3 hours ago, ozmodon said:

but now they seem to want to be hoarding them.

To what end?

Surely they make money by selling things? Or am I completely misunderstanding capitalism?

3 minutes ago, Stu35 said:

To what end?

Surely they make money by selling things? Or am I completely misunderstanding capitalism?

Ozmodon might mean that the store is looking to open all of their boxes and sell the cards individually, rather than sell the sealed boxes/boosters. I've seen this a few times over. Don't shop at those places anymore.

Just now, Stone37 said:

Ozmodon might mean that the store is looking to open all of their boxes and sell the cards individually, rather than sell the sealed boxes/boosters. I've seen this a few times over. Don't shop at those places anymore.

Ah i see. Yes that's an utter bellend move.

3 hours ago, Stu35 said:

To what end?

Surely they make money by selling things? Or am I completely misunderstanding capitalism?

They want you to support the local store then won't support the local consumer. Generally i only get screwed once so now they will start to loose out on my money and support. Ive been the one to keep the enthusiasm going on this game when there was no product to buy. My guess is that I'm no longer needed because they got plenty of product

people selling the singles are not the problem, it's ffg who did not print enough that created the problem.

My plan is to NOT preorder boxes. I ended up with way too many boxes thinking all my pre-orders would not be met. I am starting to think they may have waited too long to release SoR and the interest just isn't there anymore. They probably way over printed this set.

And yes there are price gougers on day one. It is like that for any game of this type. Those prices are going to crash hard soon, probably around the time wave two comes out.

There are a lot of boxes on ebay, not too many people are buying them though.

13 minutes ago, Mep said:

My plan is to NOT preorder boxes. I ended up with way too many boxes thinking all my pre-orders would not be met. I am starting to think they may have waited too long to release SoR and the interest just isn't there anymore. They probably way over printed this set.

And yes there are price gougers on day one. It is like that for any game of this type. Those prices are going to crash hard soon, probably around the time wave two comes out.

There are a lot of boxes on ebay, not too many people are buying them though.

Because they are on Ebay for $150. Awakenings boxes weren't going for that much until all the waves were released. We are a day into Wave 1, with Wave 2 by every account being larger then Wave 1, why would most people be willing to shell out $150 at this point? And despite that some have been selling at that price.

The idea that you think, on the basis your personal pre-orders were filled, that this set has been overprinted while any number of retailers (particularly the large online ones) are reporting only partial fulfillment of pre-orders is nutty.

It's as silly as people that were a week ago complaining about their lack of local player base but today posting how they bought 9 boxes day 1 and that no local store had stock past pre-orders. Or people that think just because it's not a available in their immediate area that no one has had access to product.

9 hours ago, Mep said:

My plan is to NOT preorder boxes. I ended up with way too many boxes thinking all my pre-orders would not be met. I am starting to think they may have waited too long to release SoR and the interest just isn't there anymore. They probably way over printed this set.

And yes there are price gougers on day one. It is like that for any game of this type. Those prices are going to crash hard soon, probably around the time wave two comes out.

There are a lot of boxes on ebay, not too many people are buying them though.

Wait, @Mep , if I'm hearing you right, you think they OVERprinted this set? And you're complaining about it? Just open all the boxes and sell a kidney to pay for 'em! You won't regret it!

In all seriousness, I actually thought this might happen, so I only preordered one box. Sorry that you got too many - it must be a pain to have to try to get rid of 'em, but it sure beats not getting any and having to try to scrounge packs off of eBay!

There is more demand for this game than ever. I think there's just also a bit more stock than anyone thought there would be and so a lot of people are being pleasantly surprised. Maybe this game will get to the point where there's actually stock sitting on the shelf most of the year...

@ScottieATF Face to Face games is selling them for $140 on ebay, shipping included. MSRP is $108 but figure about $20-$25 dollars in ebay fees and shipping and the fact you aren't paying sales tax and the price is reasonable although on the high side. They aren't selling many. This means one of two things, there are plenty of boxes to be bought else where at cheaper prices or not too many people are buying. Either way, the demand is simply not high enough for ebay to be selling this.

@Kieransi Yeah, pretty sure there will be plenty of stock sitting on the shelf. My understanding is my store's distributor has plenty of boxes still. Sounds like a few places lacked the funds to buy more or simply didn't know where to buy from. I do believe FFG is limiting supply to the big online retailers like MM since they want local game stores to be selling their products. Even so, sounds like MM got plenty of boxes and opened a bunch of them.

They will sell through wave 1 but I doubt wave 2 will be off the shelves before wave 3, which is just going to sit in a warehouse for a long time.

