Been toying with the idea of running double TIE/D defenders. Came up with this list I call Double D-Rolls.

Rexlar Brath: TiE/D, Tractor Beam, Predator 41 pts

Maarek Stele: TiE/D, Ion Cannon, Predator 41 pts

Howlrunner 18 pts

Definitely a formation focused group, but its pretty nasty. 1 reroll on the secondary weapons from Predator, 2 on the primary. With an extra reroll if they're low PS targets.

Colonel Vessery

-Juke, x7, Twin Ion Engine

Countess Ryad

-Push the Limit, x7, Twin Ion Engine

Deathfire

-Homing Missiles, Cluster Mines, Extra Munitions, Long Range Scanners

100pts

I would switch Mareek Stele for Colonel Vessary and put VI on him. His TL help reroll more than just the one die.

You have two extra points to throw on Howlrunner if you want or can stay at 98 points and take initiative.

1 hour ago, BadMotivator said:

Been toying with the idea of running double TIE/D defenders. Came up with this list I call Double D-Rolls.

Rexlar Brath: TiE/D, Tractor Beam, Predator 41 pts

Maarek Stele: TiE/D, Ion Cannon, Predator 41 pts

Howlrunner 18 pts

Definitely a formation focused group, but its pretty nasty. 1 reroll on the secondary weapons from Predator, 2 on the primary. With an extra reroll if they're low PS targets.

I'm a big fan of Expertise and Wampa instead. Gives bad targeting priority, and three terrifying ships.

I might also put two Ion Cannons, because doubling down on those is nasty. If you'd rather be less vulnerable to stress, go with Predator instead.

Rexler Brath(39)

[Rexler Brath(37), Twin Ion Engine Mk. II(1), Adaptability(0), Tractor Beam(1), TIE/D(0)]

Colonel Vessery(39)

[Colonel Vessery(35), Ion Cannon(3), Twin Ion Engine Mk. II(1), Adaptability(0), TIE/D(0)]

Omega Squadron Pilot(22)

[Omega Squadron Pilot(17), Juke(2), Comm Relay(3)]

Omega is there to start the TLs for Col. V...should hit pretty hard...

Vessary with Tie/D, Tractor Beam, and Ruthlessness is a lot of fun

As someone who has flown Double TIE/D defenders a few times, I do not believe Howlrunner is either necessary or useful for this type of list. You absolutely do not want to be stuck flying in formation. While Defenders are essentially jousting ships, in my experience, they perform better when you split them up.

Biophysical is the expert on Double Defenders, and I believe he even has a list he's been using to good effect recently. Perhaps he will chime in with his thoughts...

For myself, I've been constantly looking for ways to use the TIE/D title competitively. So far, the best list I've managed to come up with is:

Rexler w/ Expertise, TIE/D; flechette cannon, ion pulse missile & guidance chips = 46

Maarek w/ Predator, TIE/D & ion cannon = 41

Academy Pilot = 12

99

Actually, the original list was tractor beam on Rexler, as well as predator, and that left enough points to put hull upgrades on both defenders. However, with Dengaroo gone from the meta, the tractor beam is less needed (the only way this list had a hope of winning that matchup). The flechette cannon is actually quite useful these days, what with Mindlink lists and large-based ships dominating top tables everywhere. Also, the academy pilot as blocker helps (since denying tokens results in similar damage inflicted as the -1 agility from the tractor beam).

You do lose the ability to throw ships on rocks, but gain the potential to escort large bases off the table (the ion pulse missile is guaranteed to hit any ship with agility 2 or less---a serious threat to big ships that like to skirt the board edge). The list also possesses an excellent combination of control and firepower (and firing at PS 8 + 7 is a nice boon since these days, there are plenty of ships sitting in the PS 5 - 6 range).

1 hour ago, blade_mercurial said:

As someone who has flown Double TIE/D defenders a few times, I do not believe Howlrunner is either necessary or useful for this type of list. You absolutely do not want to be stuck flying in formation. While Defenders are essentially jousting ships, in my experience, they perform better when you split them up.

Biophysical is the expert on Double Defenders, and I believe he even has a list he's been using to good effect recently. Perhaps he will chime in with his thoughts...

For myself, I've been constantly looking for ways to use the TIE/D title competitively. So far, the best list I've managed to come up with is:

Rexler w/ Expertise, TIE/D; flechette cannon, ion pulse missile & guidance chips = 46

Maarek w/ Predator, TIE/D & ion cannon = 41

Academy Pilot = 12

99

My current favorite double TIE/D list is:

Rexler Brath, TIE/D, Expertise, Flechette Cannon, Engine Upgrade, Ion Pulse Missile = 50

Countess Ryad, TIE/D, Expertise, Ion Cannon, Engine Upgrade, Ion Pulse Missile = 48

I've found the Engine Upgrade is tremendously effective for allowing the Ds to engage when and where they want. It also lets them close and focus on targets that are separated from their squad and get out of or onto combat range. The K-turn (especially the variable length ones from the Countess) followed by a Boost is a maneuver that doesn't really register in most people's minds. Similarly, the 3-turn + Boost displaces a ton of space and can substitute, to a degree, for the K-turn if you're jousting a bit off axis with another ship.

