Yeah I'll still run him with two aces, I think his main contribution was making sure you survive you defense rolls. The fact he could help your offense was all bonus. But what made palp aces good was the fact that he helped make your aces untouchable, and he can still do that.

The fix balances him nicely. And I love that imperial players can now look at new options for aces as well. I believe the Upsilon-class Shuttle and general hux already added incentive to not run palp. I know I was more interested in major striden builds then palp. But this nerf makes palp almost more appealing in a "he is good but not cheat code good so I don't feel bad" kind of way. Well balanced now I feel.

I'm still going to run him. If you're flying well, you're not going to have multiple 'uh oh' moments where your ace is staring down the arcs of 5 different ships and you don't know which roll will flub. I've always figured that even the Emperor wasn't powerful enough to just sit there on a throne and randomly break wind in order to change reality to his will. Otherwise he'd have totally flown back up from that reactor shaft, and landing in a crane pose before continuing to zap both father and son. That's Eldrad levels of dickishness there.

Palps is a once a turn focus token that can be spent on any of your ships. That is still an awesome ability to have at your disposal even at 8 points. And no matter how much they nerf him, he's not going to be cut to one crew slot. Poor Whisper couldn't take the pressure of having the entire enemy swarm chasing her (him?) around the board trying to score half your points and destroy the Empire at the same time.

5 minutes ago, flyboymb said:

I'm still going to run him. If you're flying well, you're not going to have multiple 'uh oh' moments where your ace is staring down the arcs of 5 different ships and you don't know which roll will flub. I've always figured that even the Emperor wasn't powerful enough to just sit there on a throne and randomly break wind in order to change reality to his will. Otherwise he'd have totally flown back up from that reactor shaft, and landing in a crane pose before continuing to zap both father and son. That's Eldrad levels of dickishness there.

Palps is a once a turn focus token that can be spent on any of your ships. That is still an awesome ability to have at your disposal even at 8 points. And no matter how much they nerf him, he's not going to be cut to one crew slot. Poor Whisper couldn't take the pressure of having the entire enemy swarm chasing her (him?) around the board trying to score half your points and destroy the Empire at the same time.

I would just like to say that I just am imagining whisper running around the board, being chased by the enemy ships, which are being chased by whisper's allies to the benny hill theme song

Yes I will and play him as he was meant to be played I.E.; exactly as originally published and rarely seen in games, even epic play.

I only fly TIEs, so I could never use him in the first place.

Stupid TIE Shuttle point limitation...

I have a palp list prepped for Thursday. (RAC w Palp and Darth Vader) It's a good chance to give new Palp a spin and see how it performs on the table now.

No. Overcosted C-3PO and requires a bad ship or a very expensive one.

Let´s face it, Palpatine was the most used card in Raider box, yet it was nowhere near unbeatable.

The new Emperor-FAQ was the worst thing that has happened to this game.

I've had a Raider for close to two years, and haven't run Palpatine yet- I might start to now if he's more balanced!

I play with a lot of guys who have no interest in the competitive side of X-Wing and love building theme based lists. I can see my use of Palp increasing as it'll no longer feel like an unfair advantage.

You still get to see what your opponent has rolled before you decide to use it (defensively). I can see with high agility lists he'll be held back for pure defence, and for low agility lists pure offence.

He's probably over costed now but Christ it'll be nice to see the imperial meta diversify a bit

Been thinking about him a lot, I think it is still a good card because of what it does. It requires risk management to make work now, introducing a good element of skill as requirement to enjoy his powerfull effect, which is still a lot better then 3PO, certainly 5 points better.

26 minutes ago, Admiral Deathrain said:

Been thinking about him a lot, I think it is still a good card because of what it does. It requires risk management to make work now, introducing a good element of skill as requirement to enjoy his powerfull effect, which is still a lot better then 3PO, certainly 5 points better.

But he takes up TWO crew slots, which limits his use to few ships. That is in itself a pretty harsh limitation.

I guess the few loudmouthed whiners got their will. I did not know FFG took orders from forum trolls.

I never saw two crew slots as a cost per se, more of a way to prevent Palp Phantoms and as a tax on getting Palp and Rebel Captive in the same list.

6 minutes ago, Still1 said:

But he takes up TWO crew slots, which limits his use to few ships. That is in itself a pretty harsh limitation.

I guess the few loudmouthed whiners got their will. I did not know FFG took orders from forum trolls.

That is relevant for Decimators. Palp-shuttle never wanted more points on it anyways. I think you will be suprised by Palpatine still showing up - time will tell.

And don't assume any of the changes have been directly influenced by the forums. They looked at the dominating cards in the game that pinched tournaments lately and nerfed them, however knowing what else was ready to take those cards place, they also nerfed the second best things to really open up the meta. Mindlink and Sabine are now the top-dogs and they promise an interesting meta. Blair Bunkes rebel swarm already started to see some play after he had good results with it and it is a list well positioned to do well against both of these new top dogs. Ideally we enter a meta where 4+ ship lists are the norm again.

No. He should be 1 point less and one crew slot less. Luke Skywalker is 7 and 1 crew slot.
Maybe he should also be 1 point less...

Also, it's a bit suspicious - a new guy to the forum (first post ever) post such a survey... maybe it's FFG's agent

Fulcrum!

16 minutes ago, Admiral Deathrain said:

That is relevant for Decimators. Palp-shuttle never wanted more points on it anyways. I think you will be suprised by Palpatine still showing up - time will tell.

