I am pretty happy,with the 65 point RAC. I know it will probably get shot, most likely shot down, but I think it can lay the wood before blowing up. My question was who to give those. 35 wingman points to. I know Defenders are always good, but I was wondering about the choice between Inquisitor and Soontir. Looking at regionals results, it's unanimous Inq > Fel. But why? What am I missing?

Assuming standard builds where they both have PTL and both want to stay at range 3 here are the breakdowns I see:

They both shoot 3 red dice/They both have autothrusters/They both have barrel roll & boost for arc dodging

Where I feel Soontir has the edge:

One extra green die/assuming you push for an evade to match Inquisitor your three actions are reposition/evade/focus vs Inq's TL/evade/focus

Inquisitor's edge:

2 shields

Is that it? Is the only reason Inquisitor is chosen over Fel is because he has 2 shields? Does Fel's repositioning and extra Stealh Device die not save him? Maybe I am too Fel biased. I love both ships, in fact my favorite list to fly would have both of them in it. But to help me wrap my head around this, why Inquisitor over Fel?

Thanks in advance. Get it TIE ADVANCEd prototype? Nevermind.

I prefer the Inquisitor for a couple different reasons. Cheaper price (31 points with PTL, Title, AT), two shields that amounts to 1 extra hit point, green 1 banks and turns, ability to have Target lock/focus/evade (more reliable red dice), and if you want to put proton rockets on him, he can pack a huge punch when he gets into range 1 of an enemy ship.

I pretty much run Fel with Targeting Computer exclusively.

Plus having 4 red dice at range 1 instead of 3 is really nice.

Soontir is also better at chasing things, since his 2 banks are green.

It mostly comes down to personal preference between these two. Fel is better in close because he hits harder but Inq is better at range 3 because no range bonus dice or auto's for the defender. I believe most are picking Inqisitor theses days because he is a more consistent attacker(TL action) and comes in at a few less points.

Yeah its the range 3 games, fel may have a slight green dice advantage with stealth, but inquisitor is still great at range 3 defensively and doesn't allow your opponent the bonus range 3 green dice. Plus he target locks naturally and has an additional hp, with two shields instead of all hull. All these advantages plus he is cheaper and you can match fels price by adding a deadly missile. Fel does have ps and some dial advantages, but the inquisitor fits nicer in balanced squads

Its the offense really. RAC needs an ace to also put out damage. Soontir does not have TL, and if he is at range 3, that means range bonus to the one he is attacking plus autothrusters if its another ace. Inquisitor shuts all that down which helps the two ship list get damage through. The biggest reason to take Soontir is the PS9 so Fen Rau and such can't touch you, but if Rac has Vader, then Fenn going down in a ball of flames real quick anyhoo

I still don't understand why you take the Inquisitor. He can't escape/chase, has inferior PS, and lacks punch when close. Soontir is as good or better in every regard, especially when you man up and take targeting computer over stealth device.

Inquisitor can slowly follow, soontir tends to have issues with his high speed. At Range 3 the inquisitor is better on top is he simply cheaper and that one extra HP matters actually. So there are certain advantages. Lastly 1-Hard turns. Green of all things. They are both ships with a rather different focus. With hotshot rac? I rather would have the Inquisitor, he is better in clearing up behind RAC than Soontir is.

There are a few reasons

• Cheaper build cost (30 compared to 35)
• default 1 more hit point wit 50% coverage, whereas Soontir needs to spend 4 points to get same amount of health but only 25% shield coverage.
• Offensive action economy. Target lock plus evade, add in juke in the EPT and you got a heavy hitter
• Pilot ability neutralizes autothrusters

So if you look at Soontir he is more of a token agility tank. Expensive but will likely stick to the end of the round where he can shine. Inquisitor is more of a Soontir hunter. Got great stats and mobility to throw against other arc dodgers while being one himself. Good offensive buld but is not as tanky when dealing with jousters or turrets. (lack of focus + evade unless PTL TL and focus).

1 hour ago, Nyxen said:

Soontir is as good or better in every regard, especially when you man up and take targeting computer over stealth device.

That is a false statement. Soontir is objectively worse at range three than The Inquisitor is because Soontir's attacks grant the defender an additional green die and can trigger autothrusters while The Inquisitor's attacks do neither.

19 minutes ago, WWHSD said:

That is a false statement. Soontir is objectively worse at range three than The Inquisitor is because Soontir's attacks grant the defender an additional green die and can trigger autothrusters while The Inquisitor's attacks do neither.

Interceptor looks cooler XD.

In all seriousness, I really think it comes down to preference between the two. After recently returning to Soontir after flying Inquiz for a while, I forgot how nice it was to have a 4 dice range 1 attack. (I took Inquisitor to Regionals and he COULD NOT, NO MATTER WHAT, punch through X7 Defenders, other aces, etc)

I run Fel with TC, and I happen to like it better than SD. Not quite as tanky but you get more offensive output.

