2 hours ago, GrandAdmiralCrunch said:

We all know they are modified Temple Class Freighters, (yes, this was a real design printed in one of the FFG RPG's)

Brilliant! That improves a dumb looking ship immensely.

43 minutes ago, Forresto said:

Or maybe neither? I think their intent was to explain why the Nebulon B looks the way it does and nothing more. If its part of worldbuilding its certainly not lazy.

It's an upside down Neb-B. If they had just added some pods to the spine of a regular Neb-B, I would be fine with it. As it is I think it looks dumb and lazy.

Yet, in response, my mind goes - "Its in space... There is no Upside Down..."

10 minutes ago, Kiwi Rat said:

Ever since the new canon has taken shape, I've heard alot of people say the EU is bad like this and like that. But the same people never tells exactly specifically what the disliked about the EU.

The Vong

Everything that came after them chronologically

Darksaber

Super Weapon of the week

Grand Admiral of the week (after the Thrawn book established the concept and that he was the only surviving one)

"Ewok" x-wing pilot

Every character that appears on screen in the movies being given a name and a short story dedicated to them (double when that random backstory says X alien having a drink in the cantina was significant to the GCW)

Endless Han Solo clones like Dash

clones of the Emperor

Luke turning to the dark side temporarily

The suncrusher (which falls into the "superweapon of the week" category, but is so egregious that it deserves its own mention)

23 minutes ago, Kiwi Rat said:

Ever since the new canon has taken shape, I've heard alot of people say the EU is bad like this and like that. But the same people never tells exactly specifically what the disliked about the EU.

Read all the X-wing novels, all the books with Thrawn in them (whannebe Thrawns as well) and more, though I didn't read that many of the comics, so I have no idea about them.

Admittedly I found most stories or side stories that focused to much on the Jedi a bit borring, so I lowed more the stories about Space Naval action and Starfighter dogfights.

Anyhow just currious to know why people sort of dislike the EU, short of hating it like Jar Jar.

I love the old Legends EU precisely for the books you mentioned. But even I will admit there was so much Crap.

Examples? The courtship of Princess Leia. Han wins a planets in a card game, abducts Leia before she can be married off for political reasons to benefit the new republic. Hijinks ensue.

How about the dozens of times Han and Leia's kids were abducted by the imperial villain of the week.

how about Kevin J Anderson's trilogy that took numerous books to fix. That introduced the worst Admiral in the imperial navy who only got her rank by sleeping with Tarkin, (no, that is literally stated in the novels), or one of the few Mary Sue space ships ever created, the Sun Crusher.

Im just getting started here...

6 minutes ago, Drasnighta said:

Yet, in response, my mind goes - "Its in space... There is no Upside Down..."

I honestly can't argue with that

I believe the "Ewok" X-wing pilot was a ploy made up by Wraith squadron, where one of its pilots wore a suit that hid him in the cockpit, while having a Ewok dummy strapped to his chest, so when enemy pilots looked into the cockpit, they would see and believe an Ewok piloting the X-wing.

I call this sence of humor

18 minutes ago, Kiwi Rat said:

Ever since the new canon has taken shape, I've heard alot of people say the EU is bad like this and like that. But the same people never tells exactly specifically what the disliked about the EU.

Read all the X-wing novels, all the books with Thrawn in them (whannebe Thrawns as well) and more, though I didn't read that many of the comics, so I have no idea about them.

Admittedly I found most stories or side stories that focused to much on the Jedi a bit borring, so I lowed more the stories about Space Naval action and Starfighter dogfights.

Anyhow just currious to know why people sort of dislike the EU, short of hating it like Jar Jar.

I'll bite. I am with you 100% on the X-Wing novels and the Timothy Zahn stuff. These were great. However, for the bad, let me see what I can recall, off the top of my head.

The Vong. Interesting idea with the invader from outside the galaxy and all. Extremely poorly executed.

Drochs. I don't even remember the name of the book. Weird, crab like force things. Awful story, awful villain, just awful.

Oh, lets not forget the comic books doing what comic books do and not letting anyone stay dead. They resurrected the Emperor and Boba Fett, and turned Luke to the Dark Side (kind of invalidating his entire story arc of overcoming what his father failed to overcome and bringing Anakin back to the light).

The hive mind insects. Kithik... Kickle... craple.

