Welcome to the Dark Side.

The loss of the top meta obviously has a lot of people upset, but I have to say that what really bothers me is seeing just how ugly the competitive scene can be.

Players who think stealing a Palpatine out of a Raider is OK because FFG screwed them into needing that card to win tournaments.

Players who drop $300 on X-Wing not out of a love for the game, but to score 3 JM5Ks to win with a net list.

Players who are livid that a card that has exact $0 in intrinsic value has somehow "lost value" from the $90 they paid on the open market.

The conspiracy theory that FFG is out to make money on this game (hint, they are).

The dark underbelly of competitive X-Wing is revealed, and it smells worse than a split tauntaun.

At the end of the day it is a GAME , if you're not having fun even if you're competitive, what's the point?

4 minutes ago, Phoenix5454 said:

At the end of the day it is a GAME , if you're not having fun even if you're competitive, what's the point?

Crush the spirit of my enemies, and here the lamentations of their woman, to run them over with my car... (+1 if you get the car reference.)

16 minutes ago, Darth Meanie said:

Welcome to the Dark Side.

The loss of the top meta obviously has a lot of people upset, but I have to say that what really bothers me is seeing just how ugly the competitive scene can be.

Players who think stealing a Palpatine out of a Raider is OK because FFG screwed them into needing that card to win tournaments.

Players who drop $300 on X-Wing not out of a love for the game, but to score 3 JM5Ks to win with a net list.

Players who are livid that a card that has exact $0 in intrinsic value has somehow "lost value" from the $90 they paid on the open market.

The conspiracy theory that FFG is out to make money on this game (hint, they are).

The dark underbelly of competitive X-Wing is revealed, and it smells worse than a split tauntaun.

I wouldn't say it awakens, but every time there's a change the nasty garbage seems to swirl to the top until people play with the new rules this weekend and have positive things to say. It's always been there, but it's allot harder to notice if you spend all your time in certain threads... (Like me, and my unhealthy habit of spending to much time in the rebels discussion thread... or maybe not enough?)

28 minutes ago, Darth Meanie said:

Welcome to the Dark Side.

The loss of the top meta obviously has a lot of people upset, but I have to say that what really bothers me is seeing just how ugly the competitive scene can be.

Players who think stealing a Palpatine out of a Raider is OK because FFG screwed them into needing that card to win tournaments.

Players who drop $300 on X-Wing not out of a love for the game, but to score 3 JM5Ks to win with a net list.

Players who are livid that a card that has exact $0 in intrinsic value has somehow "lost value" from the $90 they paid on the open market.

The conspiracy theory that FFG is out to make money on this game (hint, they are).

The dark underbelly of competitive X-Wing is revealed, and it smells worse than a split tauntaun.

There are these kinds of people in every segment of society unfortunately. I love the X-Wing community because they are friendly awesome people who enjoy Star Wars as much as I do but there are still a few rotten apples.

8 hours ago, MenaceNsobriety said:

There are these kinds of people in every segment of society unfortunately. I love the X-Wing community because they are friendly awesome people who enjoy Star Wars as much as I do but there are still a few rotten apples.

Exactly this. X-Wing may have started out with a more casual spirit but the tournament scene has become like 40K. This isn't really anyone's fault. FFG want to make a good game and should be applauded for their success. Players are competitive by nature and tournaments attract the most competitive players.

When you have a player base of thousands, it is inevitable that play-testing fairly quickly reveals some optimum lists. These then get spread on fora such as this one and the whole thing becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy.

8 hours ago, Darth Meanie said:

Players who drop $300 on X-Wing not out of a love for the game, but to score 3 JM5Ks to win with a net list.

How is this in any way 'ugly' ?

Why are somebody's reasons to buy x-wing ships and way to play the game and have fun 'worse' than somebody else's?

I agree. Fun means different things to different people. For some people, the excitement of a tense, closely fought game between their optimised list and another player's bets list is fun. If competitive play were objectively "less fun" than casual play, people wouldn't do it.

Wanting to win doesn't make a player "ugly". Wanting to win at the expense of fun and being unpleasant about it can be but most competitive players are not like this in my experience.

I played a game yesterday where a ship was borderline range 3. In attempting to measure it, one of the ships got knocked. We both looked at each, shrugged and agreed to roll a dice to see whether the ship could take the shot or not. As long as you keep it fun and remember it is just a game, there is nothing wrong with playing competitively.

10 minutes ago, LordBlades said:

How is this in any way 'ugly' ?

It is not ugly; just STUPID.

Why are somebody's reasons to buy x-wing ships and way to play the game and have fun 'worse' than somebody else's?

Some of these people are here full of hate for FFG now... these are the wrong and as usual ridiculous somebodies in the community.

You do not see casual players screaming like victims because of this heavy duty faq...

Some people have fun winning.

With FAQ these people might either leave or adapt.

If you have fun flying ships then just avoid those people and play casual.

Nothing wrong, there's gotta be at least 2 others who are willing to play oddball games.

Me, i'm putting finishing touches to a Mining variant (it's something like Pirates of the Spanish Main but with Asteroids and small base ships - I'm really conflicted on how to handle the mined goods though)

This competitive vs casual catfight is very tiresome.

19 minutes ago, Joe Boss Red Seven said:

That's like, your opinion man.