Inquisitor is more defensive and sneaky with his 1-green turn(awesome thing) and his sniperino ability. But as it was already said, it's down to preference. I like inquisitor better for more diverse action economy (tl, focus, evade) ibstead of focus focus evade (two focuses are nice, but usually tl is better), shields (so you can actually get hit once) and ability to punch at range 3 while staying untouchable here. I prefer his playstyle to soontir so much that even if their cost were the same, i would still pick inquisitor over him.

I think that SD Soontir is more durable IF you have Palpatine to fix the odd unlucky blank. Without Palps, it just takes one unlucky roll for Soontir to lose his SD and then it is downhill from there.

Inquisitor is 33% tougher and 2 of those are shields with the corresponding protection from Crits. Even with Prockets (in case of close encounters) he is still cheaper than Soontir.

The value of PS is hard to gauge. The PS9 big fish at the moment are mainly Dengar and Fenn. Dengar is often run with a significant initiative bid (particularly Dengaroo) so Soontir won't necessarily be able to arc dodge him. Fenn is more likely to be run at 100 points (or close) but ironically, the Inquisitor shooting from long range is much better at knocking out Fenn, even at lower PS since he negates Autothrusters and Fenn gets none of his bonuses at long range.

What is your RAC build? I would be tempted by Juking /x7 Maarek, particularly if your RAC includes Hotshot Copilot.

38 minutes ago, Karhedron said:

What is your RAC build? I would be tempted by Juking /x7 Maarek, particularly if your RAC includes Hotshot Copilot.

This is the build (with the Juking Maarek suggestion)

(100)

Rear Admiral Chiraneau (65) - VT-49 Decimator
Veteran Instincts (1), Hotshot Co-pilot (4), Gunner (5), Kylo Ren (3), Dauntless (2), Engine Upgrade (4)

Maarek Stele (35) - TIE Defender
Juke (2), TIE/x7 (-2)

Is this better than Inq? I could get in a 34pt procket Inq instead of Steele. I totally take the point of Juke's effectiveness after HotShot, but is PS7 a liability?

Inquisitor can equip Proton Rockets and still cost on par with Soontir

A lot of people mention the relative strengths of both pilots and for the most part, they're right. It's worth noting both have considerable weaknesses though, which is probably why they're used way less than they used to be.

Inquisitor's traditional weakness is his limited ability to escape killboxes. While being able to move at speed 1 is mostly an asset for a ship that wants to stay at maximum range, if the enemy are converging on him, he can't really flee too far unless he goes 4 straight which is not always an option. Furthermore while you can both barrel roll and boost in the same turn, this leaves you completely tokenless, so if you can't dodge all the arcs, you're gonna be defending with naked green dice. On top of that, unless you take prockets, there's literally no disadvantage for the enemy in closing up on Inquisitor because his attacks don't get any stronger while theirs do. Additionally only having 2 hull is likely to become a serious liability in the age of Kylo Ren. He's quite vulnerable to Slicer Tools as well, though thankfully they don't seem very common (probably because Inquisitor isn't).

Fel's weakness is lack of target lock (which can be fixed with a targeting computer, at the cost of an extra green die though, which is a tricky choice to make). He can escape kilboxes better and will always end his round with a focus, even if he has to reposition twice to escape (or chase). However he only has 3 hit points total and this makes him very vulnerable to Vader crew, bomber K-wings and basically anything that bypasses green dice (Oicunn effect, fanatical devotion, you name it).

In fact, in my area meta has become very unfriendly to low-hp aces recently, mostly because so many good players are very fond of Miranda with Sabine and a bomb loadout and some imperials (myself included) like to use Deathfire as well. That's why I haven't seen either Inquisitor or Soontir (especially Soontir) in quite a while. Defenders seem to have taken over simply because they can survive quite a bit of damage from bombs and are easier to fly to boot.

1 hour ago, Rolotamasi said:

This is the build (with the Juking Maarek suggestion)

(100)

Rear Admiral Chiraneau (65) - VT-49 Decimator
Veteran Instincts (1), Hotshot Co-pilot (4), Gunner (5), Kylo Ren (3), Dauntless (2), Engine Upgrade (4)

Maarek Stele (35) - TIE Defender
Juke (2), TIE/x7 (-2)

Is this better than Inq? I could get in a 34pt procket Inq instead of Steele. I totally take the point of Juke's effectiveness after HotShot, but is PS7 a liability?

I like the look of that build, I have run something pretty similar and it did very well indeed. PS7 is not too much of a liability as a lot you will probably be facing a lot of tri-Defender or Palp-defender lists which will normally have Vess and Ryad so you will out PS them anyway. Other popular ships to expect include Kanan/Biggs (PS5) and Dengaroo or Paratanni (usually including PS9 ships). This means that the drop from 8 to 7 will not hurt too much in a lot of common match-ups. Miranda (PS8) and Super-Dash (PS7) are issues but since they both typically pack turrets you will have a hard time arc-dodging them anyway.