New super weapons all the time. World Devastators. The Sun Crusher. Super Star Destroyed with a mini Death Star included. The hutts built a death star? Really? It took the Empire 19 years to build the first one. The hutts slapped one together in no time.

Oh yes, and don't get me started on The Ones.

The stories were poorly thought out, poorly executed, and they felt the need to continually one up the last one. Bad writing and bad direction (or lack there of) for the franchise.

Then, every once in a while, a Rogue Squadron would come out. Or a Thrawn would be created. Those were great!

I sort of liked the Black Fleet crisis books (except the Jedi stuff in it ), it had a sort of Political, Naval, "Hunt of the Red October", intrige to it.

23 minutes ago, Kiwi Rat said:

I believe the "Ewok" X-wing pilot was a ploy made up by Wraith squadron, where one of its pilots wore a suit that hid him in the cockpit, while having a Ewok dummy strapped to his chest, so when enemy pilots looked into the cockpit, they would see and believe an Ewok piloting the X-wing.

I call this sence of humor \

If it's an aside, done in a hanger to yuk with Wedge to show how his bonds and are all friends, then yes, its a sense of humor. If it is done during actual flight, much less combat conditions it is just moronic to almost the same level as the "jedi droid that blew its own motivator so that Artoo would be bought by the Skywalkers instead of him" and "Jedi Master Bayts"

Just now, Forgottenlore said:

If it's an aside, done in a hanger to yuk with Wedge to show how his bonds and are all friends, then yes, its a sense of humor. If it is done during actual flight, much less combat conditions it is just moronic to almost the same level as the "jedi droid that blew its own motivator so that Artoo would be bought by the Skywalkers instead of him" and "Jedi Master Bayts"

Okay to be fair, Skippy the Jedi Droid was from a non-canon anthology comic series, and was never meant to be taken remotely seriously. I keep hearing people complain about him, but his story was tongue in cheek.

Just now, GrandAdmiralCrunch said:

Okay to be fair, Skippy the Jedi Droid was from a non-canon anthology comic series, and was never meant to be taken remotely seriously. I keep hearing people complain about him, but his story was tongue in cheek.

Given that there was a race of Force Sensitive Droids called the Shards...it's kind of Poe's Law in action. The old EU was so over-the-top and ridiculous that stories like Skippy the Jedi droid fit right in instead of standing out as satire.

If X-wing has a Rebel TIE Fighter, then Armada should have an Imperial Nebulon B.

The thing I miss the most about no Imperial Nebulons is that it leaves a lot of the TIE Fighter flight sim missions being impossible to "exist" in the new canon.

No Imperial Nebulon also puts a kebosh on Kuat developing the Neblon-B2... one of my favorite star wars designs. I still have hopes that if FFG dips back into the EU to pull things, that the B2 will be there somewhere. The ARQ works on paper like a nebulon, but the Nebulon still has things and features that the ARQ does not have (like being a cheaper two-dice AA platform, for one).

14 minutes ago, Marinealver said:

If X-wing has a Rebel TIE Fighter, then Armada should have an Imperial Nebulon B.

Except stealing ships is a very Rebel thing to do. Less so for the Imperials. It also never really matched the Imperial aesthetic. One thing I've appreciated in nuCanon is the proliferation of the Star Destroyer triangle profile down to the corvettes.

30 minutes ago, GrandAdmiralCrunch said:

Okay to be fair, Skippy the Jedi Droid was from a non-canon anthology comic series, and was never meant to be taken remotely seriously. I keep hearing people complain about him, but his story was tongue in cheek.

Which is why I did not list him in my list of things about the old EU that are dumb.

I also didn't dock them for master baytes' name, as that was supposed to be a joke by the author that accidentally made it to publication.

I just used them to illustrate the level of stupid involved in flying a combat mission with a 4' tall teddy bear tied to your body.

4 minutes ago, Forgottenlore said:

Which is why I did not list him in my list of things about the old EU that are dumb.

I also didn't dock them for master baytes' name, as that was supposed to be a joke by the author that accidentally made it to publication.

I just used them to illustrate the level of stupid involved in flying a combat mission with a 4' tall teddy bear tied to your body.

Imagine the actor Denis Lawson being proposed to do that in a Star Wars movie, I would like to see his face expression

4 minutes ago, Benjan Meruna said:

Except stealing ships is a very Rebel thing to do. Less so for the Imperials. It also never really matched the Imperial aesthetic. One thing I've appreciated in nuCanon is the proliferation of the Star Destroyer triangle profile down to the corvettes.

