Maybe?

No, everyone needs to stop their whinging about how everything needs to be nerfed.

I think it would probably be fine if the JumpMaster didn't have a white turnaround maneuver. It's probably a little more stress resilient than it should be in general, but I'm not sure how you fix that.

Forum needs the nerf of the nerfs, subforum for nerfs that do these daily nerf posts... cmon this is really getting out of hands here!!!

Probably not. The only way you could really need it would be to limit it to range 3, but then range of if what? You could daisy chain focus all over like swarm tactics. So that will not work.

The issues with mindlink as I see them are related to the jumpmaster, which is still a problem. F FG seems to be going around their elbow to figure out how to normalize that ship. Frankly, the only options as I see it are

1). Make it 2-3 points more expensive

2). Get rid of the 2nd Torp slot and the EPT on the CS

3). Get rid of the straight greens (make them white).

All three are going to probably require a reprint of some sort rather than a straight errata, which I doubt FFG will ever do.

It probably should've been a 2 point EPT. Then it would be fine. Paratanni would've never been a thing, and triple jumps would be more restricted in their options.

But oh well.

Nerfing everything isn't the solution.

Simple. If you have a stress already no benefit from mind link. Requires flying better. For 1 pt it's just too cheap and effective.

Believe me I've been using it since it came out, same with roo.

You basically have no reason not to take mindlink in a scum list with 3+ EPT ships. If you don't, you are handicapping yourself. It's that simple.

So yes, it should see an errata. I personally think it is the main upgrade that FFG missed in the great errataing. The only thing that was really keeping it in check at all was the other overpowered upgrades, which, since they got erratas, Mindlink is pretty much unmatched in its efficiency with its unlimited range band.

Could the forum just stop crying nerf all the time? It's getting pretty BORING! If FFG nerfs mindlink, what will the forum horde demand as the next blood sacrifice? Because the whining will certainly not stop there!

I guess FFG wanted first to see how the Manaroo nerf develops. If a nerf for Mindlink, what about forbidding it on Fangs and JM5Ks? Because my feeling is the others are fine, and actually Starvipers, Scyks, Kihraxzes and Z95 (Kaa'to) and with the red dice creep even the Hwks need some help.

Then conveniently people forget that it occupies the contested EPT slot on all ships.

Maybe if Kylo develops into a major pain, detemination-need decreases somewhat Mindlink powerhouses like parattani.

Mindlink is fine, the shared stress is a good balance to the shared Focus. It costs 1 point and an ept slot per ship and you generally need at least 3 ships to make it worth while.

Contracted Scouts are still a little too good. Dengar is fine, Tel is fine, Manaroo is now fine. You could take away the EPT slot from the Scouts but I think they would disappear completely then.

Somewhere I saw somebody suggest taking away the Salvaged Astro slot and adding it to the Punishing One title. I don't hate that idea but I think you push the scout out of being playable aside from a bumpmaster build and people already hate that set up, just not as much as torpedo boats.

Whatever they do, if anything, I hope they announce it more than a month away from regionals or nationals. Sucks to have practiced a list for a couple months and then have a FAQ pull the rug out from under you a couple weeks before a regional.

If you strung all the nerfs together, with the right pauses, it would be like the dogs barking out "Jingle Bells". Now wouldn't that be precious!.

Range 1-3 for the mindlink..cant believe im taking part for the conversation...

It does not need a nerf, it is not so powerful.

But one sad thing is that nowadays you only see scum lists in combination with mindlink. It seems that variation has dramatically decreased in this fraction

When another ship with Attani Mindlink gains a focus or stress token, if you have no stress, you must gain the same token if you do not already have one.

Nah. Mindlink makes crappier scum ships like the Scyk, StarViper, and even Kihraxz somewhat playable. The issue is it makes the really good Scum ships even better.

14 minutes ago, defkhan1 said:

Nah. Mindlink makes crappier scum ships like the Scyk, StarViper, and even Kihraxz somewhat playable. The issue is it makes the really good Scum ships even better.

I was just going to mention this. The ships you most see with attani are jumps, protectorates, and lancers.

What do they all have in common? Very well costed, great dials with a lot of greens, and almost always able to get shots because of multiple firing arcs and/or post maneuvering options.

Very much a case of the "rich getting richer" so to speak.

The other thing I hate with anything meta in general is how everyone jumps on what's best and won't try anything else since it might be a bit inferior.

This might blow some minds but I'm currently running a 3 ship scum list that all have EPTs and none of them have mindlink.

