After Two Big expansion and two small expansions, what do you think about using Subversive tactics in Jabba's realm? Is it still Overpowered?

Savage Weponry is useless on Onar, ST starts very slow (prey upon doubt), no defensive abilities.....Do you think that now, with all updates, another Imperial Class deserve the "Best IP Class" title? Maybe Hutt mercenary?

I think at this point, people have pretty much come to the conclusion that, much like a video game, the difficulty level of IA can be adjusted. ST typically means the Rebels are playing Hard Mode. As long as all players are aware of this, and the Imperial player doesn't abuse it just to constantly guarantee success, I think it's probably fine.

As an Imp player, though, I have to say- I don't think I'd ever play it. Seems more like a fun killer than anything.

I've never actually played or played against ST, but from what people have said the problem seems to be less 'it's OP' and more 'you've got to specifically build your characters to go up against it, it's not fun to play against, and it murders new players'. In that light, yes, I'd imagine a case could be made for other decks.

One thing worth noting with regards to Jabba's Realm is that none of the new characters (Shyla, Vinto and especially Onar) are very strain-heavy characters. If your rebels are likely to pick these heroes just because they're new I suspect that you'll find subversive tactics might not be quite the overwhelming force that it was against some of the core heroes.

ST is about taking away rebels abilities so it's always going to be a bit anti fun. But as for its power level, as long as the rebels pick a balanced group with support and are experienced with IA, I think it s actually weaker than the other 2 core box classes along with a few of the new ones that have come out

If the Rebels have MHD and/or Murne and use light on strain heroes, ST has a hard time making the strain stick to get bonuses off it

The new heroes that have come out are pretty good in that they are either lighter on strain usage or have good endurance/ways to recover

ST is also really lacking in defense. If the objective is for the heroes to kill a particular figure, you don't have a lot to keep them from doing that.

What is so a good IP class against new heroes?

9 hours ago, ManateeX said:

One thing worth noting with regards to Jabba's Realm is that none of the new characters (Shyla, Vinto and especially Onar) are very strain-heavy characters. If your rebels are likely to pick these heroes just because they're new I suspect that you'll find subversive tactics might not be quite the overwhelming force that it was against some of the core heroes.

9 hours ago, Eyfrosyne said:

What is so a good IP class against new heroes?

I don't know that I'd be able to pick one specific class as being particularly good against them, but you probably can't go wrong with a classic like Military Might. The +2 health upgrade from Assault Armour would help your troopers to survive against Vinto's relentless 1-damage attacks, and troopers are also a good option if you're trying to wound Onar (since he has no defence a large number of weaker attacks can pile up the damage very quickly). Other than Vinto the new guys don't really damage more than one figure at a time, so having a bunch of trooper figures on the map is also a good way to make them waste activations killing one guy at a time.

I should say, though, that that's all based on theory (and could be coloured by the builds I chose for those characters the one and only time that I've used them). The imperial in my campaign is running the new mercenary class deck and I think he's having some success with it, especially with the 4XP card that grants all the surge abilities to the imperials (the name of the card escapes me). I've really had to play around that extra damage by spending my credits on armour to keep my guys alive that would have otherwise been able to go to better weapons.

ST is good but it can be countered. I think Military Might is actually a stronger class deck overall. I let my players know I was going to run ST beforehand and they picked Fenn and Gideon and had no problems dealing with any strain I was dishing out.

10 hours ago, Eyfrosyne said:

What is so a good IP class against new heroes?

My personal tier rating of the classes current with all expac

S - tech sup

A - military might, sub tactics (A/B depends on rebel group setup), armored onslaught (mainly mortar), hunt merc (jury is still out)

B - black ops, Nemeses (jury is still out), inspiring leadership (if no fenn/lots of cleave. IP needs good tactics to make use of cards)

C - precision training, inspiring leadership (if Fenn or lots of cleave around)

I could go into details about why if people want to discuss (maybe another thread :D)

ST was never OP, it has 1 underpointed card but it never ends up more powerful than other decks.