And don't assume any of the changes have been directly influenced by the forums. They looked at the dominating cards in the game that pinched tournaments lately and nerfed them, however knowing what else was ready to take those cards place, they also nerfed the second best things to really open up the meta. Mindlink and Sabine are now the top-dogs and they promise an interesting meta. Blair Bunkes rebel swarm already started to see some play after he had good results with it and it is a list well positioned to do well against both of these new top dogs. Ideally we enter a meta where 4+ ship lists are the norm again.

Yes, time will tell. But it´s not like Palpatine was unbeatable or horribly dominating all competitive scene. There will be always some cards seeing more use in top games, right? Are FFG going to change errata periodically just to shake something off the top? I mean do you honestly think after this we will see Fel´s Wrath or Punishers in the tournaments? Ór what do you mean by opening up the meta? Some ships/cards will always see more use, others nearly never. Changing Palpatine was just too harsh overreaction to some whining and lists with decent success with him.

11 minutes ago, Still1 said:

Yes, time will tell. But it´s not like Palpatine was unbeatable or horribly dominating all competitive scene. There will be always some cards seeing more use in top games, right? Are FFG going to change errata periodically just to shake something off the top? I mean do you honestly think after this we will see Fel´s Wrath or Punishers in the tournaments? Ór what do you mean by opening up the meta? Some ships/cards will always see more use, others nearly never. Changing Palpatine was just too harsh overreaction to some whining and lists with decent success with him.

We will see lists with more than 3 ships more frequently again, that is worth a lot. The problem with Palpatine was always that he invalidated counterplay by saving players from situations where they had 2-3 3 dice attacks incoming. He made it very unlikely to take more than one damage, and that is not acceptable when you clearly were outplayed. The ships that benefitted from this the most are also those that have the easiest time avoiding enemy ships. He creates an unhealthy game. Now Palpatine is still very strong against 1-2 attacks, but when you are outplayed he won't save you.

1 hour ago, Admiral Deathrain said:

We will see lists with more than 3 ships more frequently again, that is worth a lot. The problem with Palpatine was always that he invalidated counterplay by saving players from situations where they had 2-3 3 dice attacks incoming. He made it very unlikely to take more than one damage, and that is not acceptable when you clearly were outplayed. The ships that benefitted from this the most are also those that have the easiest time avoiding enemy ships. He creates an unhealthy game. Now Palpatine is still very strong against 1-2 attacks, but when you are outplayed he won't save you.

Will we see more 4-5 ship lists beacuse of this? I doubt it.

You make it sound Palpatine changed multiple dice results before. No, he had the ability to change one and even then you had to decide between offense and defence, usually not knowing the other result at that point if playing with high PS.

Green dice always fail at some point and Imperials don´t have regeneration, so hits are always unforgiving. That´s even more true for ships with no shields. Sure, you can always save him for defense now, but isn´t that just overcosted c-3po, who might be useless in many rounds? And I can´t highlight too much that you need either a very expensive ship or a very bad one to even field him.

If the point was to nerf him to oblivion, congratulations. It worked. But do you honestly thinks Palpatine was unbeatable or 9/10 Imperial squads were Palpatine lists these days? You can always nerf the things at the top. After all, they are overpowered if they win more than they lose, right?

I can´t even begin to describe how disappointed I am about the direction of this game. Sure, I hated the TLT´s, still do. But I wasn´t yelling to errata them useless because I lost more than I won. They dominated and were not nerfed. So why Palpatine now?

8 minutes ago, Still1 said:

Will we see more 4-5 ship lists beacuse of this? I doubt it.

You make it sound Palpatine changed multiple dice results before. No, he had the ability to change one and even then you had to decide between offense and defence, usually not knowing the other result at that point if playing with high PS.

I am not, I am acknowledging the fact that he always stacks with other modifications. To damage a 3 green ace backed by Palpatine 3 normal 3 dice attacks are only dangerous when the opponent has perfect hits, which is extremely rare and then only when all of their dice blank at least twice, which is just as rare.

I didn't run him before except for a few games on Vassal, I don't particularly plan on changing that.

14 minutes ago, Admiral Deathrain said:

I am not, I am acknowledging the fact that he always stacks with other modifications. To damage a 3 green ace backed by Palpatine 3 normal 3 dice attacks are only dangerous when the opponent has perfect hits, which is extremely rare and then only when all of their dice blank at least twice, which is just as rare.

But still, it was only one die of one defence he could modify and then could not be used on attacks.

So yeah, I get yor point, it was hard to hit Soontir Fel, but not impossible. And with 2+ ships of course easier. Or you could always destroy Palpatine´s shuttle first. But on the other hand, if you pay 29 points for a support function, you expect it to be worth the points. The most played card on the Raider package is now as useful as Saboteur.

Palpatine was the same as regeneration to rebels, damage mitigation. More restricted and not as useful though, but still good. Honestly, do you think he was THAT good and dominating the game that Imperial players deserved this bad change?

But he can still be used the same way. You know someone will be shooting at Soontir? Use Palp. 95% of the time, the end result will be the same, the other 5% you rolled perfect and still have your token stack or he allowed you to save a token for later.

So I will be paying minimum of 29 points for an extra evade per turn which I might not need anyway? No thank you.

Give it a try before you dismiss it as over-costed. You just might be surprised...

1 minute ago, Still1 said:

So I will be paying minimum of 29 points for an extra evade per turn which I might not need anyway? No thank you.

I'm not sure if Palpatine functions dramatically different in a list with Vader and Soontir Fel. If not, then he's still worth the points, although the aces have become less useful in the meta.