Also you have an arc-dodging PS10 brick in the shape of RAC so hammering your opponent's highest PS ship is always an option (and a good one with HoCo Pilot).

Well for me he's a better companion to vessery he wants to TL anyway and you want to slow roll with him to take advantage of his ability.

Soontir is good but he has to get in close to dodge but the inquisitor can stay back and still get the same action economy.

36 minutes ago, Karhedron said:

I like the look of that build, I have run something pretty similar and it did very well indeed. PS7 is not too much of a liability as a lot you will probably be facing a lot of tri-Defender or Palp-defender lists which will normally have Vess and Ryad so you will out PS them anyway. Other popular ships to expect include Kanan/Biggs (PS5) and Dengaroo or Paratanni (usually including PS9 ships). This means that the drop from 8 to 7 will not hurt too much in a lot of common match-ups. Miranda (PS8) and Super-Dash (PS7) are issues but since they both typically pack turrets you will have a hard time arc-dodging them anyway.

Also you have an arc-dodging PS10 brick in the shape of RAC so hammering your opponent's highest PS ship is always an option (and a good one with HoCo Pilot).

So is the question not Soontir vs Inquisitor but instead which Defender? What d you think of Adapatability Brath or VI Maare, for the above mentioned PS concerns? I think Parratanni's PS9 is at least worth the consideration. I know RAC is 10, but he prob won't be there end game. But then again, how long does Fenn last against HotShot/Gunner? Could that extra 9 delete him before firing?

Ink is better because TLs.

Neither is actually terribly GOOD right now because Defenders are just better.

6 hours ago, Nyxen said:

I still don't understand why you take the Inquisitor. He can't escape/chase, has inferior PS, and lacks punch when close. Soontir is as good or better in every regard, especially when you man up and take targeting computer over stealth device.

Do not agree. Both have their use cases.

Some of what you say is true but:

inquisitor has more total HP and 2 shields and this is more resilient against Vader crew. This is especially relevant with the new HOtCop builds and perhaps more so if General Hun crew becomes more popular.

Inquisitor is cheaper than standard build soontir (stealth device).

denies auto thrusters and range 3 defender bonus.

42 minutes ago, thespaceinvader said:

Neither is actually terribly GOOD right now because Defenders are just better.

#f***X7

39 minutes ago, Rolotamasi said:

So is the question not Soontir vs Inquisitor but instead which Defender? What d you think of Adapatability Brath or VI Maare, for the above mentioned PS concerns? I think Parratanni's PS9 is at least worth the consideration. I know RAC is 10, but he prob won't be there end game. But then again, how long does Fenn last against HotShot/Gunner? Could that extra 9 delete him before firing?

When I run Decifender, I normally include Vader rather than Kylo for exactly this problem. Even if my dice go cold, I can guarantee I can eliminate a nuisance like Fenn with a maximum of 2 turns firing. Yes it comes at the cost of half my Decimator but it is at least a reliable solution to a problem that can otherwise be very tricky.

Dengaroo is normally PS9 with a significant bid so you would need PS10 to guarantee beating them. Paratanni often includes a 1 point bid, particularly if they want to abuse Ventress. This means that even PS9 Maarek at 99 points is not going to be guaranteed to win you the bid against Paratanni. The other problem is that without something to help force through damage like Juke or Predator, 3 red dice + Focus from a Defender isn't all that scary.

You are struggling because you are trying to do several things with the list and are running into your point limits. You have the Dauntless title to help ensure you can trigger Kylo, even if you bump. However Kylo works at Range 1-3 so there is a good chance you should be able to place ISYTDS on your primary target the turn before at long range. If PS is you primary concern then I would accept no substitutes for PS10. Drop Dauntless and take VI Brath for 2 PS10 ships.

The other option is to accept you cannot compete on PS with your whole squad. Swap out Kylo for Vader to give a brute-force solution to slippery aces and run Juking Maarek to maximise the synergy with HoCo Pilot.

I really like the 1 green turns on the Inqu and the missile slot, for me I can build him out with the title to be more of a scalpel then a blunt instrument. The raw damage found within the Tie Inter is always nice, though I think the ability of the inqu has more usage when different EPT's come out that will use the range 1 goodness. Also if your sitting in the back Swarm leader is such a great card to increase your output if your keeping a wingman out of the fight for a time.

I was also think A Score To Settle would be perfect on the inqu with proc/title/auto keeps him right at 31 which is outstanding for an ace.

10 minutes ago, Karhedron said:

Paratanni often includes a 1 point bid

It does? I suppose you could run it without the Title on Fenn, but I don't know if I've ever seen it that way, let alone "often".