47 minutes ago, SirEuain said:

Because Onyx is the default. Onyx is what is, or closest to be, expected. Why make a big deal about spoilers if it's picking up right where AEG left off?

Because they don't want people to know (just yet) about where they are starting the setting? It doesn't matter if it's Onyx, the beginning, somewhere in the middle, or thousands of years from where the game left off. The fact that any image would reveal where they will be starting the setting (Onyx people, too) would give that away. And, apparently, FFG doesn't want that. Onyx isn't the exception because that's where the story left off...

51 minutes ago, BayushiCroy said:

I sometimes agree with Sparks

Doesn't it leave ya with an icky feeling inside?

40 minutes ago, Sparks Duh said:

Because they don't want people to know (just yet) about where they are starting the setting? It doesn't matter if it's Onyx, the beginning, somewhere in the middle, or thousands of years from where the game left off. The fact that any image would reveal where they will be starting the setting (Onyx people, too) would give that away. And, apparently, FFG doesn't want that. Onyx isn't the exception because that's where the story left off...

And why on earth would they want that to be hidden? It'd give Spider players some relief, and the rest of us shrug and move on -- it was expected, after all. It wasn't a spoiler that the Dark Side would be in Ep VII. The name "Kylo Ren" was only a spoiler in the loosest sense. The identity of the character was. The lack of present tense in the script for "Darth" or "Sith" would have been.

If Daigotsu Kanpeki was in the spoiler shown, that itself isn't a spoiler. Having it be "Daigotsu Kanpeki, Penitent Emperor" would be. Having an Onisu as clan champion would be. Having Daigotsu as a personality again would be. These wouldn't be worth hiding if they'd been explicitly shown in the build-up to Onyx, but since they'd be rather sharp turns from the shape we all expected Onyx to take, they would be.

Without something significantly different from the expected, there's no reason for any personality's presence to be a spoiler.

Everything you say assumes the stance of starting where we left off.

Yet ffg was very clear a year and a half ago that can and will change any and everything they can and want.

Nothing is certain and they want to keep it that way until they start giving real, official info; which this spoiler would have done by accident.

They want to keep details scant, FFG has been in the game long enough to know that a small known detail can be quickly taken to negative depths by a speculate fan base.

19 minutes ago, Obscene said:

They want to keep details scant, FFG has been in the game long enough to know that a small known detail can be quickly taken to negative depths by a speculate fan base.

Horvath even joked about that when they were talking about not showing the cards. they know what we're like. they held back the cards BECAUSE of what we're like.

14 minutes ago, Obscene said:

They want to keep details scant, FFG has been in the game long enough to know that a small known detail can be quickly taken to negative depths by a speculate fan base.

Exactly. Simply put, the more information the player base has before a release (especially an anticipated one) the worse off it is. I mean, just look at the ****-show that came from a single poster with clan mons on it.

Every single (successful) gaming company does this. It's why they give out teasers instead of huge swaths of information about the game.

I think, in this case specifically, FFG knows they can't afford to botch this launch and the quickest way to do that is release information about the game prematurely.

It sucks from a player's perspective, but makes complete sense from a business standpoint.

19 hours ago, Barbacuo said:

Two boxes per play set could mean:

1) 4 card playset -> less card variety in the box and dinasty packs.

2) 2 card playset -> not this please. If I wanted to play HearthStone I'd stick to HearthStone

The two-card playset is what they used for their last two card games, and worries me a lot. It could be fun eventually, but I like decks to be more focused. Or maybe we are not going to use that many cards.

Edit: Or it could be that just 3 clans are included in the core set.

2 card playsets with a 30* card deck in Arkham Horror is pretty equivalent to 4 card playsets with a 60 card deck in mtg. It's actually slightly more consistent, because your opening hand is a larger portion of your total deck.

*it's actually usually 33 when you add in the unique card and weaknesses for the character.

4 hours ago, BayushiCroy said:

Everything you say assumes the stance of starting where we left off.

Yet ffg was very clear a year and a half ago that can and will change any and everything they can and want.

Nothing is certain and they want to keep it that way until they start giving real, official info; which this spoiler would have done by accident.

That was more or less my point, actually -- my thought was that FFG had confirmed they were invoking it.