@Mep , that's exactly what I want! Any other CCG has enough stock that there's some sitting around on the shelves. I hate that this one is like "oh no! It's May 4th! I better run to the store and buy 3 boxes and hoard them before the stock dissapears! Good thing I also preordered 20 boxes from 10 different sources to hedge my bets!"

"That joke is based on a true story."

-Stephen Colbert

I just want to be hanging out playing X-Wing every week in my LGS and be able to waddle over to the counter between games and pick up a pack or two, without worrying about whether I'm going to get some annoying spiel from the employees about "oh yeah, no stock for 6 months at least. Next time, you gotta preorder, man."

"That joke is also based on a true story."

@Kieransi I agree that is how it should work. I am just a little put off by the no stock then too much stock. On top of that this game is so new it is hard to judge if anyone will be playing it. I know a lot of people in my area sold off their stuff. There were only a couple of guys opening boxes last night. I preordered in Feb. when things were hot and now the game's gone cold.

My point here is not to preorder anymore. No need. When new product comes in, judge then and decide if it is worth buying.

@Mep , oh ok! I get it now.

I'm kind of spoiled - I have a great game community here, and everyone still loves Destiny. Yep, it stinks if you play a game but there's no community for it. That's been my experience with Days of Wonder's Memoir '44.

14 hours ago, Mep said:

My plan is to NOT preorder boxes. I ended up with way too many boxes thinking all my pre-orders would not be met. I am starting to think they may have waited too long to release SoR and the interest just isn't there anymore. They probably way over printed this set.

And yes there are price gougers on day one. It is like that for any game of this type. Those prices are going to crash hard soon, probably around the time wave two comes out.

There are a lot of boxes on ebay, not too many people are buying them though.

we only got 3 out of 30 preorder boxes and were not the only ones claiming this, we defiantly did not get overshipped

14 hours ago, ScottieATF said:

Because they are on Ebay for $150. Awakenings boxes weren't going for that much until all the waves were released. We are a day into Wave 1, with Wave 2 by every account being larger then Wave 1, why would most people be willing to shell out $150 at this point? And despite that some have been selling at that price.

The idea that you think, on the basis your personal pre-orders were filled, that this set has been overprinted while any number of retailers (particularly the large online ones) are reporting only partial fulfillment of pre-orders is nutty.

It's as silly as people that were a week ago complaining about their lack of local player base but today posting how they bought 9 boxes day 1 and that no local store had stock past pre-orders. Or people that think just because it's not a available in their immediate area that no one has had access to product.

you can not blame ppl for the amount they preordered it's not there job to get product on the shelves it's FFG

Bought one box, and once my store has packs to sell I will pick up two to three every time I go there for game night.

Preordered a box from the Warstore, got it on Friday. My friend preordered two boxes from his LGS, and got both. We each opened a box of our own, and then split the third box (we drafted it to ensure we both got what we wanted). He primarily does heroes, I primarily do villains; we dabble in between and it usually works out. That was $140. I went on eBay and impatiently ordered a few "competitive" singles to round out my decks, so I don't need to worry about tracking things down (playsets for Planetary Uprising, Lightsaber Throw, Imperial Inspection, and a second Vibroblade). Another $20, though waiting a little while would certainly have saved me a few bucks.

$160 for basically everything I wanted from the wave works for me, especially since I could sell some cards I'm not in love with to recoup that cost. I don't have a full playset, but I'm just focused on the handful of deck archetypes I want to run -- and I have everything I need for them now. Drafting the second box is a huge help, as it basically lets my friend and I round out our collection without getting stuck with a bunch of extra copies of cards we already have. I can't imagine ordering more than 2 boxes in the future, and will probably stick with 1.5 for the next wave... once you get above 2 boxes, you have severely diminishing returns since you'll start getting third and fourth copies of cards which you can't use. And you're still playing the RNG game with legendaries. At that point, I think you're better off on the singles market.

On 5/5/2017 at 1:39 PM, Mep said:

@ScottieATF Face to Face games is selling them for $140 on ebay, shipping included. MSRP is $108 but figure about $20-$25 dollars in ebay fees and shipping and the fact you aren't paying sales tax and the price is reasonable although on the high side. They aren't selling many. This means one of two things, there are plenty of boxes to be bought else where at cheaper prices or not too many people are buying. Either way, the demand is simply not high enough for ebay to be selling this.

@Kieransi Yeah, pretty sure there will be plenty of stock sitting on the shelf. My understanding is my store's distributor has plenty of boxes still. Sounds like a few places lacked the funds to buy more or simply didn't know where to buy from. I do believe FFG is limiting supply to the big online retailers like MM since they want local game stores to be selling their products. Even so, sounds like MM got plenty of boxes and opened a bunch of them.

They will sell through wave 1 but I doubt wave 2 will be off the shelves before wave 3, which is just going to sit in a warehouse for a long time.

