Does getting hit by a pilot critical with Determination mean that the card is just not dealt? They just straight up don't hit with it? Because that's pretty powerful for a one point EPT.

The card is dealt and then discarded without effect. It's a powerful ability when it triggers but since only 8 out of 33 damage cards are pilot crits it's possible to go through several games without being triggered.

Just follow what the card says. You get dealt a faceup damage card and it turns out to be a Pilot trait card, so Determination lets you instantly discard it without resolving the effect. The ability to discard the damage card does not prevent that card from being dealt, so Boba Fett's ability can still trigger.

Never thought about this, but does calculating hull damage count as "without resolving its effect"?

i.e. if a ship with Determination has only one hull left and gets dealt a pilot crit, is it destroyed?

If the card is discarded; how can it count against your hull?

1 hour ago, Dr Zoidberg said:

If the card is discarded; how can it count against your hull?

He means: does destroyed rule triggers in that split window when card is dealt to ship before is discarded.

3 hours ago, Vitalis said:

He means: does destroyed rule triggers in that split window when card is dealt to ship before is discarded.

And the answer is "no".

14 hours ago, WWHSD said:

The card is dealt and then discarded without effect. It's a powerful ability when it triggers but since only 8 out of 33 damage cards are pilot crits it's possible to go through several games without being triggered.

Which is why it's almost never played, but it would be hilarious against a Kylo Ren piloted shuttle since the assignment of his condition card is mandatory and the opponent can control who has it.

5 hours ago, sharrrp said:

Which is why it's almost never played, but it would be hilarious against a Kylo Ren piloted shuttle since the assignment of his condition card is mandatory and the opponent can control who has it.

I was thinking the exact same thing! Competitive Kylo is dead on arrival.

1 hour ago, A Curious Punnisher Player said:

I was thinking the exact same thing! Competitive Kylo is dead on arrival.

Not necessarily. Unless you put determination on all your ships some will be susceptible to Kylo's shenanigans. You can protect your most valuable asset but that probably won't be an optimal build.

2 minutes ago, Stoneface said:

Not necessarily. Unless you put determination on all your ships some will be susceptible to Kylo's shenanigans. You can protect your most valuable asset but that probably won't be an optimal build.

Definitely true. I was overzealous in my analysis. My thoughts are that Kylo will never become big in the meta when his counter costs one point.

12 minutes ago, A Curious Punnisher Player said:

Definitely true. I was overzealous in my analysis. My thoughts are that Kylo will never become big in the meta when his counter costs one point.

He could cause A LOT of hate and discontent with the ships not carrying Determination. I can see him effing up your support ship or a wingman while the rest of his minions harry your main threat. You're probably right about not being big in the meta though. But somebody will cook up an obscure squad with Kylo. I keep saying there are a lot of evil geniuses that play this game.

I'd be lying if I didn't say that I don't live for those fringe-meta underdog lists that had no business actually working. Love me some evil genius.

My Tie/ds does not give a sligthests of Fs about Kylo

Hmmm, actually I went back and double checked the ISYTDS card and it's ability is actually optional. Sort of. It's a little weird. It actually says when the condition is assigned to search through the deck for a pilot card. That part does not have a "may" so it's mandatory. However, the next line is "you may assign this to the condition card"

So, technically you are required to search the deck, but not required to actually assign the damage card. Then if there's no card on it it automatically leaves play.

So if someone with Determination shoots at Kylo piloting the shuttle just choose not to assign the damage card.

It doesn't make any difference - Kylo pilot only triggers the first time each round you're hit, so choosing not to enact just means nobody has it this round. It's not like you could choose not to give it to the first guy in order to pass it to the second.

But it does keep you from throwing away the next critical damage you deal to the Determinator.

7 hours ago, sharrrp said:

Hmmm, actually I went back and double checked the ISYTDS card and it's ability is actually optional. Sort of. It's a little weird. It actually says when the condition is assigned to search through the deck for a pilot card. That part does not have a "may" so it's mandatory. However, the next line is "you may assign this to the condition card"

So, technically you are required to search the deck, but not required to actually assign the damage card. Then if there's no card on it it automatically leaves play.

So if someone with Determination shoots at Kylo piloting the shuttle just choose not to assign the damage card.