Just because you don't understand or enjoy a style of play that doesn't make it stupid

It's all nice to "play casual and have fun" but some people have fun only (or mostly) if they're winning, while others find it difficult to have fun if they're losing... especially if they're losing badly (I admit, I'm one of the latter). I can't really blame the people who bought 3 jumpmasters because I recall quite vividly how much un-fun it got back in the summer when it felt that if you're not running u-boats, your chances of winning - or even making the cut - in a large tournament are slim to none. When you have a choice whether you want to get constantly frustrated by losing in one unfair match after another or to simply level the playing field and pick the obviously dominant list, I'd say the latter makes much more sense. I resisted to jump that bandwagon (or the Dengaroo bandwagon, or the defender bandwagon, or the Paratanni bandwagon) out of sheer pride and desire to win with something I invented on my own but I suppose this kind of approach is illogical and is actually a weakness on my part. Either way, buying ships needed to field a dominant list is not mutually exclusive with "loving the game". Sometimes to appreciate the game you simply need to play whatever gives you a chance of winning, no matter what's on the other side of the table. Otherwise the game becomes really hard to love.

I think this accusation to "competitive players" of being somehow immature and whiny is preposterous. Who's familiar with the concept of "Spikes" from MTG knows what they are. Spikes just want to win. That's their thing. They'll try and play the most efficient deck as possible. Pro players are Spikes, by their own nature. But the truth is, most pro players are the epitome of sportsmanship. And no, they don't care about cards being banned or changes in the meta. These things happen all the time, there's nothing to complain about. They adapt immediately, go back to the drawing board. That's what makes them Spikes. They don't whine, they deal with it and go find the next best thing.

(Side note: I don't think pro players really exist in X-Wing, because there's not really a lot of money, if any, to be made there, but the principle remains the same for the Paul Heaver-level guys.)

Speaking as an inherenty non-competitive player: Competitive players aren't immature. Immature players are immature.

15 minutes ago, LordBlades said:

That's like, your opinion man.

Just because you don't understand or enjoy a style of play that doesn't make it stupid

I am one of the troublesome people in the world who bases their opinions on REAL WORLD EXPERIENCE... not via a so called smart-phone, and not over the course of a few minutes or days or during one event either.

10 minutes ago, Joe Boss Red Seven said:

I am one of the troublesome people in the world who bases their opinions on REAL WORLD EXPERIENCE... not via a so called smart-phone, and not over the course of a few minutes or days or during one event either.

Yet, you seem to dismiss a playstyle that many people enjoy as 'stupid'.

Why is it so hard for some people to respect others' decision to enjoy the game differently than they do ?

1 minute ago, LordBlades said:

Yet, you seem to dismiss a playstyle that many people enjoy as 'stupid'.

Why is it so hard for some people to respect others' right to enjoy the game differently than they do ?

Some people do stupid things because they are trying to win a game; like spend a lot of money for a few WINNING CARDS...

DAT... IS... STUPID; especially when you are full of hate now for FFG because they changed things in a MUCH NEEDED FAQ.

this is all a load of rubbish. a vocal minority of entitled idiots who like to shout loudly online about how much the world hates them do not represent the majority of us. 99% of all tournament players (at least here in the UK) are superb people, who i am always happy to see across the table.

1 hour ago, Stay On The Leader said:

This competitive vs casual catfight is very tiresome.

Casuals should not have access to the best gear. They haven't worked for it.

12 minutes ago, Xerandar said:

Casuals should not have access to the best gear. They haven't worked for it.

There you go again; trying to make PLAYING A GAME : work .

If tourney players can't adapt to official rules updates then they will die off Darwin style, no matter how much 'work'they have put into their cloned lists.

4 minutes ago, GrimmyV said:

If tourney players can't adapt to official rules updates then they will die off Darwin style, no matter how much 'work'they have put into their cloned lists .

1 hour ago, Joe Boss Red Seven said:

Some people do stupid things because they are trying to win a game; like spend a lot of money for a few WINNING CARDS...

DAT... IS... STUPID;

It's no more stupid than spending a lot of money for x-wing ships to play casually or just to look at them.

These guys have a hobby: competitive x-wing. They invest their money into stuff that makes them enjoy their hobby more (competitive ships and cards to make competitive squads with). That's perfectly normal in my book.

7 minutes ago, LordBlades said:

It's no more stupid than spending a lot of money for x-wing ships to play casually or just to look at them.

These guys have a hobby: competitive x-wing. They invest their money into stuff that makes them enjoy their hobby more (competitive ships and cards to make competitive squads with). That's perfectly normal in my book.

Yah but... I'm not mad at FFG, neither are most of my Star Brothers here either.

11 hours ago, Darth Meanie said:

Players who drop $300 on X-Wing not out of a love for the game, but to score 3 JM5Ks to win with a net list.

Well this isn't me because I don't play tournaments and only have a mediocre win/loss ratio. But I don't see a problem with this one either. Many buy X-Wing for a variety of reasons, to compete, to win, to play casual, to just look at the miniature. Honestly for what little bit that I gotten to play you might think I just buy to collect them. Regardless of that, I have bought expansions, that I may never play, just for the cards; just like those who buy them to compete in tournaments. The card was a good fit for one or more of my ships and I wanted to support FFG.

I can see how someone, after spending so much, who finds the card that cost so much no longer has the same ability could get very frustrated. Sure, I get. But it is a 'Living Game' so, as much as it is a pain, it should be expected. That however doesn't make it less frustrating.

Me? Since I'm more of a casual player and collector my frustrations come from other areas of the game. So nothing is really perfect. To misquote Lincoln 'You can please all the people some of the time, and some of the people all the time, but you cannot please all the people all the time.'