What do Ebay fees matter in a discussion about whether buyers find a price palatable or not? Buyers don't care about the seller's fees or shipping costs, they only care about the price they are paying. And the prices listed on Ebay right now are exactly why listing aren't flying off the shelves.

To reiterate prices on Ebay for Awakenings only started to move up in the $140-160 range once all the waves were out in the wild and it was apparent that there would be no more product coming in the short term. While waves were still releasing, even while product wasn't on the shelf, Ebay prices were in the $115-125 range.

Why would buyers be willing to pay post Wave 3 prices on Ebay when we are Day 3 of Wave 1? The answer is they won't, because they can still reasonably expect to pay MSRP or less for the same product in 2ish weeks time. The fact that boxes aren't flying off if EBAY at $140+ days into Wave 1 is in no possible way indicative that they overproduced this set. That is simply a ludicrously illogical premise.

Additionally are you unaware that FFG has said this is the only print run if SoR, once it done it's done? The next set won't come out for another 4-6 months. FFG does not want each wave selling out before the next one hits as they want their product to have a consistent presence on store shelves. They want people to 3 months down the line be able to purchase SoR from their local store, not on Ebay for 150% MSRP at best.

It's absurd that you think the idea of this set possibly not completely selling out in a month and a half means it's overproduced. Look at any other successful CCG, they do not sell out of one set prior to the next sets release. Hell they don't sell out of a set until multiple sets later.

@ScottieATF Buyers always pay the fees/extra charges, be it credit card fees, shipping taxes, ebay, what have you. Often times it is including in the price but make no mistake, the seller calculates those fees into the price and the buyer pays them even if they do so unknowingly. There are a lot of claims about shortages and this set being underproduced. If that were the case, those ebay prices aren't unreasonable yet they aren't selling. So it isn't too difficult to figure out what has happened. Over producing happens all the time in CCGs. Fallen Empires has yet to sell out.

4 hours ago, ScottieATF said:

What do Ebay fees matter in a discussion about whether buyers find a price palatable or not? Buyers don't care about the seller's fees or shipping costs, they only care about the price they are paying. And the prices listed on Ebay right now are exactly why listing aren't flying off the shelves.

To reiterate prices on Ebay for Awakenings only started to move up in the $140-160 range once all the waves were out in the wild and it was apparent that there would be no more product coming in the short term. While waves were still releasing, even while product wasn't on the shelf, Ebay prices were in the $115-125 range.

Why would buyers be willing to pay post Wave 3 prices on Ebay when we are Day 3 of Wave 1? The answer is they won't, because they can still reasonably expect to pay MSRP or less for the same product in 2ish weeks time. The fact that boxes aren't flying off if EBAY at $140+ days into Wave 1 is in no possible way indicative that they overproduced this set. That is simply a ludicrously illogical premise.

Additionally are you unaware that FFG has said this is the only print run if SoR, once it done it's done? The next set won't come out for another 4-6 months. FFG does not want each wave selling out before the next one hits as they want their product to have a consistent presence on store shelves. They want people to 3 months down the line be able to purchase SoR from their local store, not on Ebay for 150% MSRP at best.

It's absurd that you think the idea of this set possibly not completely selling out in a month and a half means it's overproduced. Look at any other successful CCG, they do not sell out of one set prior to the next sets release. Hell they don't sell out of a set until multiple sets later.

double like this

2 hours ago, Mep said:

@ScottieATF Buyers always pay the fees/extra charges, be it credit card fees, shipping taxes, ebay, what have you. Often times it is including in the price but make no mistake, the seller calculates those fees into the price and the buyer pays them even if they do so unknowingly. There are a lot of claims about shortages and this set being underproduced. If that were the case, those ebay prices aren't unreasonable yet they aren't selling. So it isn't too difficult to figure out what has happened. Over producing happens all the time in CCGs. Fallen Empires has yet to sell out.

this has not been over produced or there would be loose packs everywhere, but there no were to be found (at the reasionable price)

My local store is flooded with them. They aren't moving on ebay so most stores are flooded with them too and the few places that didn't get much know enough to sit tight and forego ebay.

My plan:

- get all battlefields as singles (my LGS offers all cards as singles, so it's easy to get any card you really want + I'm CRAZY about battlefields)

- after that I will be just getting boosters from time to time and play local relaxed tournaments with booster draft rewards (it's fun and you can get some good cards too)

- and if I will be out of luck to get cards I want, I might buy one or two I would like to have in my collection (e.g. R2-D2)

17 hours ago, Mep said:

@ScottieATF Buyers always pay the fees/extra charges, be it credit card fees, shipping taxes, ebay, what have you. Often times it is including in the price but make no mistake, the seller calculates those fees into the price and the buyer pays them even if they do so unknowingly. There are a lot of claims about shortages and this set being underproduced. If that were the case, those ebay prices aren't unreasonable yet they aren't selling. So it isn't too difficult to figure out what has happened. Over producing happens all the time in CCGs. Fallen Empires has yet to sell out.