That said, this other thread has corrupted major figures of other clans who were actively opposing Kanpeki, so it's not something I'm 100% on anymore:

https://community.fantasyflightgames.com/topic/243757-seven-clans-in-core-set/?do=findComment&comment=2675896

Releasing a tiny dribble of information about the content at this point would be a mistake, because you just know that half the playerbase will immediately declare that it's proof the new game will be garbage etc etc etc, while the other half will build sparkling castles in the sky doomed to be obliterated when the actual facts come out. Doesn't matter what the information is and what it implies about the game; people will run with it in both directions, half of them pre-emptively disappointed and the other half scheduled to be so when their own personal headcanon gets jossed. Nothing good comes of that approach. When April 19th rolls around FFG will presumably have a nice solid chunk of meat ready for everyone to chew on, and while you'll still get people declaring that L5R is over because they're using Onyx/they aren't using Onyx/they're doing their own version of Onyx, and other people declaring that the decision to use Onyx/not use Onyx/use a different version of Onyx means that XYZ is guaranteed to happen and it will be the awesomest thing ever, at least there will be real details to back up or refute the arguments.

4 hours ago, Vlad3theImpaler said:

2 card playsets with a 30* card deck in Arkham Horror is pretty equivalent to 4 card playsets with a 60 card deck in mtg. It's actually slightly more consistent, because your opening hand is a larger portion of your total deck.

*it's actually usually 33 when you add in the unique card and weaknesses for the character.

If you scale down the deck, you should also scale down every other aspect, like life points/honor, province resistence, etc, unless you make a "creature" heavy game, which in the end is not that fun (as HS demonstrated).

6 hours ago, Isawa Kioshi said:

Exactly. Simply put, the more information the player base has before a release (especially an anticipated one) the worse off it is. I mean, just look at the ****-show that came from a single poster with clan mons on it.

Every single (successful) gaming company does this. It's why they give out teasers instead of huge swaths of information about the game.

I think, in this case specifically, FFG knows they can't afford to botch this launch and the quickest way to do that is release information about the game prematurely.

It sucks from a player's perspective, but makes complete sense from a business standpoint.

But issues that could be perceived negatively by the community, might be fixed with enough time. And they won't have it. They'll throw their biggest printed run LCG into the wild without previous feedback. I won't wait to buy the coresets before quitting the game this time if I don't find it compelling beforehand.

As a side note, there is only a limited span of time when there were 7 Great Clans. They're assumed to be the default for the setting because of when the original RPG is set...

• 2 - 90 : Crab, Crane, Dragon, Ki-Rin, Lion, Phoenix, Scorpion
• 91 - 814 : Crab, Crane, Dragon, Lion, Phoenix, Scorpion
• 815 - 1123 : Crab, Crane, Dragon, Lion, Phoenix, Scorpion, Unicorn
• 1123 - 1127 : Crab, Crane, Dragon, Lion, Phoenix, Unicorn
• 1128 - 1175 : Crab, Crane, Dragon, Lion, Mantis, Phoenix, Scorpion, Unicorn
• 1176 - now : Crab, Crane, Dragon, Lion, Mantis, Phoenix, Scorpion, Spider, Unicorn

Assuming that we aren't going to be doing the Dawn of the Empire (the fashion and weapons are too modern, and I'd say that's a Unicorn Mon, not a Ki-Rin one) then we're stuck in the timeframe between the return of the Unicorn and the Scorpion Clan Coup. Which does make me think that the Core box set is during the lead up to the Scorpion Clan Coup: that is the time when the RPG 1st Ed is set.

7 minutes ago, Tonbo Karasu said:

Which does make me think that the Core box set is during the lead up to the Scorpion Clan Coup: that is the time when the RPG 1st Ed is set.

That would be neat ! I discovered L5R with the RPG and my first campaign was set during this era. Nostalgia is kicking hard. <3

55 minutes ago, Tonbo Karasu said:

As a side note, there is only a limited span of time when there were 7 Great Clans. They're assumed to be the default for the setting because of when the original RPG is set...

