting, but I'd only really want to see them if they actually do something out of the ordinary. Having 'random alien' on both sides doesn't really add much to the game.

To farther clarify my point, give me a villain Jawa and a Hero Jawa, not a neutral Jawa. That way you can design them differently but have them on both sides, like the Star Wars CCG

Neutral and grey characters could definitely be a thing at some point, they allow super powerful characters where you have to potentially sacrifice a colour in your deck to bring in the character

Bring me a neutral Rancor, now please!

It breaks the whole ethic of Yellow, Blue and Red.

There is also a risk that it breaks the Hero/Villain dynamic too.

So if we all play Rancor and one character of our choice, nearly every game will feel like a mirror match.

I would love to see decks that came pre-built and had some sort of mission for 2-4 players to play in a co-op mode to defeat. Assault on the Death Star, Battle of Jaba's Palace etc.

They do have grey "characters" in the form of support cards. I think they got that part right. They can be add on as a support for any color deck during the game. Grey color is far to limiting to run as a main character though.

A neutral character would have to be rather bland so as to not break the game as they can be combo up with anything. This makes them not so interesting.

I have a feeling that assuming they want to continue with the current format of 4 characters of each colour/faction, the need to invent 72 new characters every year would naturally lead them to printing both hero and villain copies of what might be considered a neutral character just to make up the numbers.

They probably won't be in the same set mind you but I see no need for Grey or Neutral characters.

Now Multi-colour characters could be a really interesting option, Purple, Orange & Green Characters would allow more colours in a deck but probably at the cost of extra character points. Possibly even characters that prohibit the pairing of another colour, Maybe a Red character that says you can't run yellow cards in your deck.

Plenty of design space to explore but I don’t feel that Grey or neutral characters is one of them.

If you make a neutral character, finn truly becomes pointless.

And he doesn't need help in that.

If they go with grey characters, this means that a single character can be used both by LS and DS players, i.e. you have a card that can be used for two factions in stead of two different cards. Thus, less money. Hence, I don't see this coming

I would not like to see this happen. It's too easy for a dominant grey character to be in every deck and create stagnation.

I'm not sure there would ever be a dominant grey character even if they made one.

Being Grey would be an inherent disadvantage due to not bringing any colour to the table for your deck, so you would be limited to 1 colour decks, possibly 2 if you were to pair with 2 other different coloured characters but would most likely be a weak 3 die/3 character build.

Having said that its not necessarily out of the realms of possibility, FFG have just printed a unique crew card in X-Wing that is not faction restricted. I'm sure there are a few characters in the SW universe that could fill that role.

Even just a basic non-unique mercenary unit with mixed damage and a limit of 1 per squad could be interesting. Pretty sure Hero decks would play an underpowered Generic with crap dice if it only cost 7 character points haha.

In terms of gameplay, grey characters are very weak, as they really limit your deck. Thematically, they make some sense because they would represent people not specifically skilled in warfare. Padme, for example, is a diplomat, and thus thematically could be grey because it could be argued that she doesn't know as many warfare tactics, since the picture on the card is from Episode 1. Garrison stormtroopers, like the unskilled sandtroopers that the heroes easily defeat in Mos Eisley could also be grey, as they don't have many "command" skills. The major problem with this is that too many things already refer to colors, for example, Endless Ranks (Awakenings #70). Also, even though Padme and Han Solo have had much different levels of experience with combat, even the young and inexperienced Episode 1 Padme is certainly able to Negotiate (Awakenings #131) or coordinate a Hyperspace Jump (Awakenings #129.)

Neutral characters, on the other hand, are very interesting. Hired Gun (Awakenings #47) could easily have been neutral. I also agree that Boba Fett thematically could be neutral. If creatures ever appear, they could also be neutral, but I think "creature" would be separate from "character"(i.e. a new card type), as Reeks with Lightsabers make absolutely no sense at all (and, frankly, sound totally broken.) Again, the problem with neutral characters is the cards that already exist... poor Jango would certainly feel left out if his son got to be a hero but he didn't, since he's more thematically neutral than Boba (the clone army is cloned from him, whereas Boba's only movie appearances are selling the heroes out to Vader and trying to kill them on Tatooine.)

It would be interesting if there had been a "scum and villainy" faction, like X-Wing, but I think too many factions is just too limiting. It would be interesting if every character combination had limitations, such as only Empire characters together, only Seperatist characters together, etc., but in a deckbuilding game, you really want options, and over-factionation takes some of the flavor out of the game. It's kind of nice that a new player only has to buy both starters and 6 packs or so to be pretty much guaranteed to be able to build a good, 30 point squad.

13 hours ago, Mace Windu said:

I'm not sure there would ever be a dominant grey character even if they made one.

Being Grey would be an inherent disadvantage due to not bringing any colour to the table for your deck, so you would be limited to 1 colour decks, possibly 2 if you were to pair with 2 other different coloured characters but would most likely be a weak 3 die/3 character build.

Having said that its not necessarily out of the realms of possibility, FFG have just printed a unique crew card in X-Wing that is not faction restricted. I'm sure there are a few characters in the SW universe that could fill that role.

Even just a basic non-unique mercenary unit with mixed damage and a limit of 1 per squad could be interesting. Pretty sure Hero decks would play an underpowered Generic with crap dice if it only cost 7 character points haha.

https://www.fantasyflightgames.com/en/news/2017/1/23/boshek/

For those of you who don't play X-Wing, the whole point here is that BoShek can fit into all 3 factions' squads, and is the first unique character to do so. Granted, there's a big difference between other crew in the game... in X-Wing, non-uniques are not faction restricted unless it says so on the card.

But I do think that in conjunction with what Mace Windu said here, BoShek would be a cool addition to the game as a unique, 7 point, grey, neutral character with a very weak die. The only problem is that he only has a 5-second non-speaking role in Episode IV, but at least he's canon!

Thematically, I think other characters could potentially fit this role.

He's probably a "hero", but Jar Jar Binks also makes some sense as a grey character, because he doesn't seem talented with, well, anything!

11 hours ago, Kieransi said:

He's probably a "hero", but Jar Jar Binks also makes some sense as a grey character, because he doesn't seem talented with, well, anything!

I don't know about that - he was quite the "hero" and ladies man in Season 6 of the Clone Wars cartoon!! ;)