Better than me. They're closing on 480s at the moment, but still always combatting with something scarred, so its precarious, game to game.

2 hours ago, Ardaedhel said:

I'm pretty sure a shrimp swarm would do okay on it. Haven't faced a turtle with mine, but my fleet currently looks like this and I've won my two HR games so far:

CC Final Form (500/500)
======================
MC30c Torpedo Frigate (63 + 26)
+ Skilled First Officer (1)
+ Ordnance Experts (4)
+ Assault Proton Torpedoes (5)
+ H9 Turbolasers (8)
+ Admonition (8)
MC30c Torpedo Frigate (63 + 23)
+ Lando Calrissian (4)
+ Ordnance Experts (4)
+ Assault Concussion Missiles (7)
+ H9 Turbolasers (8)
MC30c Torpedo Frigate (63 + 20)
+ Skilled First Officer (1)
+ Ordnance Experts (4)
+ Assault Concussion Missiles (7)
+ H9 Turbolasers (8)
MC30c Torpedo Frigate (63 + 18)
+ Skilled First Officer (1)
+ Ordnance Experts (4)
+ Assault Proton Torpedoes (5)
+ H9 Turbolasers (8)
Modified Pelta-class Assault Ship (56 + 11)
+ Entrapment Formation! (5)
+ Projection Experts (6)
GR-75 Medium Transports (18 + 31)
+ Mon Mothma (30)
+ Quantum Storm (1)
GR-75 Medium Transports (18 + 7)
+ Slicer Tools (7)
GR-75 Medium Transports (18 + 2)
+ Comms Net (2)

I think I got cancer reading this list...

i think a lot of people have only read the title of my topic and not the subject i wrote, i never mentioned thinking the CC was unbalanced as a whole, i simply stated that i believe the ship choices for the Empire are, for example all 3 of our Imperial fleets have and ISD II, and an Architens, and a VSD except mine which took a 2nd Architens and more fighters, this just feels bland.

3 minutes ago, Milienius said:

I think I got cancer reading this list...

It's not nearly as good at 500 points as the 400 point version is. The squadron alpha strike at 500 is too strong to weather.

3 minutes ago, Darth evil said:

i think a lot of people have only read the title of my topic and not the subject i wrote, i never mentioned thinking the CC was unbalanced as a whole, i simply stated that i believe the ship choices for the Empire are, for example all 3 of our Imperial fleets have and ISD II, and an Architens, and a VSD except mine which took a 2nd Architens and more fighters, this just feels bland.

That is the joy of starting a thread and leaving it. People will take over it and twist it into something of their own unless the owner tries to maintain control.

You can take a Glad and Gozanti to begin with. Nothing is stopping you from doing that. Or an Interdictor, which is one of the most useful ships in the campaign because of its Hyperspace Retreat rule.

20 minutes ago, Darth evil said:

i think a lot of people have only read the title of my topic and not the subject i wrote, i never mentioned thinking the CC was unbalanced as a whole, i simply stated that i believe the ship choices for the Empire are, for example all 3 of our Imperial fleets have and ISD II, and an Architens, and a VSD except mine which took a 2nd Architens and more fighters, this just feels bland.

Sounds like a symptom of the gamers, not the game.

Our Imperial team has a Motti dual-ISD list, a Screed-Demo-Raider DeMSU list, and a Jerjerrod 4x Arquitens list.

Each list flies very differently from the other.

31 minutes ago, Darth evil said:

i think a lot of people have only read the title of my topic and not the subject i wrote, i never mentioned thinking the CC was unbalanced as a whole, i simply stated that i believe the ship choices for the Empire are, for example all 3 of our Imperial fleets have and ISD II, and an Architens, and a VSD except mine which took a 2nd Architens and more fighters, this just feels bland.

Yeah mine was really different too. I took ISDII, VSDII, GladI with JJ while we also had a Motti Dual ISD with Raider I, and an Ozzel with 2 Arqs, Demolisher, and a Raider I to start

30 minutes ago, Ardaedhel said:

It's not nearly as good at 500 points as the 400 point version is. The squadron alpha strike at 500 is too strong to weather.

Yeah thats what I was wondering. Gods save the poor soul who comes squadron light though.

24 minutes ago, Darth evil said:

i think a lot of people have only read the title of my topic and not the subject i wrote, i never mentioned thinking the CC was unbalanced as a whole, i simply stated that i believe the ship choices for the Empire are, for example all 3 of our Imperial fleets have and ISD II, and an Architens, and a VSD except mine which took a 2nd Architens and more fighters, this just feels bland.

I'm playing a 2 player variant (we decided to each run 3 fleets to have more variety), and my fleets are all completely different.

One is a Vader dual isd1 list with a Howlrunner Swarm, Arquitens, and 2xGozanti.

The second is a Jerjerrod isd2, vic1, and vic2 with an Arquitens and a small squadron complement including Jonus.

The last one is Screed, Demolisher, 2 raiders, 2 Gozantis, and a Vic2 with 120- odd points of fighters.

Sure, I haven't used an Interdictor, but that was mostly because I build thematic fleets, and I didn't have a themed fleet in mind for it. (It wouldn't be hard to do, and I think that an Interdictor would be quite effective).