It's going to be hard prying Nemeses out of my hands since it lets me finally use these stupid villains I've bought and painted rather than have them sit their gathering dust.

17 minutes ago, Union said:

It's going to be hard prying Nemeses out of my hands since it lets me finally use these stupid villains I've bought and painted rather than have them sit their gathering dust.

This x1000.

I have nemesis in one campaign right now, and I'm starting another with a different group this weekend. I know I should branch out, since I've only played a few campaigns so far, but it's so much fun- and still allows for some decent builds.

In fact, as far as the "fun" factor goes, I'd say that it is on the complete other side of the spectrum from ST. While ST simply takes away Rebel abilities (yay! less gameplay options!) Nemesis lets the heroes face off against some scary (but satisfying) big bads.

I think Nemeses has been a standout class and I'm very happy they made it. Most thematic class deck for sure

3 hours ago, frotes said:

I think Nemeses has been a standout class and I'm very happy they made it. Most thematic class deck for sure

Right now I'm running "The B Team", Blaise and Bossk. I should paint a mohican and some gold chains on Bossk.

23 hours ago, frotes said:

My personal tier rating of the classes current with all expac

S - tech sup

A - military might, sub tactics (A/B depends on rebel group setup), armored onslaught (mainly mortar), hunt merc (jury is still out)

B - black ops, Nemeses (jury is still out), inspiring leadership (if no fenn/lots of cleave. IP needs good tactics to make use of cards)

C - precision training, inspiring leadership (if Fenn or lots of cleave around)

I could go into details about why if people want to discuss (maybe another thread :D)

Well, I would like to know your opinion fell free to write here.

23 hours ago, ManateeX said:

I don't know that I'd be able to pick one specific class as being particularly good against them, but you probably can't go wrong with a classic like Military Might. The +2 health upgrade from Assault Armour would help your troopers to survive against Vinto's relentless 1-damage attacks, and troopers are also a good option if you're trying to wound Onar (since he has no defence a large number of weaker attacks can pile up the damage very quickly). Other than Vinto the new guys don't really damage more than one figure at a time, so having a bunch of trooper figures on the map is also a good way to make them waste activations killing one guy at a time.

I should say, though, that that's all based on theory (and could be coloured by the builds I chose for those characters the one and only time that I've used them). The imperial in my campaign is running the new mercenary class deck and I think he's having some success with it, especially with the 4XP card that grants all the surge abilities to the imperials (the name of the card escapes me). I've really had to play around that extra damage by spending my credits on armour to keep my guys alive that would have otherwise been able to go to better weapons.

I read many writing MM is still the toughest IP class to play against, it has the strongest 0xp ability I think.

I don't have Jabba's realm, I read some times ago (When JR was released) that Hutt Mercenary was really strong, the ultimate IP class.

Military Might is a strong starter (Rebels play catch-up).

Tech Superiority is a strong finisher (IP plays catch-up).

Inspiring Leadership gives an IP with good planning and positioning skills great combos.

Imperial Black Ops is about Hidden, swapping beneficial conditions, and surges.

Hutt Mercenaries and Nemeses are thematic decks approached in different ways (mercenaries vs. villains). (Have not played full campaigns with either.)

Armored Onslaught for machines. (Not played.)

Precision Training increases the consistency of attacks, but lacks in defense (and attacks boosts except Find the Weakness which you should get first - using threat for Versatile Attack and Exacting Strike seems so overpriced).

Cross-pollinating the class decks with different campaigns should produce interesting results. (I for one would like to try Inspiring Leadership with Return to Hoth.)

4 minutes ago, a1bert said:

Cross-pollinating the class decks with different campaigns should produce interesting results. (I for one would like to try Inspiring Leadership with Return to Hoth.)

This is true, and I'll also add that decks can also play really differently based on the heroes you're up against (as we've already talked about with Subversive Tactics vs. low-strain heroes).

