In a two player game, if I play Gildors counsel

EDIT 2: i was right all along and it does work!

but there's an interesting discussion about it below

Really? They certainly wouldn't stack right in CoC, having the minimum 1 there would mess up an unlimited number of the other reductions.

The most recent effect should take precedence, over-writing any previous minimum. In this case, Gildor's Counsel is the relevant minimum.

But if you have something that reduces cost to a minimum of 1, and then something which reduces cost to a minimum of 0 -- can't you use both those effects to reduce a 2-cost card to 0?

51 minutes ago, GrandSpleen said:

But if you have something that reduces cost to a minimum of 1, and then something which reduces cost to a minimum of 0 -- can't you use both those effects to reduce a 2-cost card to 0?

yeah, that's why this works. both effects happen at the same time, 'on reveal,' and players have the option to order them in this way

If both effects happened at the same time you would be correct, you could choose which way round to apply the minimums, but as written they don't. Wait no Longer is a Response at the beginning of the Quest phase, which precedes your opportunity to trigger the Action of Gildor's Counsel. Thus you will still have the minimum of 1 from Gildor's Counsel as it is the second of the effects to trigger.

1 hour ago, PocketWraith said:

If both effects happened at the same time you would be correct, you could choose which way round to apply the minimums, but as written they don't. Wait no Longer is a Response at the beginning of the Quest phase, which precedes your opportunity to trigger the Action of Gildor's Counsel. Thus you will still have the minimum of 1 from Gildor's Counsel as it is the second of the effects to trigger.

i see what you're saying now and agree.

i had glossed over the part of Wait No Longer and had read it as the same text as Gildor's Counsel. still waiting on this pack in NZ, so i haven't played with it yet

Ah, since it is a response it has to trigger first. I was playing it as an action. Thanks

13 hours ago, PocketWraith said:

If both effects happened at the same time you would be correct, you could choose which way round to apply the minimums, but as written they don't. Wait no Longer is a Response at the beginning of the Quest phase, which precedes your opportunity to trigger the Action of Gildor's Counsel. Thus you will still have the minimum of 1 from Gildor's Counsel as it is the second of the effects to trigger.

Wouldn't be surprised if the developers say you can't reduce to 0 but only for the reason of "it makes it harder for the players".

But...if the amount of cards that the players reveal is determined at the beginning of the staging step, how can you modify it before then? To me, it seems more like both cards create a passive effect that takes effect as soon as the base amount of cards to be revealed is determined which would be at the beginning of the staging step.

I think cmabr002 has a point -- the number of cards to be revealed is determined at the beginning of the staging step, so neither of those cards take effect at the time the card was played. Since they are both essentially passive effects at the time the number of cards to be revealed is actually determined, why can't the first player decide the order and apply Gildor's Counsel before Wait no Longer?

14 hours ago, cmabr002 said:

Wouldn't be surprised if the developers say you can't reduce to 0 but only for the reason of "it makes it harder for the players".

i had always convinced myself it was just a consequence of people trying to game the system and then finding out they can't, but given recent rulings, i now think they do kind of go out of their way to do this.

This might be helpful

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Hi Caleb, question for you about stacking cost reduction effects.

Grima, Damrod , Theoden, Heir of Valandil, A Good Meal, and Beregond can reduce costs to play cards down to 0.

Master of Lore, O Lorien, and To the Sea, To the Sea! can reduce costs to play cards down to 1.

Secrecy, Guthlaf, Dwalin, Citadel Custodian, Take No Notice, In the Shadows, and the Record attachments have built-in cost reduction effects.

When I am combining two or more of the above effects, can I choose the order in which they are applied? Here are some distinct examples:

1) I discard 4 cards to lower the cost of Gildor Inglorion using To the Sea, then trigger Grima to reduce his cost to 0.

2) Exhaust Master of Lore and name "Event", reducing the cost of Out of the Wild by 1, then if I am in Secrecy it becomes cost 0.

3) Exhaust Master of Lore and name "Attachment", then playing Ranger Spikes for free with Damrod .

4) Exhaust Master of Lore and name "Attachment", reducing the cost of Scroll of Isildur by 1. Then, If I have 3 Lore heroes, it becomes free.

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Hi Chris,

You can choose the order in which you resolve effects, so you can reduce a card’s cost to a minimum of 1 with one effect and then reduce it down to 0 with another effect. Each of your examples look to be correct in that regard.

Cheers,

Caleb

In 2, 3, and 4, the passive effect was reducing the cost before MoL was triggered, yet I was still able to get the cost down to 0 by choosing the order of how to apply the now 2 passive effects.

An additional question. Since Wait uses the word "then", does it mean that if no enemy is found, Wait will have no effect?