• 2 - 90 : Crab, Crane, Dragon, Ki-Rin, Lion, Phoenix, Scorpion
• 91 - 814 : Crab, Crane, Dragon, Lion, Phoenix, Scorpion
• 815 - 1123 : Crab, Crane, Dragon, Lion, Phoenix, Scorpion, Unicorn
• 1123 - 1127 : Crab, Crane, Dragon, Lion, Phoenix, Unicorn
• 1128 - 1175 : Crab, Crane, Dragon, Lion, Mantis, Phoenix, Scorpion, Unicorn
• 1176 - now : Crab, Crane, Dragon, Lion, Mantis, Phoenix, Scorpion, Spider, Unicorn

Assuming that we aren't going to be doing the Dawn of the Empire (the fashion and weapons are too modern, and I'd say that's a Unicorn Mon, not a Ki-Rin one) then we're stuck in the timeframe between the return of the Unicorn and the Scorpion Clan Coup. Which does make me think that the Core box set is during the lead up to the Scorpion Clan Coup: that is the time when the RPG 1st Ed is set.

There are 3 (at least) things that prevent us to have any certainty about the time period :

- They can add any number of clans as Deluxe Expansion as they want, so we could very well be in a time period with 8 or 9 clans, with those added later.

- Clans in the game is not the same as Great Clans in the story, there are a lot of examples of "factions" in the game that were not Great Clans (we could imagine the setting being after the SCC and still have Scorpion playable as a "hidden" clan).

- They theoretically can do whatever they want with the story. If they want to put the setting in the Iweko dynasty timeline retconning it without any Mantis or Spider Clan ever existing, as weird as it would seem, they can.

I'm not saying that we won't see a reboot to the Clan War era. I would not be surprised if they did it. But, the informations we have with those 7 clans mons are not enough to be sure of anything.

Starting the game pre-Scorpion-Clan Coup would be interesting.

The Core Set would be Rokugan with 7 great clans.

First Cycle could be Scorpion Clan Coup and its resolution with the Second Day of Thunder.

First Deluxe Could be Mantis, as the Minor Clan Alliance was born in that time frame.

Second Cycle would be... Hidden Emperor? (As long as no one mention rolling thunder )

Second Deluxe couldn't be Spider, though, as it's way too early for them to appear, but maybe Naga, or one of the existing factions (Hidden Scorpions)?

My bet is that they won't follow the previous storyline. So that if they start in a point similar to pre-Scorpion-coup era, it won't necessarily lead to a Scorpion's coup.

That'd be a pity. The Coup was much more interesting than the Hidden Emperor and the Shadow BS.

1 hour ago, Tonbo Karasu said:

As a side note, there is only a limited span of time when there were 7 Great Clans. They're assumed to be the default for the setting because of when the original RPG is set...

• 2 - 90 : Crab, Crane, Dragon, Ki-Rin, Lion, Phoenix, Scorpion
• 91 - 814 : Crab, Crane, Dragon, Lion, Phoenix, Scorpion
• 815 - 1123 : Crab, Crane, Dragon, Lion, Phoenix, Scorpion, Unicorn
• 1123 - 1127 : Crab, Crane, Dragon, Lion, Phoenix, Unicorn
• 1128 - 1175 : Crab, Crane, Dragon, Lion, Mantis, Phoenix, Scorpion, Unicorn
• 1176 - now : Crab, Crane, Dragon, Lion, Mantis, Phoenix, Scorpion, Spider, Unicorn

Assuming that we aren't going to be doing the Dawn of the Empire (the fashion and weapons are too modern, and I'd say that's a Unicorn Mon, not a Ki-Rin one) then we're stuck in the timeframe between the return of the Unicorn and the Scorpion Clan Coup. Which does make me think that the Core box set is during the lead up to the Scorpion Clan Coup: that is the time when the RPG 1st Ed is set.

It seems very odd to me to bother looking at in-universe dates when talking about how long any given number of factions have been around. Both "we are going back to before the Scorpion Clan Coup" and "we are jumping to 50 years after Kanpeki seized the throne" could result in the 7 clans being the starting factions in the game.

And anywhere in between-- "faction" was not always exactly equivalent to "officially recognized Great Clan".

6 minutes ago, Ser Nakata said:

Starting the game pre-Scorpion-Clan Coup would be interesting.

The Core Set would be Rokugan with 7 great clans.

First Cycle could be Scorpion Clan Coup and its resolution with the Second Day of Thunder.

