I really like the concept of forced missions but imho investing 4 influence for a mission you might not win is a bit too much. So I thought about how I could make these missions viable:

- We are playing the frequently used house rule, draw two side missions, play one, discard the other, draw two new ones.

- When creating the side mission deck, in addition to the other cards, the imperial player may add one forced mission card of his choosing.

- When the forced mission is drawn, you play this mission directly and ignore the second card. One thing I am not sure about is what to do after the mission. Should we ...

1.) ... play the second card in addition as regular side mission? (thus played the forced mission as a "real" forced mission)

2.) ... discard the second card and go on with the next story mission? (thus basically substituting the regular side mission with the forced mission)

3.) ... discard the second card and go on with the next story mission but grant the "standard side mission rewards" in the forced mission? (the option I like most at the moment)

This way the forced mission serves as a kind of nasty suprise in the side mission deck for the imperial player and fits thematically very well as the rebels can never be sure when the empire catches up with them.

What do you guys think?

When you draw two, and one is a forced mission don't discard the other one.

once the forced mission is done, draw a new side mission and the rebels can choose between the first and the second...

Yeah, I always thought they were overpriced, too.

See, with Agenda missions that cost 3, there are actually some significant advantages that Forced Missions don't have-

1) The Rebels might ignore it, netting you the reward automatically

2) If the Rebels do attempt to block it, regardless of the outcome, you just ate up one of their valuable side mission opportunities.

3) Obviously, they're 1 influence cheaper.

I guess I just don't understand what you're getting with that extra influence. Forcing the Rebel to oppose you isn't an advantage, especially when it takes place outside of normal campaign structure.

And, personally, I don't find Forced Mission rewards to be that much better- are they?

I really like the idea of mixing forced missions into the side-mission deck. Perhaps there should be a some sort of cost associated with opting to do that? I'm not sure what but was thinking maybe the Imperial player could only choose 5 agenda sets if he opts to include any forced missions into the side-mission deck.

And I think I prefer Majushi's option for what to do once the forced mission is complete. That keeps the Imperial player from getting a forced mission for "free" and also blocking a side-mission slot. Taking away the Rebel side-missions should still come at a cost of 3 Influence.

I'm definitely going to have to try this.

57 minutes ago, subtrendy said:

I guess I just don't understand what you're getting with that extra influence. Forcing the Rebel to oppose you isn't an advantage, especially when it takes place outside of normal campaign structure.

And, personally, I don't find Forced Mission rewards to be that much better- are they?

I think the advantage is that the only risk is the influence spent. If the Rebels win they get nothing. No reward, no XP, no credits. All they did was prevent you from getting a reward.

That said: I don't think this outweighs any of your points, I agree that the rewards aren't that much better, and I would add that if the rebels do win then there has been no changes to the campaign and therefore the IP has wasted everyone's time by playing that card.

I like the idea of house ruling it, but I would offer the Rebels the chance to take a pass and just give the imperials the reward. As I said, they get nothing from a win so they might see it as a waste of time.

1 hour ago, Uninvited Guest said:

I think the advantage is that the only risk is the influence spent. If the Rebels win they get nothing. No reward, no XP, no credits. All they did was prevent you from getting a reward.

That said: I don't think this outweighs any of your points, I agree that the rewards aren't that much better, and I would add that if the rebels do win then there has been no changes to the campaign and therefore the IP has wasted everyone's time by playing that card.

I like the idea of house ruling it, but I would offer the Rebels the chance to take a pass and just give the imperials the reward. As I said, they get nothing from a win so they might see it as a waste of time.

Could just treat Force missions as regular agenda mission at 3 influence cost.

But it depends if you want to automatically include them in the side mission deck (which I think is fine with the above house rules, rebels are able to get their pick of the best side missions) or if you just want to find a way to make them less overcosted

I'm sure these issues are at least partly why we haven't really seen many forced missions (if any, I don't remember exactly) outside of the core box. They're overpriced, they're not really advantageous to anyone, they're kind of a nuisance, and they could potentially end up as a completely anti-climactic waste of time if the Rebels win.

The only value I see in forced missions are when they're directly tied to a previous mission played in the campaign- then, thematically, they make sense. They're actually a neat little point of continuity in a game that is otherwise pretty hit or miss in the storytelling department. Forced missions in agenda sets, though, I think are completely unnecesary.

I agree, they make more thematic sense as part of the campaign.

also they extend an already pretty long campaign when included, which is probably seen as a downside. That's my guess why the idea was scrapped

like in core, if you played 2 force missions and one of the ones from the story.. that's 13 missions before the finale. Extremely long

1 hour ago, frotes said:

Could just treat Force missions as regular agenda mission at 3 influence cost.

But it depends if you want to automatically include them in the side mission deck (which I think is fine with the above house rules, rebels are able to get their pick of the best side missions) or if you just want to find a way to make them less overcosted

This seems like a reasonable house rule that would maybe allow some of the forced missions to see some play.

If you do include them as side missions, the Rebel reward should obviously be the same as other influence side missions: 100 credits per hero, 1 XP and a bonus 100 credits per hero for a Rebel win. In four completed full length campaigns and an additional two that are still in progress, I have never played a forced mission. As the Imperial player, it's hard to justify the influence cost and even if the reward is good and I think I can win the mission, I feel bad about extending the already long campaign for a mission that has no reward for the rebels.

Also, I am not sure if there are crates on the forced mission maps but if there aren't, there should probably be at least two crates if a forced mission is played as a side mission.

if it's in the tier 2 item stage, an extra mission may get a careless/eager rebel to buy something you know they'll want to sell later and thus not only do you only risk influence but you also know that the mission will also eat Rebel credits.

Not saying that makes them better than the 3 influence Agenda missions because eating up a side mission slot when they are going to get a really good reward before the finale is a great choice.

9 hours ago, aRandomBoardGamingDude said:

if it's in the tier 2 item stage, an extra mission may get a careless/eager rebel to buy something you know they'll want to sell later and thus not only do you only risk influence but you also know that the mission will also eat Rebel credits.

You skip the upgrade stage entirely after a forced mission (or before in the case of Captured), so there is no additional chance to buy anything.

EDIT: Unless you mean they might buy something extra before the mission, but it just seems unlikely that they would do that to me. Possible, but unlikely.

38 minutes ago, Uninvited Guest said:

You skip the upgrade stage entirely after a forced mission (or before in the case of Captured), so there is no additional chance to buy anything.

EDIT: Unless you mean they might buy something extra before the mission, but it just seems unlikely that they would do that to me. Possible, but unlikely.

And even if they do- that's not so much a strategic move on the Empire's part, but a blunder for the Rebel that could have happened even without the forced mission. Plus, the Empire is always spending the 4 threat- in the grand scheme of things, they're the only guaranteed to waste resources on the endeavor.

if that Rebel has been having bad rolls with their weapon, the odds of this Rebel blunder go up significantly.

especially because they know they'll have to keep it for the forced mission and the next mission. They might have toughed it out with their starting weapon for maybe one more mission, but two?

Maybe.

I'm not saying that there aren't any advantages, but for 4 threat, it still seems like a very small and situational payoff.