The cannons are for incidental damage and control. The Ion Pulse Missiles effectively shrink the board for large base ships, substantially increasing the number of hazardous places on the board. They also have a niche use for ionizing targets in a list defended by Biggs.

Since we're giving specific information on how we fly competitive TIE/d'S, I actually prefer only one in a list, supported by an assortment of other threats/heavy hitters.

For example, Omega Leader and Duchess, or Whisper and an Acamedy pilot (if you can fit them) are a good time, as it really splits their target priority, and might let your defender into the endgame where it will really shine.

I've also flown OL, Ion/Predator Rexler, and Support Tomax Bren to good effect. Tomax is always the first target, leaving Rexler and OL alive for the middle/end game, which is definitely a good position to be in.

1 hour ago, Kreen said:

Since we're giving specific information on how we fly competitive TIE/d'S, I actually prefer only one in a list, supported by an assortment of other threats/heavy hitters.

For example, Omega Leader and Duchess, or Whisper and an Acamedy pilot (if you can fit them) are a good time, as it really splits their target priority, and might let your defender into the endgame where it will really shine.

I've also flown OL, Ion/Predator Rexler, and Support Tomax Bren to good effect. Tomax is always the first target, leaving Rexler and OL alive for the middle/end game, which is definitely a good position to be in.

Sure, there's tons of ways to fly it, but keep in mind that 2 TIE/D defenders serve a very similar role to throwing Whisper or Tomax Bren into the list. The 2nd TIE/D actually has comparable damage output, comparable point value (at least with Whisper) but has the added benefit of a control element (from the cannon) and is 'safer' due to its 3 hull + 3 shields (although to be fair, there are some things Whisper is more durable against and some things a defender is more durable against).

Both options have their merits and can be successful. However, I don't think Omega Leader is a good ship for the currently developing meta. Against Rebels, he's only useful against Biggs (a complete waste against a ghost or k-wings). Against Scum, he can still be as useful as always, but doesn't roll enough attack dice to for his cost imho. For the same points, you can get 4 attack ships such as Pure Sabaac or missile/torp laden bombers.

4 hours ago, blade_mercurial said:

Sure, there's tons of ways to fly it, but keep in mind that 2 TIE/D defenders serve a very similar role to throwing Whisper or Tomax Bren into the list. The 2nd TIE/D actually has comparable damage output, comparable point value (at least with Whisper) but has the added benefit of a control element (from the cannon) and is 'safer' due to its 3 hull + 3 shields (although to be fair, there are some things Whisper is more durable against and some things a defender is more durable against).

Both options have their merits and can be successful. However, I don't think Omega Leader is a good ship for the currently developing meta. Against Rebels, he's only useful against Biggs (a complete waste against a ghost or k-wings). Against Scum, he can still be as useful as always, but doesn't roll enough attack dice to for his cost imho. For the same points, you can get 4 attack ships such as Pure Sabaac or missile/torp laden bombers.

Good points all around.

I am a big fan of double D's, I just sometimes worry that they don't have the sticking power of, say, double Shadow casters, or something similar. A Ruthlessness Vessery may be a way to improve damage output, though, that is always rather risky.

I've also flown them rather extensively, as of five months ago, so my advice (as demonstrated) may not stack up as well in the current meta.

Having done some tinkering, this is one way to do Double D's with Sabaac, though it sits everyone at a less than stellar build sadly. You could always mess around a bit more and end up with a different loadout, which might work better. But I think that Pure Sabaac is generally going to be too expensive to fit with two (properly kitted out) D's.

TIE Striker: · "Pure Sabacc" (22)
Veteran Instincts (1)
Adaptive ailerons (0)
TIE Defender: · Countess Ryad (34)
Predator (3)
Flechette Cannon (2)
TIE/D (0)
TIE Defender: · Colonel Vessery (35)
Trick Shot (0)
Ion Cannon (3)
TIE/D (0)
-- TOTAL ------- 100p. --

8 hours ago, Kreen said:

I am a big fan of double D's, I just sometimes worry that they don't have the sticking power of, say, double Shadow casters, or something similar.

When you bring TIE/Ds, in my opinion, sticking power shouldn't really be in mind. You're not looking to outlast or endure, you're aiming to control and kill. Your hit points are expendable resources that allow you to soak some damage while you get into a position where damage and control from the cannons render an opposing ship non-threatening. It's not like a TIE/x7 list or traditional Imperial Aces where you plan to outlast an opponent through superior endurance.

6 hours ago, Biophysical said:

When you bring TIE/Ds, in my opinion, sticking power shouldn't really be in mind. You're not looking to outlast or endure, you're aiming to control and kill. Your hit points are expendable resources that allow you to soak some damage while you get into a position where damage and control from the cannons render an opposing ship non-threatening. It's not like a TIE/x7 list or traditional Imperial Aces where you plan to outlast an opponent through superior endurance.

...I've been flying Double D's wrong all this time. Huh. Well, there we go then. The more you know?

Well I flew the list. It did quite well vs a double B-wing+Jan Ors list. Granted it was vs a newer player, but putting up to 4 extra damage out reliably a turn was quite nice. Once I'd killed the HWK the B-wings were easy prey even though I only had Merrek left at that point.