First Deluxe Could be Mantis, as the Minor Clan Alliance was born in that time frame.

Second Cycle would be... Hidden Emperor? (As long as no one mention rolling thunder )

Second Deluxe couldn't be Spider, though, as it's way too early for them to appear, but maybe Naga, or one of the existing factions (Hidden Scorpions)?

You seem to be forgetting that "Shadowlands" need not be "Spider Clan".

Also... you know... "Toturi's Army"? I.e. Imperials/Ronin. Seems like it would be a more relevant part of the empire than the Naga.

Scorpion also need not be an officially recognized and sanctioned Great Clan to still be a significant force. It also seems quite unlikely to remove a faction already in existence.

5 minutes ago, Ser Nakata said:

That'd be a pity. The Coup was much more interesting than the Hidden Emperor and the Shadow BS.

If people wants to keep the "Interactive Story", Barbacuo has a good point. It won't necessarily lead to a Scorpion's Coup. Specially if the Scorpion Clan has a decision to make about doing the Coup or not. The result will surely not be the same. And maybe the Mantis and Spider Clan may never be in that alternate storyline. Who knows, if it's a totally new storyline.

Unless, there's no more Interactive Story and FFG will only take the old storyline as is, which removes the interaction with the story.

Both situations are plausible. I guess, it's wait and see. I will admit that I don't have much expectations on how FFG will handle the story...

Well, I think they could have the Coup in the time line and keep the Scorpion as a playable Faction. It's not because the game tells a story that the story needs to have so much influence on the game.

If you take the example of their other LCGs, the story advances without making any cards unplayable.

For example, in Starwars, or in AGoT, or even Destiny, for which there is a story (even though it's not driven by player interaction) there a cards of "dead" people that stay playable, or characters playable alongside cards from a different era from the story.

Don't you think it would be cool to have Toturi or Tsuko face off with Chagatai in battle?

6 minutes ago, Ser Nakata said:

For example, in Starwars, or in AGoT, or even Destiny, for which there is a story (even though it's not driven by player interaction) there a cards of "dead" people that stay playable, or characters playable alongside cards from a different era from the story.

This is kind of what I'm thinking they might do. There is precedent; there were plenty of characters killed off in certain arcs but their cards remained legal. I could definitely see lots of out of era or dead personalities remain as playable cards even as the story "moves on." In fact, if they want to get the nostalgia factor going I would think it best to print loved but out of era personalities from the game's history even if they never appear in the story. It worked with Dawn of the Empire.

Of course, we don't know what kind of story impact players can have yet. They could, for example, basically re-tell Clan Wars and have the Second Day of Thunder end up with Toturi on the throne no matter what but give us a bunch of story prizes relating to other points (though admittedly that is not as exciting.)

2 core sets = a 2 card playset.

I wonder if that's an indication of a retention of the fate and dynasty deck system

2 card play sets would indicate a 30 card deck, which makes two 30 card decks more likely - and most importantly more easily fit into a core set of 230~ cards trying to accommodate 7 clans.

15 unique cards per faction = 105 faction/dynasty cards

7 stronghold cards

Then around 110 neutral/fate cards

And to play with one core set you probably just take 2 faction's cards and mash them together for a starter deck?

For the time being all the seven mons really tells us for sure is that personalities from those seven factions are pretty much guaranteed to show up. I would hardly view it as an exclusive list of factions. And who knows, we might still see "alliances" where you basically play a non-clan faction (like the Gozoku or the Dragon-Unicorn-Toturi alliance at Beiden Pass) and hire people from whatever clans that you fancy (which could still be pretty cool depending on how they do it.)

As long as there won't be an alliance wheel like Conquest it's ok for me.

31 minutes ago, Suzume Tomonori said:

For the time being all the seven mons really tells us for sure is that personalities from those seven factions are pretty much guaranteed to show up. I would hardly view it as an exclusive list of factions. And who knows, we might still see "alliances" where you basically play a non-clan faction (like the Gozoku or the Dragon-Unicorn-Toturi alliance at Beiden Pass) and hire people from whatever clans that you fancy (which could still be pretty cool depending on how they do it.)

The marketing guy said that he played the game and he mentioned he was playing Crane and fighting Dragon. And mentioned Lion, Unicorn and I think Crab being in the game.