When it comes to ISYTDS placing the card on the Condition is the ONLY thing that is optional. It happens to cover what happens if you couldn't find a Pilot card in the DD; it also means that the Condition will then leave play as there is no card on it. Do note that this ONLY happens when the condition first enters play; if the condition is already in play it just moves to the new ship.

If the condition is in play with a card on it and someone shoots the Kylo piloted shuttle Kylo gets so pissed at that ship that the condition just moves to that new target. When it moves it KEEPS the card it has on it so there is no new search which may or may not find a card. Thus the guy with Determination CAN force ISYTDS onto that ship and there is NOTHING Kylo-pilot can do about it.

19 hours ago, StevenO said:

When it comes to ISYTDS placing the card on the Condition is the ONLY thing that is optional. It happens to cover what happens if you couldn't find a Pilot card in the DD; it also means that the Condition will then leave play as there is no card on it. Do note that this ONLY happens when the condition first enters play; if the condition is already in play it just moves to the new ship.

If the condition is in play with a card on it and someone shoots the Kylo piloted shuttle Kylo gets so pissed at that ship that the condition just moves to that new target. When it moves it KEEPS the card it has on it so there is no new search which may or may not find a card. Thus the guy with Determination CAN force ISYTDS onto that ship and there is NOTHING Kylo-pilot can do about it.

I thought of that but it's still easy enough to avoid, just don't assign a card at all if there's any determination in play, even if someone else shoots and you're fine. You are just conceding Kylo's ability at that point but that's probably better than having damage auto-blocked

6 hours ago, sharrrp said:

I thought of that but it's still easy enough to avoid, just don't assign a card at all if there's any determination in play, even if someone else shoots and you're fine. You are just conceding Kylo's ability at that point but that's probably better than having damage auto-blocked

If you're bringing Kylo and choosing not to find cards with the Condition all because someone had Determination I'd certainly consider that a WIN! for the guy with Determination.

Admittedly if someone with Determination is always going to be "suffering" from ISYTDS it probably is better to just forget about it.

On 3/14/2017 at 1:11 AM, Vitalis said:

My Tie/ds does not give a sligthests of Fs about Kylo

Is that because the blinded only affects the cannon shot?

I think that's how it works

1 hour ago, Velvetelvis said:

Is that because the blinded only affects the cannon shot?

I think that's how it works

Exacly - BP is flipped on the first opportunity to attack. Blinded on Vessery? How tragic i wont tractor your deci. Blinded on Ryad? How tragic i wont shoot ion on your deci

Only if you use the old deck. The new deck doesn't work that way.

If you do get gunner or double attack effects though particularly with a turret, then using the old deck might be a good strategy against Kylo. Especially if you don't have or don't much care about your ept and pilot ability.

3 hours ago, Vitalis said:

Exacly - BP is flipped on the first opportunity to attack. Blinded on Vessery? How tragic i wont tractor your deci. Blinded on Ryad? How tragic i wont shoot ion on your deci

Well, in that case, I'll Destroy Vessery's cockpit turning him to 0 PS, forcing Ryad to not spend her Target Lock if you want to use vessery's ability. Then I'll shake Ryad, prohibiting her from assigning straight maneuvers. Finally, If time permits, I'll stun both, so everytime you overlap my deci, they take 1 damage.

2 hours ago, thespaceinvader said:

Only if you use the old deck. The new deck doesn't work that way.

If you do get gunner or double attack effects though particularly with a turret, then using the old deck might be a good strategy against Kylo. Especially if you don't have or don't much care about your ept and pilot ability.

Right i forgot that new BP says "you cannot perform attacks". And old DD is way more painfull on 2xTieD+Bomber list...(Munitions failure!!!! And injured pilot would also not be nice especially on Vessery with Score - it does not shut down condition )

5 minutes ago, Jehan Menasis said:

Well, in that case, I'll Destroy Vessery's cockpit turning him to 0 PS, forcing Ryad to not spend her Target Lock if you want to use vessery's ability. Then I'll shake Ryad, prohibiting her from assigning straight maneuvers. Finally, If time permits, I'll stun both, so everytime you overlap my deci, they take 1 damage.

Lock is not an issue as i have a bomber nearby to support lock for Vessery - PS0 would be a deal due to tractor shooting last

Yea ofc this list is not invincible vs deci (but still has a good matchup) but i though (thespaceinvader corrected me) that Tie/Ds are immune to blindeds that are usually first crits you shove - especially inexperienced players do that.