For example, in my current JR campaign I'm playing the three new guys and Biv. Three of those heroes always want to be up-close for their attacks (although I guess Onar could technically have been built either way) which isn't that much of a problem most of the time. But if that same group was up against Imperial Black Ops and the card that makes melee attacks have to pass an accuracy test they'd have a really, really bad time. As a rebel with those heroes facing that deck you'd almost have to build your whole team with that one card in mind, which I think is really cool from a replayability standpoint.

So I guess what I'm saying is that it's hard to say with certainty that deck A is better than deck B, since as with anything else in this game it's all situational. Personally I just go with whatever strikes me as cool or fun, and then once I see which rebels I'm up against I enjoy trying to figure out ways to best build the deck to play against them.

3 hours ago, Eyfrosyne said:

Well, I would like to know your opinion fell free to write here.

I don't want to derail this thread that much and wasn't really planning on writing full details on each, just a general ranking on each. If you have something you want to know about one of them, I can try to give my experiences on it.

A1bert has listed some good thoughts on a few of the classes and I'm sure you can find good discussions on each class in threads on here or on bgg

On 3/9/2017 at 0:07 PM, a1bert said:

Military Might is a strong starter (Rebels play catch-up).

Tech Superiority is a strong finisher (IP plays catch-up).

Inspiring Leadership gives an IP with good planning and positioning skills great combos.

Imperial Black Ops is about Hidden, swapping beneficial conditions, and surges.

Hutt Mercenaries and Nemeses are thematic decks approached in different ways (mercenaries vs. villains). (Have not played full campaigns with either.)

Armored Onslaught for machines. (Not played.)

Precision Training increases the consistency of attacks, but lacks in defense (and attacks boosts except Find the Weakness which you should get first - using threat for Versatile Attack and Exacting Strike seems so overpriced).

Cross-pollinating the class decks with different campaigns should produce interesting results. (I for one would like to try Inspiring Leadership with Return to Hoth.)

Currently running Inspiring Leadership with Return to Hoth in my play by forum campaign here: https://boardgamegeek.com/thread/1694594/i-find-your-lack-faith-disturbing-swia040/

The deck itself is pretty fun although I think I would have probably fared better had I gone with my initial plan of using Technological Superiority. However, the deck does have some strengths. I haven't gotten either of the 4xp cards yet but I have found a lot of value in Strategic Planning and would definitely recommend picking that up as the first XP purchase. It gives so much flexibility and makes the Rebels really have to really think about what to kill because already activated units are still a threat. The greatest weakness of the deck (similar to a few of the other decks) is that it lacks defense. When using a deck with no defense bonuses it becomes increasingly difficult to keep figures on the board as the Rebels continue to get better weapons and class cards that increase their killing power. Still waiting to see how this deck performs at the end of the campaign when the Rebels are fully upgraded with T3 weapons.

I love Inspiring Leadership. IMO it is the most interesting deck pre-Jabba.

I like Field General the most. I play it on any cheap, 3-figure group, and then every one of them acts as potential elite officer.

I also like combo of Supervisory Agent (never run out of your officers!) and Optimal Tactics (if my officer is close to the action, all my attacks are nicely upgraded). I think of Strategic Planning rather as a second-tier card for this class, but it is for sure interesting. I will have hard time choosing between this one and Noble Sacrifice (the latter, of course, in combo with Supervisory Agent and Optimal Tactics - Rebel will never know, if they should kill my officer)

As for defense, Imperial Dedication plays important, if not defensive per se, role, allowing you to choose which figure will be attacked. Nice combo with Noble Sacrifice, and Supervisory Agent - they can kill that Imperial Officer every turn .

The only downside I have with this deck is that whenever possible, two of my open groups are filled by regular and elite Imperial Officers.

EDIT: my build for this deck, if I get enough XP (13XP) would be: Field General (3), Supervisory Agent (1), Optimal Tactics (4), Noble Sacrifice (2), Imperial Dedication (3).