Buyers aren't concerned about what parts of a price are the sellers cost, fees, shipping, or profit margin; they only care how much it costs them in the end.

It doesn't matter if the price is "reasonable" from the sellers prospective, they aren't the ones buying it. From the buyers prospective the prices you're seeing on EBay are not reasonable as they are the prices you were seeing after Awakenings stock was already exhausted. We are days into Wave 1 of SoR, people are not at the point of being willing to pay over inflated prices yet. People not yet being willing to pay over inflated prices is not evidence of overproduction.

Proper stock of this game would not see it selling out at the rate you are expecting. FFG would not want this sets single print run exhausted within a month or two of it's release. How is that so difficult to understand?

6 hours ago, ScottieATF said:

Buyers aren't concerned about what parts of a price are the sellers cost, fees, shipping, or profit margin; they only care how much it costs them in the end.

It doesn't matter if the price is "reasonable" from the sellers prospective, they aren't the ones buying it. From the buyers prospective the prices you're seeing on EBay are not reasonable as they are the prices you were seeing after Awakenings stock was already exhausted. We are days into Wave 1 of SoR, people are not at the point of being willing to pay over inflated prices yet. People not yet being willing to pay over inflated prices is not evidence of overproduction.

Proper stock of this game would not see it selling out at the rate you are expecting. FFG would not want this sets single print run exhausted within a month or two of it's release. How is that so difficult to understand?

Anyone who buys on ebay needs to know that free shipping price includes the shipping costs and ebay fees. It's how that service works. Again, how is that difficult to understand? Let me guess, you don't tip your waiter and you expect everyone who sells on ebay to take a loss?

A few boxes are now starting to move on ebay but not many, so we shall see. All this talk about it being under produced is still silly right now.

I remember when MSRP on these boxes was 89.99, those were the days.

8 hours ago, Mep said:

Anyone who buys on ebay needs to know that free shipping price includes the shipping costs and ebay fees. It's how that service works. Again, how is that difficult to understand? Let me guess, you don't tip your waiter and you expect everyone who sells on ebay to take a loss?

A few boxes are now starting to move on ebay but not many, so we shall see. All this talk about it being under produced is still silly right now.

any talk of it being overproduced is silly right now

9 hours ago, Mep said:

Anyone who buys on ebay needs to know that free shipping price includes the shipping costs and ebay fees. It's how that service works. Again, how is that difficult to understand? Let me guess, you don't tip your waiter and you expect everyone who sells on ebay to take a loss?

A few boxes are now starting to move on ebay but not many, so we shall see. All this talk about it being under produced is still silly right now.

I actually work in the restaurant industry, so maybe this example will work for you.

My bar sells cocktails at $15. If other bars in the area sell cocktails of similar quality for $10, people won't be likely to patronize my bar. It doesn't matter to those people that my rent is higher then the other bars and that I have to price my cocktails that high to turn a similar profit, that isn't their concern. If the only advantage I have is that I'm a block closer, they'll just walk the extra block instead of spending the extra money. They won't view my prices as reasonable in comparison to the other places they can drink at, regardless of my cost and expenses.

That's what's occuring now. The only thing EBay is offering is that you might (depending on process time) get the product a week earlier then just holding out for Wave 2. Most people are not going to pay $40-50 extra just to get the same product a week early. People still have a reasonable expectation they will be able to buy product at or below MSRP, so they are not inclined to go 40% above that.

Nor is $140 a reasonable price once you do the math unless you believe a seller is entitled to 50% profit. Stores can purchase boxes at $70-75 per, even assuming a generous $30 for shipping and fees, that's $35-$45 return on each box. I'm not sure what business you work in, but that rate of return isn't a reasonable expectation.

Now I know that your retort is going to be well maybe the purchased the boxes they are trying to sell at a higher rate. Which would mean they bought them from other retailers in order to flip them to take advantage of the perception of product shortage. Not a particular laudable effort that consumers should be lining up to reward, since they are taking up product that could have went to end users at the price they purchased them at.

You're the one making assertions the the sets been overproduced based on a series of comically flawed premises.

1. You expect SoR to be selling day 1 what Awakenings was selling for after the distribution supply was exhausted. That makes no sense, even with how under produced Awakenings was it wasn't moving initially at that price.

2. You expect the intention is for the set to sell out within a month or two of release, and that not doing so means they made too much. Thatis terribly illogical when considering how CCGs function and FFG's own plan for production of this one.