Mists of Bilehall - Juliden's Keep

By Psymia, in Descent: Journeys in the Dark

Posted at

Our group will play the quest Juliden's Keep from Mists of Bilehall.
The rules state that Juliden is a monster in it's own group.
However it doesn't have any health, cannot suffer any :Heart:, Conditions or be defeated.
How would this play out in combination with the Overlord card "Call of the Ravens" and it's Servant "Raven Flock".

In my interpretation I am allowed to place the Raven Flock and then deal 4 damage to Juliden.
Since Juliden doesn't take damage nothing will happen.

My group argues that since Juliden doesn't have any Health I am not allowed to deal damage to it.

Edited by Psymia
Posted at

RAW I think you are correct.

Exhaust this card at the start of your turn and choose 1 monster. Place 1 Raven Flock Servant token in a space adjacent to that monster. Then, that monster suffers 4 .

The monster suffering the 4 hearts is not a condition to create the flock, so choosing a monster group protected from damage by quest rules is not a problem.

I don't have the mists of bilehall quest book to check the wording on the quest though, but if it is worded as you stated, I don't see an issue.

Edit: Found a similar precedent

Edit 2: Followed the source link (https://boardgamegeek.com/article/22863199#22863199) found out it was YOU who asked the question.... now I'm just confused.

Q: We played the quest Nightmare of the Shadow of Nerekhall expansion . I have the Overlord card "Call of the Ravens". The quest rules state that the apparitions can only take damage from an attack targeting them. According to the Call of the Ravens i have to:
  • Exhaust this card at the start of your turn and choose 1 monster."
    • I choose one of the apparitions.
  • Place 1 Raven Flock Servant token in a space adjacent to that monster.
    • I place the raven flock adjacent to that apparition.
  • Then, that monster suffers 4 Heart.
    • I deal 4 damage to the apparition. But since the rules state that the apparitions only take damage from attacks targeting them, nothing happens.

Is this correct?

A: Yes, you are correct.

Source[2] Kara Centell-Dunk, Game Developer, Fantasy Flight Games

Edited by Silidus
Posted at

Well this is a different quest.
And the apparitions actually have a way of being defeated.
--> The heroes can target and attack them.

Posted at

Fair enough (sorry if that came across as accusatory,.. it was more of a "wait... what? Using a post of a user on one forum to prove precedent to the same user on a different forum.. lol")

Anyway, it stands in principle, if a unit is treated as a monster, and quest rules prevent it from taking damage from a given (or any, or all but a given) source, it is still a valid target for Flock of Ravens, and does not take damage from the resulting side effect.

Posted at

So we're in the middle of the quest now and i'm playing it that i'm allowed to to spawn the raven flock on juliden.
Silidus, thank you for the argument that the trigger is "placing it next to a monster" and the subsequent 4 damage are a consequence of this trigger.

I'm still not sure how much this changes the balance since it's now 3 monsters a turn on juliden instead of 2 zombies.
Will see next week when we finish the quest :)

Edited by Psymia
Posted at

Full disclaimer: While my group agrees it's RAW, it's not in the spirit of this card. This card is intended to have a cost (4 damage to another monster) and circumventing the cost shifts the power level of this card considerably in favor of the overlord (too much in their opinion).

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I have to ask... what does the abbrevation RAW mean?

Posted at
31 minutes ago, liquidsnake1989 said:

I have to ask... what does the abbrevation RAW mean?

Rules As Written. It is usually opposed to RAI = Rules As Intended.