One thing we've looked at for "Hyperlane Raid" is to swap the 1st and 2nd player and make it a "Blockade Run." Although to be fair, in our campaign the Rebels won this battle as written and took out an Interdictor in the process.

From what I'm reading, many players are not taking into account, or refuse to accept, that CC matches are played VERY different from tourneu matches.

In CC you just need to win by 1 point, unlike tourney matches. I'm seeing way too many players complaininh about balance and bad objectives and olaying tourney fleets instead of fleet tailored for CC.

Much, or all, of the balance issues seem to stem from fleets not constructed for CC and/or not played for CC (winning by 1 point). Somr players in our campaign have tourney fleets, and playing them as if they are in a tourney, and they are not doing well.

19 hours ago, Darth evil said:

i think a lot of people have only read the title of my topic and not the subject i wrote, i never mentioned thinking the CC was unbalanced as a whole, i simply stated that i believe the ship choices for the Empire are, for example all 3 of our Imperial fleets have and ISD II, and an Architens, and a VSD except mine which took a 2nd Architens and more fighters, this just feels bland.

I read it, and I somewhat agree but I think think the issue is not that one side or the other has more restricted list options than casual or tournament lists. MSU type lists received nothing in the campaign, whereas big beefy ships received many new perks that make them clearly the better option.

So perhaps you feel stuck in taking ISDs and VSDs and that makes sense, but rebels seem like they're stuck in taking MC80s and AFIIs. Big ships are simply lower risk and higher reward in CC and that bums rebel MSU players like myself and our evil, mustachioed imperial counterparts out.

I've laid out my concerns with between faction balance before and it'll serve no one to go through it all again. But as to your specific concerns, I feel both sides are equally (or close to it) restricted in what ships are good and what should be avoided.

58 minutes ago, Sekac said:

I read it, and I somewhat agree but I think think the issue is not that one side or the other has more restricted list options than casual or tournament lists. MSU type lists received nothing in the campaign, whereas big beefy ships received many new perks that make them clearly the better option.

So perhaps you feel stuck in taking ISDs and VSDs and that makes sense, but rebels seem like they're stuck in taking MC80s and AFIIs. Big ships are simply lower risk and higher reward in CC and that bums rebel MSU players like myself and our evil, mustachioed imperial counterparts out.

I've laid out my concerns with between faction balance before and it'll serve no one to go through it all again. But as to your specific concerns, I feel both sides are equally (or close to it) restricted in what ships are good and what should be avoided.

in my experience rebel trc90 swarm is just fine in CC... maybe not great for base assaults, maybe... but great at all otherobjectives, especially defense

In a MSU list, you can get a great many veteran ships. That's a big plus in my book.

And the cost to unscar a couple of corvettes isn't daunting. Also a plus, because unscarring an ISD-II is expensive (I had to sacrifice mine in round 1 once).

2 hours ago, Sekac said:

Big ships are simply lower risk and higher reward in CC and that bums rebel MSU players like myself and our evil, mustachioed imperial counterparts out.

I'm using a MC30/CR90 swarm in my current campaign, and aside from the very first round, it's done very well. I have more activations than any of my Imperial opponents (even if they get an extra activation from the Armed Station base defense.) Also, since I don't have to try to bid for first player and some systems have specific objectives tied to them, I can dictate the terms of engagement and guarantee that I get first/last activation.

Big ships may offer a higher reward, but I think they are also higher risk- like Green Knight said, it costs significantly more to unscar ISDs and MC80s. And then if you don't have the points to unscar them and try to keep them alive by keeping them out of the fighting, that's a bigger chunk of your fleet that isn't contributing to the battle.

In short, I'm a Rebel MSU player, and I am not bummed.

3 hours ago, SkyCake said:

in my experience rebel trc90 swarm is just fine in CC... maybe not great for base assaults, maybe... but great at all otherobjectives, especially defense

Of course, he says this after stomping one into the dirt.

11 minutes ago, Drasnighta said:

Of course, he says this after stomping one into the dirt.

And he just got stomped into the ground running trc90s with yt2400 swarm against a squadronless motti build.

Ion cannons wrecked him. Didnt kill a single ship.

4 hours ago, Green Knight said:

In a MSU list, you can get a great many veteran ships. That's a big plus in my book.

And the cost to unscar a couple of corvettes isn't daunting. Also a plus, because unscarring an ISD-II is expensive (I had to sacrifice mine in round 1 once).

2 CR90As cost 44 to refit and an ISD2 is 55. So the split between inexpensive and expensive is 11 points? That seems like a narrow and arbitrary line.

But I'd argue the hyperspace exit is far more favorable for the ISD. He can tell when the end is nigh and bail, whereas CR90s are going to be killed far more often and be a continuous refit drain.

Veterancy is also harder to achieve for each individual CR90, especially as more and more become veterans. Setting things up so that last corvette is the one that finishes something off, not one of his already veteran brothers can be tricky. Whereas an ISD has a very good chance of becoming a veteran early on because it is far more likely to land a killing blow than any one CR90 is.