I am hoping that someone can help shed some light on something for me. A PC at our table had a custom cybernetic brain implant built for him over the course of a few games. When the time came for the install, the NPC failed with 2 failures and 2 or 3 threat. The GM ruled that since the roll failed that the PC's intellect was permanently lowered by 1 (it was 2 one for each failure until all of us had a fit) and the cybernetic was still installed. I could not find anything in the Special Mods book to back up his ruling, but also could not find anything to dispute it either. Can you guys help me out here? Was this a good ruling or are there rules that I missed to dispute this? This GM has a history of harsh punishments for failures and we suspect that it is happening again. Thanks

I think that's pretty **** harsh for a failure. Like, a Despair maybe, but just a failure seems gratuitous.

Yeah... i was thinking maybe that it would be installed and he would have to try again after a while with upgrades or setback dice, and maybe lowering it for a game session...

Yeah that is messed up. A failure just means that what you're trying to do didn't work. And threat means that something detrimental happens because of the attempt—in this case, perhaps the implant was damaged, or (more interesting) the PCs think the implant got installed, but it's actually slowly poisoning the character.

If the latter was the case, I could see the GM's ruling making sense for like a session, and then allow the PCs to uninstall the enhancement to reverse the condition.

But if it's permanent -1, then yeah, that blows chunks. I'd get the GM to alter his ruling to something less assinine.

I would've just had it fail to install, upgraded the Difficulty to install for the next session, and maybe dropped his Strain threshold 1 or 2 for the session.

A Despair in that result and maybe the implant just breaks and/or maybe roll a crit on the PC.

Lowering intellect is way overboard.

Permanently lowering Int is ridiculous. They just didn't get the brain/cyber link to function properly. Perhaps the threat means for a session "while the new neural connections form" they suffer a couple of setbacks on all Intellect checks. Then they get another chance to finalise the installation and get the actual benefit of the increased characteristic later on.

But a permanent characteristic decrease? That's excessive especially for the only mild failure. 2 Despair on a fail? Possibly, but even then its rough for that to happen from a single roll of the dice.

Keep in mind the significant difficulty of reducing a characteristic via a Critical injury. You need to roll high, and already be suffering multiple crits, and probably with a vicious weapon attacking you. It's almost impossible from a single attack and single Crit roll.

Time for full-scale rebellion in the group. Oust the GM and get someone reasonable to take over. Pitchforks and torches optional, yet encouraged.

I agree with Sharatec. Time to find a better GM. One that isn't out to deliberately screw over the players and make their real lives miserable.

The only qualifier I would put in is if he told you before hand that the intellect loss would be the result of the failure, then it is on the player for going through with it.

Even then it is still a pretty big **** move for just a couple failures. Maybe with a couple despair, but that is still harsh.

You should get the hole group to inform the GM that this sort of punishment is unacceptable. If he has a problem with that then it time for a new GM

I'm in agreement with everyone here; that is too harsh a punishment, especially with plenty of other alternative ways to reflect the failed install has had an impact on the PC. Strain, wounds, even a roll on the crit chart, which I'd only do if it were a despair, would have still shown the failure negatively affected the PC. No need to go messing with characteristics. If you need back up, you should show your GM this thread, there are all sorts of GMs in here, and we are all saying that ruling was too harsh!

Thanks everyone. I was thinking thinking it was way too harsh. This will be the second conversation we have had with him about him being way to harsh. i appreciate the help.

Did your GM used to play Star Wars SAGA edition? There's a very similar penalty in that system when you fail to install the Cybernetic Brain implant.

No kaosoe. This is the first star wars game he has ever done.

this is game breaking bs you need to have a frank discussion about it. A failure with 2 threat is it didn't work take some strain or at most be disorentated for a day.

Even with Despair I'd say critical injury intellect lowered by 1 until this critical injury is cured. but a better despair is probably the implant is damaged by 2 steps

With 2 despair I'd say the implant could be destroyed + the critical injury for int.

This is just total BS

Reading the side bar on p85 of Special Modifications with your GM will be the simple and polite way to resolve this. It outlines exactly what level of consequences there should be for failure, threat and despair. Whilst his harsh ruling is possible it requires a Despair to cause a Crit which then would need to be a d100 roll of 126-130 (ie the pc would need to be suffering from at least 3 other Crits before the surgery started). And even then your supposed to roll a d10 and would need to get a 7 to reduce Intellect (although given the circumstances it would be a decent argument to say a brain operation would automatically be Intellect.)

Have a chat to the GM and say that this was your expectation prior to rolling, not gimping.

OP didn't state, but that side bar also states that in perfect medical conditions no roll is necessary.