Mindlink is very powerful for its cost, compare to PTL for example. It is also largely immune to blocking which undermines a fundamental strategy for generic squads and swarms. It anything, removing the stress sharing restriction would give it much larger downside and make it much less of a risk free choice.

Mindlink is a really good card, and I know I hate playing against it. Does that warrant a nerf? Who knows.

44 minutes ago, defkhan1 said:

Nah. Mindlink makes crappier scum ships like the Scyk, StarViper, and even Kihraxz somewhat playable. The issue is it makes the really good Scum ships even better.

Then I would love something like:

Modification - Devotion to a cause (1) imperial only: When you spend one or more tokens during an attack or a defense, if you successfully hit or evade, then recover all the tokens you have spent in this attack or defense. You may equip 1 additional Modification upgrade that costs 3 or fewer squad points.

Yes, it would make even stronger the strongest imperial ships, but boy, about Firespray and Punisher... that mod would make them playable.

Or maybe something that fixes weak ships in exchange for making too strong those that are already strong... is not a good designado in the long run.

53 minutes ago, markcsoul said:

I was just going to mention this. The ships you most see with attani are jumps, protectorates, and lancers.

What do they all have in common? Very well costed, great dials with a lot of greens, and almost always able to get shots because of multiple firing arcs and/or post maneuvering options.

Very much a case of the "rich getting richer" so to speak.

The other thing I hate with anything meta in general is how everyone jumps on what's best and won't try anything else since it might be a bit inferior.

This might blow some minds but I'm currently running a 3 ship scum list that all have EPTs and none of them have mindlink.

this is my guy,

screw the meta, in fact i run Colzet in an ace list

1 hour ago, markcsoul said:

The other thing I hate with anything meta in general is how everyone jumps on what's best and won't try anything else since it might be a bit inferior.

If your goal is to win, why settle for anything than the best? (unless you have something specific in mind, like countering your expected meta that is).

13 minutes ago, LordBlades said:

If your goal is to win, why settle for anything than the best? (unless you have something specific in mind, like countering your expected meta that is).

I don't think that's his point, but i won't take for granted what he mean s, but rather what i understood from it.

We really don't know what's best and we won't ever truly know what's best. We will have an idea of what is good and limit our game experiences from there probably missing better things as we narrow our practice down to a fewer list archtypes. I agree with that, but i am a Pyrrho fanboy so take that with a grain of salt

1 hour ago, Kristjan said:

Mindlink is very powerful for its cost, compare to PTL for example. It is also largely immune to blocking which undermines a fundamental strategy for generic squads and swarms. It anything, removing the stress sharing restriction would give it much larger downside and make it much less of a risk free choice.

I've played Fenn Rau with Mindlink and with PtL.

PtL Fenn is much more flexible. The ability to Boost and Barrell roll makes him tougher to nail down, the ability to take any two of his actions is really good. PtL Fenn doesn't care about what his squad mates are doing. PtL Fenn is a much better endgame ship.

Mindlink Fenn is cheaper but very list dependent. His maneuvers are a little more open but sometimes you need to perform a red maneuver on someone and it constrains his dial just the same as PtL Fenn. If Fenn is the last ship alive his EPT slot is moot, 1 point and the slot doing nothing. He can be easily out maneuvered with only one action per turn.

Blocking is still a thing against Mindlink lists; I know that it can do bad things to my plans for the round. A key block forces me to take the Focus action on a ship that I had other plans for. Mindlink is resistant to blocking the same way that it is resistant to stress but both will still throw a wrench into my plans and make things more difficult for me.

If you increase the cost to 2 points, you kill the card. It is good for a 1 point card, not great as is. The fact that you need to fill up the valuable EPT slot of at least three ships to be effective is a big deal. If you change the wording so that you can't get a Focus when stressed, then you kill the card because then it is hard counter by anything that can hand out stress (Stresshog, Rebel Captive, Tactician).

23 minutes ago, DreadStar said:

I don't think that's his point, but i won't take for granted what he mean s, but rather what i understood from it.

We really don't know what's best and we won't ever truly know what's best. We will have an idea of what is good and limit our game experiences from there probably missing better things as we narrow our practice down to a fewer list archtypes. I agree with that, but i am a Pyrrho fanboy so take that with a grain of salt

However, if we limit ourselves to what we know is good, we're also missing the bad things. Since we're talking about top tier tournament squads, there's likely a great deal more worse stuff than better stuff.

The average guy is not the greatest squad builder (he's, unsurprisingly, average). Likely he can't build an original squad that's on par or better with the meta squads (these are built by way above average squad builders), so, for him, if he wants to win, copying a meta squad is actually a step forward.