I'm glad you like the "flying wedge" design concept. Personally i think it's a little lazy. Did a Fletcher-Class destroyer look identical to a South Dakota-Class Battleship? Did the Flower-Class Corvette look exactly like a King George V-Class Battleship? No and no. But to each their own.

Just now, idiewell said:

I'm glad you like the "flying wedge" design concept. Personally i think it's a little lazy. Did a Fletcher-Class destroyer look identical to a South Dakota-Class Battleship? Did the Flower-Class Corvette look exactly like a King George V-Class Battleship? No and no. But to each their own.

Sure do. Both are grey ovaloids. Just like the Imperial ships are all grey triangles. There are differing details, but the same is true of an Arquitens and a Victory, sooo...

15 hours ago, Muelmuel said:

Well then, if this new canon maintains the neb as a purely civilian/rebel ship that would mean no more chance at one coming out for the imps. Not that I mind, im more concerned with ffg coming up with fresh waves that bring balance to the force, i mean game, while neutering power creep

Hey, if Imperials really want Nebs...

*stares at Arquitens*

...we can trade? I'm sure Ackbar wouldn't mind something different after staring at Assault Frigates for so long.

4 hours ago, idiewell said:

I'm glad you like the "flying wedge" design concept. Personally i think it's a little lazy. Did a Fletcher-Class destroyer look identical to a South Dakota-Class Battleship? Did the Flower-Class Corvette look exactly like a King George V-Class Battleship? No and no. But to each their own.

How is it lazy? Its called a design motif and so far the only two star destroyers that look in any way similar are the ISD and VSD, and the VSD is an EU ship.

22 minutes ago, Forresto said:

How is it lazy? Its called a design motif and so far the only two star destroyers that look in any way similar are the ISD and VSD, and the VSD is an EU ship.

Even those are as distinctive as the WW2 ships mentioned, the Victory is much smaller and it's bridge has a distinctive "beak." It also has an antennae.

Sorry but i just don't think EVERY ship in the Imperial fleet needs to be a flying wedge. If you like the wedges, good for you, though.

3 minutes ago, idiewell said:

Sorry but i just don't think EVERY ship in the Imperial fleet needs to be a flying wedge. If you like the wedges, good for you, though.

This is true, but what you do need is a consistent design ethos. Remember, the Imperial Navy is an actual fully functional professional military force. They have important design elements that are uniform to their ships, squadrons, and soldiers. Even the humble little Gozanti Light Cruiser has a certain angular wedge shape to it that identifies it as part of the Imperial fleet. the Lambda Shuttle also has certain elements that speak to the idea of the wedge shape without actually using it.

Also, in space, the wedge shape has direct combat advantages. It can allow for the focusing of nearly all major firepower towards certain points while allowing point defense systems nearly free LOS to all areas above the hull plane. It offers a certain degree of aerodynamic stability when operating in an atmosphere. And of course, the consistent design of Imperial ships enforces the concept that the professional, precise Imperial Navy is fully equipped to take on all comers, especially when several nearly identical warships hyperspace into a system simultaneously.

On 2/14/2017 at 0:02 PM, Forgottenlore said:

The Vong

Everything that came after them chronologically

Darksaber

Super Weapon of the week

Grand Admiral of the week (after the Thrawn book established the concept and that he was the only surviving one)

"Ewok" x-wing pilot

Every character that appears on screen in the movies being given a name and a short story dedicated to them (double when that random backstory says X alien having a drink in the cantina was significant to the GCW)

Endless Han Solo clones like Dash

clones of the Emperor

Luke turning to the dark side temporarily

The suncrusher (which falls into the "superweapon of the week" category, but is so egregious that it deserves its own mention)

This.

Bitching and moaning about Disney taking over the EU is so ridiculous. And I was in the EU since Timothy Zahn kicked it off. Face it Lucas sold out. He let any half baked wanna be writer write Star Wars if it meant he got to cash a check. All the contradictory stories, repetitive plots, and when in doubt Luke falls to the dark side and gets redeemed... again. Seriously how many times did that happen? 3, 4?

Has everything Disney produced gold? Absolutely not, but at least give a ? about continuity, which is a 5,000% improvement over the old stuff.

*passes soapbox to the next in line